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Old School 327 running hot

So the story I got from the owner was that the mounting boss for the starter was cracked and had been Jerryrigged fixed by his late brother. When the machine shop did the full tear down and inspection found the crack and deemed the block junk and supposedly found another “327” to build in its place.

While the 010 block could be a 68 327 or 69-79 350 the fact that the stamped suffix code indicates a later 350 seals it for me the engine is a garden variety 350. Which isn’t necessarily a bad thing but it’s not what he was told he was getting.

The general feeling here is we agree there isn’t enough flow. Upon further inspection it looked like the CVF pump was unique to the kit because it has a couple of extra mounting bosses for their brackets. But after doing some digging it matches up to any small block pump from an 80’s passenger car. Same bosses on it. So we’ve got one inbound and waiting on the owner to call us back to go over the details.

Meanwhile we will fuss with the ‘65 Malibu convertible behind it today. That car has been dormant for years and the guy wants us to get it going, fix leaks in the trans and a bunch of little stuff.

The ironic thing is the little 283 hasn’t run in years. We got it running this morning on the carb out guy rebuilt and it’s running off a 5gallon can and the engine isn’t running hot at all. Lifters are not all quite pumped up yet but it’s gotten quieter as it runs.
 
folkenheath said:
Nice car!

It seems as if the passenger side of the radiator is cold to the touch, it's not getting that coolant into the engine fast enough to cool it down. So either the pump is bad or there is some sort of restriction somewhere.


Based on the pictures it has to be this....

www.cvfracing.com

Black Chevy Small Block Serpentine Conversion - AC & Power Steering, Long Water Pump

Upgrade your engine with the Black Chevy Small Block Serpentine Conversion - AC & Power Steering, Long Water Pump from CVF Racing. Built for performance, precision fit, and classic style.
www.cvfracing.com www.cvfracing.com
Click to expand...
That is the kit on the car.
 
If he really wanted a 327 they could of used the 327 crank in the new block, not sure they went to that effort but it could be done. Personally I would rather have the extra stroke of the 350 (or even better a 383) unless he is in some racing class where the cubes are limited.

Hopefully you found a quality pump to try. May want to flush the block out while it's off see if you find anything?

I've also had brand new std thermostats not open correctly or all the way. Because of that I only buy the higher end high flow brass type if I run one.

iu
 
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Those are a better design....the open with the coolant flow....

Spent the money+ put them in the last two GM's....no more stuck thermostat in the side of the road.
 
folkenheath said:
If he really wanted a 327 they could of used the 327 crank in the new block, not sure they went to that effort but it could be done. Personally I would rather have the extra stroke of the 350 unless he is in some racing class where the cubes are limited.

Hopefully you found a quality pump to try. May want to flush the block out while it's off see if you find anything?

I've also had brand new std thermostats not open correctly or all the way. I only buy the higher end high flow brass type if I run one.

iu
Click to expand...

CT-BLAZER said:
Those are a better design....the open with the coolant flow....

Spent the money+ put them in the last two GM's....no more stuck thermostat in the side of the road.
Click to expand...
So the the want to have a 327 in the car is purely sentimental. The car came with a 327 when his Dad bought the car from the original owner in the early 70’s. The car was originally equipped with a 4-speed too. His dad did put a slush box in it in the 80’s so his wife could drive the car. But it was always a 327 and even though he changed everything else when this latest restoration was done the 327 was the link to the past with his dad.

As a sentiment nitwit myself I get it. I’m very hesitant to change the 327 in the Nomad because that’s what the car had as long as it’s been in the family. Unless it can’t be fixed I’ll keep it in there. Though the virgin 350 block I’ve got stashed is waiting in the wings if anything bad goes down.

When we put the radiator and t-stat in already the coolant we got out looked like we poured it out of a bottle. No sediment or rust.
 
ZooMad75 said:
So the the want to have a 327 in the car is purely sentimental. The car came with a 327 when his Dad bought the car from the original owner in the early 70’s. The car was originally equipped with a 4-speed too. His dad did put a slush box in it in the 80’s so his wife could drive the car. But it was always a 327 and even though he changed everything else when this latest restoration was done the 327 was the link to the past with his dad.

As a sentiment nitwit myself I get it. I’m very hesitant to change the 327 in the Nomad because that’s what the car had as long as it’s been in the family. Unless it can’t be fixed I’ll keep it in there. Though the virgin 350 block I’ve got stashed is waiting in the wings if anything bad goes down.

When we put the radiator and t-stat in already the coolant we got out looked like we poured it out of a bottle. No sediment or rust.
Click to expand...
That coolant can’t pick up sediment if it doesn’t move through the block!
:haha:
 
Bent77 said:
That coolant can’t pick up sediment if it doesn’t move through the block!
:haha:
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True fact. A smartassed fact but fact nonetheless.

The Elky owner called in a talked to one of the other guys who explained our findings. He was ok with the plan. He was surprised by the fact it’s actually a 350, but didn’t get to wound up over it. He’s probably going to simmer on that one for a while.

He just wants to be able to drive it. His wife is severely displeased with the car and the cost to restore it.

I will say this for what he’s told us he’s into it the car doesn’t present like that amount is into it. Last I heard he was $95k in so far. Full frame off, powder coated frame, full QA1 suspension with coil overs on all 4 corners, custom made wheels, shaved firewall, kindigit flush door handles and lots of body work. I can pick the paint apart as there are nibs and fisheyes found throughout. Trim was mangled on the back of the cab, weatherstrip adhesive is seen oozing out from the gasket along the back window. The fit between the upper front of the door and cowl is big enough I can stuff one of my sausage fingers into. It’s a nice car for sure but not a $95k type car. For that money the paint and body fit should be flawless. I shouldn’t be able to see light from the cab through a kick panel vent opening on the lower part of the firewall. Obviously the engine issue is a big problem and the interior sis kinda blah.

We just want to help the dude get the car driveable so at least he can enjoy it.
 
ZooMad75 said:
So the the want to have a 327 in the car is purely sentimental. The car came with a 327 when his Dad bought the car from the original owner in the early 70’s. The car was originally equipped with a 4-speed too. His dad did put a slush box in it in the 80’s so his wife could drive the car. But it was always a 327 and even though he changed everything else when this latest restoration was done the 327 was the link to the past with his dad.
Click to expand...

ZooMad75 said:
The Elky owner called in a talked to one of the other guys who explained our findings. He was ok with the plan. He was surprised by the fact it’s actually a 350, but didn’t get to wound up over it. He’s probably going to simmer on that one for a while.
Click to expand...

I get that, it should be what he wants.

My other point was, just because the block is a 350 block doesn't mean it's a 350, if the builder put the 327 crank in it from the junk block, it's still a 327, only way to know for sure is measure the stroke or find the crank number on the crank since they both have the same bore.
 
folkenheath said:
I get that, it should be what he wants.

My other point was, just because the block is a 350 block doesn't mean it's a 350, if the builder put the 327 crank in it from the junk block, it's still a 327, only way to know for sure is measure the stroke or find the crank number on the crank since they both have the same bore.
Click to expand...
True. Without confirming stroke it could be either. Though my money is on a 350. That’s purely speculation on my part for the shady details we’ve uncovered so far.

Seems to me if I was the one building the engine and found the cracked 327 block but had a solid 350 core block that would work I’d let the customer know and give the option to the customer of using the 350 block with his 327 crank to maintain the 327 spec or just build the 350 as a 350. I always inform and let the customer choose that way they are involved in the process and they understand why it was done that way. Nothing is a surprise at that point.

But that’s me.

The Elky owner only remembers the block was cracked and they found another 327 they could build in its place. If the builder did use a 350 block with his 327 crank he should have at least told him. It sounds like he didn’t.
 
ZooMad75 said:
The Elky owner only remembers the block was cracked and they found another 327 they could build in its place. If the builder did use a 350 block with his 327 crank he should have at least told him. It sounds like he didn’t.
Click to expand...
I agree 100%
 
This sounds like a crappy restoration shop.

Nibs, fisheyes in the paint....come on , it should have been blocked out + resprayed in a clean booth.

From A -Z their seems to be alot of issues that should not exist. . . . Sad crappy shops often get away with bad work. It almost seems you need the project constantly inspected &.bonded.
 
ZooMad75 said:
True. Without confirming stroke it could be either. Though my money is on a 350. That’s purely speculation on my part for the shady details we’ve uncovered so far.

Seems to me if I was the one building the engine and found the cracked 327 block but had a solid 350 core block that would work I’d let the customer know and give the option to the customer of using the 350 block with his 327 crank to maintain the 327 spec or just build the 350 as a 350. I always inform and let the customer choose that way they are involved in the process and they understand why it was done that way. Nothing is a surprise at that point.

But that’s me.

The Elky owner only remembers the block was cracked and they found another 327 they could build in its place. If the builder did use a 350 block with his 327 crank he should have at least told him. It sounds like he didn’t.
Click to expand...
To increase the odds it's a 350, the 66 327 wouldn't work in the 010 block, it would have been a small journal, assuming it was OEM engine for that El co
 
folkenheath said:
Nice car!

It seems as if the passenger side of the radiator is cold to the touch, it's not getting that coolant into the engine fast enough to cool it down. So either the pump is bad or there is some sort of restriction somewhere.


Based on the pictures it has to be this....

www.cvfracing.com

Black Chevy Small Block Serpentine Conversion - AC & Power Steering, Long Water Pump

Upgrade your engine with the Black Chevy Small Block Serpentine Conversion - AC & Power Steering, Long Water Pump from CVF Racing. Built for performance, precision fit, and classic style.
www.cvfracing.com www.cvfracing.com
Click to expand...
Wow that power steering is barely touched by the belt. That's definitely not enough belt wrap. Does the belt squeal while turning at a standstill?
 
So far as we’ve run it no belt squeal.

We got the pump on yesterday and so far the temp rise was much slower. In ten minutes the entire radiator was hot (no cool spots) and temp was stable at 180. We need to drive it but the cold temps predicted might skew results since we hit the high of 19 degrees today. But fingers crossed it looks like we are headed in the right direction.
 
We did a custom bracket for a power steering pump on my buddy's rig and it has about the same contact and it's been fine. We were worried about it when we first installed it.
 
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