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150 miles, 4Hi, help.

Fordum

Fordum

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Just got a call from Baitfish1. He came over and spent the weekend deer hunting at my place. Left this morning headed home.
2015 Nissan 4wd pickup. Most of the trip was on I10 at speed.
Noticed the truck acted squirrelly when he tried to turn into the driveway. Discovered he drove the entire distance, about 150 miles, in 4Hi.
I talked him through getting it to shift by backing up with the control knob in 2Hi until it clunked. He wanted to know what to do next.
I don't have much of a clue. He is totally non-mechanical. In fact, he has the almost magical ability to suck the mechanical ability of otherwise good wrenchers just by standing close by.

I suggested that he take it to a shop and get the transfer case lube changed, and the U-Joints checked for looseness.
Also park it on dry concrete tonight and look for leaks tomorrow.

I have had this conversation with folks here before. Running the kind of hardware you run, 60's or Rockwells, 203 or 205 cases, and 1440 U-Joints, you are not bothered too much about running in 4Hi on pavement.
All it causes with yours is some tire scrub.
But I have seen factory aluminum transfer cases grenade at boat ramps when the driver put it in 4Hi to pull up a slick ramp, then left it in when he made a sharp turn on dry pavement.

Not sure what Nissan uses for a transfer case, but I'll bet its not in the 205 class. He is running standard size tires, so that had to help.
The whole truck is stock, no lift or oversize tires.

Anybody got any ideas about suggestions to tell the poor guy? If I had the truck over here, I would crawl under and look for cracks, mount damage, and probably change the fluid in both axles and the transfer case just for fun.
To add to the fun, he is scheduled to drive it over here next weekend and haul his 25 foot camper to our hunting camp with it.
Anybody know what kind of running gear it has? I don't think I have ever been under it.

All suggestions welcome.
 
Generally the fuse in the system is the tires, they slip. On the highway there is little to no mismatch between front and rear. As long as the T-case was full of fluid I think it'll be just fine.
 
So where's the problem? There's nothing wrong with driving in 4hi unless it has some form of full locker up front which would then just make it hard to make turns while on pavement. The only thing that's bad will be the wasted fuel mileage and the slight extra amount of wear on the front end stuff like axle shaft joints and front driveshaft u-joints.
 
4X4HIGH said:
So where's the problem? There's nothing wrong with driving in 4hi unless it has some form of full locker up front which would then just make it hard to make turns while on pavement. The only thing that's bad will be the wasted fuel mileage and the slight extra amount of wear on the front end stuff like axle shaft joints and front driveshaft u-joints.
Click to expand...

because the t case is locked, not allowing the front and rear wheels to spin at different rates. that causes binding between the front and rear axles putting stress on all the components. Probably nothing wrong with it but there is the chance for the binding to pop something.
 
Even though the t-case is splitting torque 50/50 driving on dry pavement at highway speed, like others have said as long as the t-case was full and the tires all the same size it shouldn't have hurt itself. If it was going to have a problem it would have done it well before he covered 150 miles.

What I've seen is if one is driven with say a different size tire like a spare on it then all hell's going to cut loose in under 10 miles. Seen a Colorado driven that way with the spare on the front. Cooked the front diff in under 10 miles. Fluid overheated and puked all the way to the end of the vent inside the engine compartment spraying gear oil all over like a garden sprinkler.
 
TreeFarm said:
because the t case is locked, not allowing the front and rear wheels to spin at different rates. that causes binding between the front and rear axles putting stress on all the components. Probably nothing wrong with it but there is the chance for the binding to pop something.
Click to expand...

Yep, that is what has me concerned. I suppose it would be possible to carefully adjust the air in a truck's tires and do careful measuring to get the exact same rolling diameter on all four tires, and drive with no binding as long as you went perfectly straight.
But, no normal truck is going to be that close, and it all goes out the window when you make the slightest turn.
And I have no idea what Nissan uses in their drivetrain. I don't even know how they lock the front axle. Vacuum hubs? Some kind of auto hubs? Or electric shift axle sleeve like Chevy does on their trucks now.
I remember many years ago, telling the story here about my pulling up on a paved road out of a long mud road. I'm running Dana 44 front, NP205 transfer, and Ford 10.25 inch rear. Plus a C6 auto tranny.
I started down the road, and the truck started bogging down, the transfer case shift lever started moving in the floorboard, and the truck basically almost ground to a halt.
I'm quite sure I could have given it more gas, and the 12.50/33s would have started to slip.
But I took my foot off the gas to see what was wrong. As soon as I did, the truck stopped right where it was. Then I backed up until the drivetrain unbound and I was able to shift it out.
Several people here posted asking what was wrong with my truck, since they could drive on dry pavement in 4Hi with no problem.

But, since I have seen two transfer cases shatter on boat ramps personally, and had a friend of mine destroy his also, I tend to take the warning that the truck makers put on the 4WD instructions, which say do not operate on dry hard surface roads in 4WD.
I'll do some more research and see what the trucks are made of. And try to get the fluids changed.
If I find out something new, I'll post back here. Thanks for the comments.
 
I have ran many 4x4s In 4 high at hwy speeds for lots of miles,Toyota’s And Chev’s it will be fine.
 
My NP208 doesn't like being in 4wd with locked hubs on dry pavement--the front tires scrub and you can feel it bind up on any turns,feels like it has a lot of rolling resistance too--let off the throttle,it'll slow down pretty fast without touching the brakes..

I know something is amiss in that t-case because in 2wd ,it still sends power to the front shaft,I can just lock the hubs in 2wd and all 4 wheels get power,yet low range and neutral work OK,and I have tried adjusting the shift linkage--I've ran it that way with the hubs unlocked since I got it in 2003,over 10,000 miles..
In that time I've only had to replace one front axle u-joint due to it rusting and losing needles..the u-joints in the front shaft still feel tight too..
I've heard full time 4x4's actually have the u-joints last longer than those with locking hubs,it is better for them to be spinning than standing still it seems..

My 205's I had would give that binding up feeling on dry pavement in 4 Hi too,but those could be shifted freely between 2 Hi and 4 Hi while moving,once you got the hang of it..I only used 4wd for street driving if the roads had some ice & snow,otherwise it always felt like you'd risk breaking something..I had the hubs "pop" and unlock for a second during turns when the binding felt the worst..

I don't know what a newer Nissan truck uses for a transfer case,but I've seen the transmission/transfer case from a 2000 something Pathfinder,that looked massive in comparison to the vehicle it was propelling..
I'd guess if no fluid boiled out of the T-case and no unusual noises are heard now,that no damage was done..probably not good for it either though..
 
Really should not be any concern. I spent many years as a project engineer running powertrain durability testing for a large auto manufacturer. We would put 30,000 miles on a vehicle in 3 months (operation ran 24/7) and on 4wd vehicles half of those miles were in 4Hi......all on paved surfaces. Stop and starts, 90 mph runs for 15 miles at a time, grade climbs, figure-8's, etc... All vehicles were run loaded, including duallys with a couple thousand pounds in the bed. It was very rare to see any failures specifically caused by running in 4wd on pavement.

With that said just put the truck back in 2wd and continue to drive it like you always had. I wouldn't even bother having a shop look at it or change in fluids.
 
Completely different set up but.....
I just recently bought a '78 K5. Had a friend drive it from Arizona to Central Texas. He made the first 400 miles with it in hi lock. Idiot! Important to note it has a np203 with the part time shaft conversion. Axles weren't locked so it wasn't putting power to the tires but it was turning the Detroit up front. I can't quite put 2+2 together in my head on this but everything overheated. I lucky had a rebuilt th350 sitting in my shop to replace the one he absolutely fried. The pump on the old th350 is discolored from the heat it endured. Changed all the fluids. Motor oil seemed fried too but it was synthetic royal purple. Maybe it was supposed to smell like it did? I replaced it with the real stuff. Transfer case oil seemed fine but it got replaced. So I'm thinking his real concern should be his trany. Guess if he is planning to tow something soon he will find out if anything got burned up.
 
tenderfoot said:
Completely different set up but.....
I just recently bought a '78 K5. Had a friend drive it from Arizona to Central Texas. He made the first 400 miles with it in hi lock. Idiot! Important to note it has a np203 with the part time shaft conversion. Axles weren't locked so it wasn't putting power to the tires but it was turning the Detroit up front. I can't quite put 2+2 together in my head on this but everything overheated. I lucky had a rebuilt th350 sitting in my shop to replace the one he absolutely fried. The pump on the old th350 is discolored from the heat it endured. Changed all the fluids. Motor oil seemed fried too but it was synthetic royal purple. Maybe it was supposed to smell like it did? I replaced it with the real stuff. Transfer case oil seemed fine but it got replaced. So I'm thinking his real concern should be his trany. Guess if he is planning to tow something soon he will find out if anything got burned up.
Click to expand...
From what I know,if the hubs were not engaged,that should not have happened,all those full time 4wd operates like that,
 
As an update, Baitfish1 came over in the truck on Friday. I rode in it that evening, heard no strange noises or vibrations.
Then, this morning, we hooked it to his 25 foot camper trailer and hauled it the 50 miles to my hunting camp.
And, as I write this, he is headed home after hunting some locally. With no obvious problems.
I think, while it might have shortened the life of something, I don't think it did any serious damage.

Now, when he comes over next weekend to stay at the camp, I am going to have to get out and adjust the "top hat" emergency brake. Since its a stick shift, he uses the hand brake a lot, and has managed to drive off with it applied a few times.
He is having to pull the handle higher and higher. Pretty soon its not going to hold. From research I have done, there is a hole in the rotor through which you can adjust the star wheel. It looks fairly small, hopefully its large enough for me to inspect the thickness of the shoes.

A set of shoes and a hardware kit are fairly cheap on Rock Auto, but its been so long since I have done a set of drums, I don't know where any of my old spring tools are.
And from some of the pictures I have seen, it looks like it might be a bit of a pain working around the axle flange. Especially since I will be doing it in the swamp.
 
Change the oil and make sure it isn’t making any funny noises. I dove 175mi with my hubs locked once. Driveline and t-case were/still are fine.
 
I knew a np241 once that didn't like being drop shifted into 4lo at 60 mph on the highway. It had a problem keeping fluid after that but the internals were easy to inspect..didn't even have to get under the truck
 
Fordum will soon experience the joy of replacing those miniature
E brake shoes..

I haven't had the pleasure myself yet (hope I never have to)--but I've watched my friend wrestle with getting the shoes and the springs and cable installed more than once,and a few times its taken up to an hour...doing regular full sized brake shoes is a cake walk in comparison..
 
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