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SBC in a 1953 Willys

handloader90

handloader90

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Hey fellas,

Somewhat Chevy related. Looking for some recommendations.

I've got a '53 Willys CJ3A. It currently has the 4 cylinder L134 "Go Devil" in it, every bit of 60 horses lol.

I'm planning on doing an engine swap and I'm having a hard time deciding between a Toyota 20R or 22R 4 cylinder or a 350 SBC.

I already have a running 350 SBC. I've found a running Yota 20R locally for $250 that I can pull out of the truck.

The 4 banger only has exhaust on one side of the engine vs. both sides on a SBC. Distributer on the front drivers side of the engine vs. back center on a SBC.

Transmission will either be a SM420 or SM465, I know where multiple of each tranny are for dirt cheap, transfer case will be a Jeep Dana 300.

The transmission I choose only depends on which transmission to t-case adapter will give me the shortest overall length. I know that a SM420 is 10.4" long and a SM465 is 12" long. I'll get on Novak and Advance Adapters and see who has the shortest adapter per application and come up with the shortest combo possible.

There is a company that makes a bellhousing adapter for Yota 20R/22R engines to Chevy transmissions so that is covered.

I know that if I go Yota/Chevy/Jeep everything will have an adapter but I'm thinking the Yota 4 banger may be the best option.

Can't use Toyota everything due to the length of the transmission... it would be ideal to not have to adapt anything but I need a rear driveshaft in this super short wheelbase Jeep.

Tell me what you would do.

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83ChevyK5Blazer said:
I would go 22r mostly because you shouldn't have to cut into the firewall to get it to fit. Plus it is a reliable engine.
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That's what I'm thinking. Seems like a much easier install... the body on this thing is in great shape and I wanna keep from cutting it up too badly. I know it will need some transmission hump work with the 420 or 465.
 
AV8TER said:
I'd go small block. A flat fender with 300+ horsepower is a kick in the pants!
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It would be badass, I'd be aiming more for bottom end with this thing though. Just gonna be a little rig to take up in the mountains and screw around with.
 
max 02 said:
I’m just here to be difficult...A small 4 cylinder diesel would be my pick!
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I've looked into that option too. A buddy was telling me that there were some good turbo-diesel VW engines but I'm not sure how I'd go about adapting one to the tranny that I'd like to use.

Another buddy recommended a Chevy Ecotec engine, said that the bellhousing off of a tranny that was in an S10 can be modded to mate the Ecotec to an older GM tranny. Haven't really looked into it that much though.

I read a build where a guy used a little Kubota diesel engine and it seemed pretty sick.
 
handloader90 said:
I've looked into that option too. A buddy was telling me that there were some good turbo-diesel VW engines but I'm not sure how I'd go about adapting one to the tranny that I'd like to use.

Another buddy recommended a Chevy Ecotec engine, said that the bellhousing off of a tranny that was in an S10 can be modded to mate the Ecotec to an older GM tranny. Haven't really looked into it that much though.

I read a build where a guy used a little Kubota diesel engine and it seemed pretty sick.
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Kubota, Isuzu ,VW, Thats what I was thinking....
 
I have a 4.3 in my Willys MB and its a tight fit but its not bad. I was considering a 22re but measurement wise they arent much smaller than a V engine since they are cross flow heads. I was also considering a kubota diesel but decided not to because of initial price. Considering what I have into my 4.3, I kind of wish I would have went with the kubota. I'm running a SM465 with Novak adapter to a Dana 18/20 hybrid

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TreeFarm said:
I have a 4.3 in my Willys MB and its a tight fit but its not bad. I was considering a 22re but measurement wise they arent much smaller than a V engine since they are cross flow heads. I was also considering a kubota diesel but decided not to because of initial price. Considering what I have into my 4.3, I kind of wish I would have went with the kubota. I'm running a SM465 with Novak adapter to a Dana 18/20 hybrid

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I've got a lot of questions for you lol.

How much of a rear driveshaft do you have?

How much lift and what size tires are you running?

I can find a front to back measurement on the 20R or 22R.

I've looked at the 4.3 option, it seems that the 4.3 and Buick Dauntless V6 are the most popular swaps in a Willy's.

I'm wondering now mucj longer from to rear a SBC is vs. the 4.3...

Would you have rather went SM420 for the lower 1st gear or are you pretty happy with the 465?
 
@TreeFarm I forgot to ask how you mated the SM465 to the 4.3?

SM465 bellhousing bolts right up or did you have to do anything?

Any special parts such as the flywheel, pilot bearing or clutch kit?
 
handloader90 said:
I've got a lot of questions for you lol.

How much of a rear driveshaft do you have?

My rear dive shaft at ride height is 21" but my rear axle is back 2" from stock.

How much lift and what size tires are you running?

Lift is pretty much -1 or -2" Im running stock YJ leafs and waggy d44s in spring under. The larger axle tube lowerd the ride height a bit and the yj springs are pretty similar to stock. Its on 37x12.5r15 Pitbull rockers.. Wheel base has been streched 3" in the front and 2" in the rear, though I am considering pushing the rear back farther later on.

I can find a front to back measurement on the 20R or 22R.

I've looked at the 4.3 option, it seems that the 4.3 and Buick Dauntless V6 are the most popular swaps in a Willy's. My opinion the 4.3 is a better option as it has more common parts these days. it uses SBC accessories and bell housing pattern. the EFI is easy to wire up and adapt or there are oem and aftermarket manifolds for carb swap. Mine is a 2006 vortec engine with an edelbrock manifold, holey truck avenger, ebay distributor, and sanderson headers. I converted it to v belt with a sbc long water pump. running a XJ power steering pump and a regular old gm alternator. The buick engine on the other hand was an oem option. Just not a modern or smooth one.

I'm wondering now mucj longer from to rear a SBC is vs. the 4.3...
I just measured my sbc and the 4.3. From crank pulley to bellhousing mating surface the sbc is 28" and the 4.3 is 23". Obviously there are different pulley options but both of my engines are runnign long water pumps and v belt set ups.

Would you have rather went SM420 for the lower 1st gear or are you pretty happy with the 465?
the 420 does not mate up well with passenger drop transfer cases and short adapter. the 420 has a huge reverse hump on that side that interferes with the front output joint. this requires a longer adapter to make clearance. if you want a short setup use the 465, novaks 465 to 18/20 adapter is 1" long.
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as far as the sm465 swap. The 4.3 shares the same gm bellhousing and they came with manual trans from the factory. I am using a stock 4.3 flywheel, novak adapter pilot bushing for my late model large bore crank. They even use the same clutch as the older trucks. You just have to play with throw out bearings and forks to make your application happy. I have both an oem hyd and mechanical bellhousing. Im not sure what one Ill use yet. now that I think of it, you may be able to use a LS2 pilot bearing since that is what I used on the 5.3 swap. It fits the large bore crank and the 465 input shaft
 
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I'd stay w/ one of the smaller engines, too. Those Jeeps weren't designed to handle the weight or tq of a sbc. Plus, they're light enough that you don't need all that power. One of the small diesels would be a cool swap.
 
I had 68 CJ5 Buick odd fire V6 from factory, 3 speed, 18 t case, 4.89 rear and 4.88 front/ I added a Holley four barrel. Muncie rock crusher. warn over drive and built a custom set of equal length inside the frame headers with dual turbo mufflers. I kept the tank under the seat and added the later model CJ 5 rear tank. Had 33" tires. You put in 4 low, warn in low, first gear, let the clutch out hop out and watch it crawl up a steep incline. It was fun to watch the look on peoples faces as they tried to figure out what motor was in it. Wish I still had it.
 
TreeFarm said:
as far as the sm465 swap. The 4.3 shares the same gm bellhousing and they came with manual trans from the factory. I am using a stock 4.3 flywheel, novak adapter pilot bushing for my late model large bore crank. They even use the same clutch as the older trucks. You just have to play with throw out bearings and forks to make your application happy. I have both an oem hyd and mechanical bellhousing. Im not sure what one Ill use yet. now that I think of it, you may be able to use a LS2 pilot bearing since that is what I used on the 5.3 swap. It fits the large bore crank and the 465 input shaft
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That's some great info man! I appreciate you taking the time to write it all out.
 
@TreeFarm just to clarify.

You can use ALL front accessories off of a regular SBC on the front of a 4.3?

Say I want to use a SBC serpentine drive up front, it will all bolt up? Even the later 4.3 engines such as the '06 model that you have?

5" is a helluva lot of length to work with in one of these little flatties!
 
handloader90 said:
@TreeFarm just to clarify.

You can use ALL front accessories off of a regular SBC on the front of a 4.3?

Say I want to use a SBC serpentine drive up front, it will all bolt up? Even the later 4.3 engines such as the '06 model that you have?

5" is a helluva lot of length to work with in one of these little flatties!
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Id say 90% of the 4.3s you will find come with serp setups. Only the really old ones and marine ones used v belts.

Think of the 4.3 as a sbc with two cylinders cut off. The bolts holes in the heads and blocks are the same as the SBC. The old 4.3 with the metal timing cover can use short or long water pumps, the plastic timing cover models have to use a long water pump to clear the cover. Just fyi if you pick up a vortec head model and use a different water pump you need to run a coolant bypass either via a heater or by just plumbing it straight into the manifold like I did. Vortec blocks are not drilled for the internal coolant bypass below the water pump port like the older engines are. There are really old 80s model 4.3s that still had provisions for mechanical fuel pumps in the block, later models do not. Starters and motor mounts are also the same. the 4.3 uses the larger 168t fly wheel so just get a starter that fits that. They came from the factory with gear reduction mini starters though. One word of caution. there is a mix of SAE and metric bolts. The starter bolts are one prime example of make sure you have the correct bolt or things will go bad.

My engine has sbc long water pump, sbc crank and water pump pulleys, summit sbc alternator bracket, sbc KRC head mount for GM type 2 or Saginaw tc power steering pumps.

This link has tons and tons of info.
http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/V6_Chevy_90_degree_engines
 
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