Welders....ancient acetylene bottle?

[dyeager535]

I bought a B acetylene bottle off Craigslist for $20. Couldn't test the fill, but I figured for $20 it was worth the risk.

I noticed the tag that looks like a data plate, and cast-in letters on the side, plus the offset valve.

What little research I did seems to indicate the valve is offset on this tank because it was for when they were used on their side, which was a long time ago, when they were mounted in vehicles for headlights.

I put a regulator on it, and it's half full. My question is, does a bottle like this have any value to anyone outside of just being an acetylene tank? Like collectors or someone? Externally it is in excellent shape, just a bit discolored. The data label looks like it might have been glued on with something clear, but looks like it could be easily removed. Still has a "full" tag wired to the valve, and it has a modern (?) "Acetylene" adhesive label on it, and I don't think it was last filled earlier than the mid 80's (I think the date the tag was made is '86?)

I'd hate to use the acetylene and just swap it out, if there is demand for them for restorations or something like that.

 

[dhcomp]

Not going to lie. An acetylene bottle that age would make me nervous for anything but show....

 

[dyeager535]

Whys that? I don't know a whole lot about gas welding, but I believe PSI on "hobby" Acetylene tanks is 300, Oxygen is ~2500. The oxygen tank I had to turn in (not owned) had a 1941 stamp on it, and I've heard of others dated as far back as 1917, recently.

Not sure what kind of testing acetylene bottles go through in their life, but oxygen is a regular hydrostatic test every 5 or ten years. If it passes, it goes back in service. This tank is in externally excellent shape. Some of these old Prest-o-lite tanks even had a gauge on the bottom of them, but I'm guessing this one doesn't. But I'll look when I empty it.

I was surprised to hear these tanks last that long though either.

 

[ryoken]

I do know your not supposed to lay acy's on there side...

imo, it's probably scrap, or worthless trade-in material... I can't imagine a collectors market for something like that, but i could be wrong..

the reason i don't f*ck around with used/old bottles anymore is they are useless when empty.... most gas companies wont fill other bottles without recertifying them... seen it many a time.. ya gotta find a reputable gas company, get their bottle and use them for your refills in my experience...

 

[dyeager535]

Reason I think this one MIGHT be valuable to the right person is because the valve is offset. I

Haven't had to deal with it yet, but my understanding is that if a tank is outside its hydro date, you pay something like $40. At least here you don't get your old tank back, so they simply charge you the test fee, cost of fill, and give you another tank.

If the tank is a "lease" tank, it remains the property of the company that owns it. I just dealt with that (thus why the craigslist tank) as my Dad had good sized oxygen and acetylene tanks that he said they wouldn't fill back in the day. Loaded them up, took them to my local dealer, the guy said "this one is ours". Company not in business, but out here, I think two companies own just about everyone now, so it was acquired in the past. They took the tank, but wouldn't fill it. Went to a third party vendor, they wouldn't fill the acetylene tank as it wasn't theirs either. Told me who to take it to, and they wouldn't fill it either. They grudgingly took it from me (what am I going to do with an empty tank I can't get filled?) but back to square one of having no spares.

The small bottles are almost universally "owner" ones that there will be no hassle filling. At $160 for a new tank and fill, $20 for a half full tank was still worth it. If I get dinged $40 for a hydro and ~$40 for a fill (no idea what that costs...yet) I'm still ahead.

Other than having the "Prest-O-Lite" stylistically welded(?) into the tank, this is how mine looks http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/50893/56635.jpg Apparently model t's take these things, and offset valve was for that use.

 

[ryoken]

I decided to nut up when I got my new welder and buy my 75/25 bottle.... my guys cool.. he'll upgrade the size at cost... i'm running a 60 cf, but i could upgrade to an 80 for like $20 or something...

he also has an awesome deal on a refurb torch set up that I'd really like to get in on at some point.. rebuilt victor, new hoses and regs, cart, like a 60 oxy and 40 acy for $350

 

[cybrfire]

I have alot of bottles in the shop and don't own any of them. Ain't worth the headache.

 

[ryoken]

as a biz, the leasing may be preferable...

 

[dyeager535]

as a biz, the leasing may be preferable...

I am sure once I'm done with this project, the bottle tests will expire before I empty them. I have very little use for oxy-acetylene now (although I'm sure brazing and what not will come) so as long as I have bottles that have gas in them, I'm good.

I would think owning tanks as a business would be worth it more if you were exchanging them all the time, then you would never have to worry about testing, as when they exchange tanks, they are always going to have a valid hydro. People get into trouble I suspect when they have tanks that never use them. Then the two or three times in life you fill them, it costs you for the test and fill. Probably a good idea to let buddies use and fill them then. I just remembered I had to fill my MIG bottle a few months back, no hassle. One for one, pay the cost of fill, out the door.

I never looked at the leasing cost though, to know if that is a good way to do it. I would assume as a lease, if the tank sits for five years (like my MIG bottle), you aren't coming out ahead.

 

[Joe Blaze]

Did it look something like this?

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/156002.html

 

[dyeager535]

Physical shape, yes. But the one I have appears to be galvanized (same color as a SCUBA tank) as it has no rust whatsoever on it. Not to mention there is no label like that. I actually asked the question on the Model T forum as that seems to be the most active, and was told that style bottle was made up until the 30's at least. The only date I can find on it is '46. There are some other stampings, but apparently acetylene tanks only get a visual, so that may explain why no more like Oxygen bottles would have by now.

I was wrong before, apparently acetylene bottles only get 225PSI, which varies a bit by temp.

Funny, nowadays it's an absolute no-no to use acetylene bottles on their side, but that is exactly how they were used before sealed beam headlights.

Edit: Called the welding place, they said these are not uncommon, so doesn't sound like it's rare, and would be needed by a vehicle restorer, which is what I expected, if anything.

 

[dyeager535]

Just as a close out on this one, posted a for sale ad on the horseless carriage association website, guy that was going to be in town needed it, ended up trading me a complete oxy/acetylene setup with an MC Acetylene bottle and 20CF Ocygen bottle, Victor gauges/torch, hose, and plastic holder, straight across.

Glad he was happy with it, and I get something that will get me through in a pinch if I'm working on something. Plus doesn't take a ton of room, and easy to move around.

 

[ryoken]

wow, so it had some value then.. cool...

 

[dyeager535]

He said he should be able to get 90 hours of light out of a half tank, so even if he can't refill it, that's a decent amount of driving for a 1914 vehicle!

 

[MJB774X]

acetylene tanks have other material inside (charcoal, wood, honeycomb...) to make help stabilize the acetylene, if the stuff inside was damaged, that tank could explode from a slight movement or shock, acetylene is self explosive and unstable over 15 psi. be careful

 

[dyeager535]

The old tanks had asbestos in them, the newer ones I can't recall the material. "The inner porous mass in every acetylene cylinder is an environmentally friendly formula of calcium silicate".

You are correct, if the acetone has been drained off, it could be a bad deal. I *think* they weigh the cylinders to make sure the acetone is still in there on the refill.