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1-ton brake caliper question. (Now regarding Master Cylinder)

colbystephens

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Edit: I think I may need a new Master Cylinder. See post 4.

I have a Dodge Dana 60 out of a '91 truck. I was talking to a mechanic about my soft pedal feel, and he suggested that the system isn't designed to have enough fluid movement for my front end. I doubt it. I've never heard anything about that w/ a Dodge 60 swap.

So, to confirm, a Dodge 60 caliper should work fine on my Blazer, right?
 
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there the same calipers on my chevy 60...You probably have a 1/2 ton master cylinder, my buddy's 89 k5 had a soft petal after the one ton swap, he can't figure it out either.
 
No hydroboost. I'm sure I have a 1/2 ton master cylinder - at least the stock Blazer one. So you're saying I need a new Master Cylinder? :( I figured because the stock one worked with my 3/4 ton swap, it would work with this, but makes sense I might need a new master cylinder. What should I use?

Will this work: http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/C...101984+50030+2030036+26332&Ar=AND(P_RecType:A)

Says it'll fit up to a '91 Chevy V3500. Will it mate up to my Blazer?
 
If you have the hydroboost setup from a diesel, it would work the best. I can't see your link. I have the vacuum setup from a camper special 79 3/4 ton and it works great for me. How bad are the brakes? Can you stop the truck in a safe manner?

Im not sure if it will bolt up to a blazer being from a v3500, ive only ever seen hydroboost in those trucks.
 
I don't have a diesel in my '90, and I'm not going to get the hydroboost out of the diesel truck, as I'm selling it complete to someone. I do have some brake, it's just REALLY spongey. I can drive it, though I won't drive it in traffic right now. I've driven it about a total of a mile or so.
 
It appears that the 1-ton MC to have the same connection as the Blazer model that I looked up on the NAPA site. Additionally, the Blazer MC bore is 1.125" and the 1-ton truck is 1.3125". I'm suspecting that this is the issue.

Finally, here's a great link of indicating that the swap WILL work and WILL help, though it also indicates that it may not be completely necessary - but that it WILL be the best thing for me to do. This is my "do it once, do it right this time" build. :D
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-602339.html
 
OK, you might need a new MC, but maybe not. Here is the situation. If that were a single chamber MC, and you were hooked to only the front brakes, then it would be obvious what the problem was.
Hydraulic fluid is not compressible. If the calipers needed 1 ounce of fluid for full travel, and your MC put out 2 ounces at full stroke, then your pedal would go down half way.
If the situation were reversed, then the pedal would go down all the way and the car would not stop.
But, in either situation there would be no sponginess.

But, in this case, you have a dual system. There are two pistons in the MC, with springs between them. Its possible that the rear system piston is stopping its travel when the rear brakes start working, but the front system piston is still being moved by the spring which is the spongy part you feel.

I did not explain that very well.

If so, then you will need the bigger MC. Just remember that a bigger MC normally causes a harder pedal. But, in this case, the calipers are larger also, so it may be harder than it is now, but not abnormally hard. Of course, the brakes are boosted, so you might not notice any difference.

But, if you have access to a power bleeder, or the urge to build one, I would power bleed the brakes first.
An air bubble in a high spot in a line can stay there no matter how many times you bleed it with the MC.
If the volume of the fluid in one stroke is not enough to push that bubble past the end of the high spot, it can move back up while you are closing the bleeder, letting the pedal back up and then going again.
In which case, it just moved up and down and never goes out.

I have seen more than one system that had had gallons of fluid bled through it that only lost the spongy after a power bleed.

BTW, if your MC was more than a couple of years old, and you bled the system by opening a bleeder and letting the pedal go all the way to the floor, odds are you need a new MC anyway.
After a couple of years or more of driving with the piston going back and forth in the same part of the bore, crud and rust will build up in the unused part.
When you shove the piston where no piston has gone before, you scar the heck out of the rubber seals and it goes bad shortly.

Also, I assume that the calipers are not upside down. On many of those axles, you can put the calipers on the opposite sides.
They fit and work just fine, except that the bleeder screws are on the bottom. You will never get all the air out that way, unless you turn the truck upside down. Not necessary an unlikely event with this bunch...........
 
Colby, you DO NOT need to change master cylinders. Sounds to me like you still have air in the system. Sometimes it can be hard to remove all the air from the front brakes so what I like to do is remove the caliper from it's mount and stick a piece of wood between the pads and then hold the caliper in such a position so that the bleeder screw is 100% pointed straight up then have a helper pump the pedal while you crack the bleeder screw and bleed the caliper.
 
Thanks for that info. I appreciate it! I know the calipers are on correctly, as there's only one way to install the calipers on a Dodge 60. :D I already picked up a new MC, so I'll start there. Whatever the case, it's a cheap replacement, and now I know it's new. :D Truck has 200100 miles on it, so I figure the more new parts, the better. ;) I doubt if the fluid on this truck was EVER changed. :doah: That sh!t was like molasses. :haha:
 
Colby, I know the calipers will only go on one way but sometimes depending on spring lift and amount of degree shims on front springs and also depending on how level the surface is you're working on the bleeder screws may not be pointing 100% straight up which will allow a pocket of air to NEVER be able to bled out. Sometimes you can rap on the caliper with a soft hammer and get the air pocket to move around near the bleeder so you can get it out. I had this same issue with my rig when I swapped in my D60 and did exactly as i'm telling you and fixed the issue right away.
 
i have an 80 K20 that I also swaped in a '79 Dodge dana 60 front. My brakes were awsome with my dana 44 front, supper sensitive. Once I put in the 60 front, lost some of that firm/sensitive feel. But my brakes worked. I'm running a rear disk kit on my 14bolt, i have hydroboost out of a diesel, and a (corvette) MC. But all these upgrades I had before the 60 swap. Those 60 calipers have the bleeder right next to where the brakeline bolts in. Just a bad design in placement. I agree with others, bleed the heck out of your brakes. It worked for me. good luck.
 
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