2.5 ton ideas?

[fallguy]

Alright fellas i have a little dillema.... I recently sold my axles/tires/wheels off of my 84 longbed 3/4 ton. I have a D60 to build up but no rear. Got a quote on a fully built newer model 14 bolt to go with the front, quote was good I waited a little to get the cash & now the core is gone

So now I have been scratching my head thinking. Would it be cheaper to build a front steer/fixed rear set of rockwells or continue with my current plan D60 front 14bolt rear? I would obviously sell the D60 if I go the rockwell way.

Brakes are my big ? on the rockwells, I would like to drive it on the street occasionly but mainly trails. So I was thinking the ouverson super 8 kit but its a little pricey.

If I go D60/14 Bolt I'm expecting to spend around 6K little more than I would like to but by the time Find a rear, gears, locker, disk brakes, truss. Then build up the front that I have wich will need single wheel hubs, knuckles, steering arms, gears, lockers(5.38 gears for 42-46" range tires) I expect to be in that range.

Do you think I could build or buy a set of rockwells for close? I've found some for around 1400 for the set, then i would need to get brakes, steering, etc...

Who is running the Roks? Would you recommend them to me or should I stick with my original plan? How bad is the install on a truck like mine?

Like I said, I will drive it on the street every now & then so I think pinion mounted brakes is a no no. Let me know if you need more info, sorry for the long thread

 

[blazinzuk]

what size tires? That is a big question.

rigs that use rock and no rear steer need about 125 ft to turn a circle in. I am not kidding about that, they don't turn worth a dang.

Your right pinion brakes are not good on the street.

I have actually never done a normal steering on a rock just full hydro, but you will get some weird characteristics from a rock.

 

[dhcomp]

No way rocks end up cheaper. Especially if you are building $6k worth of 1 tons, you'll spend 10K to build Rocks.

Stay the course. And how are you going to spend $6k? You can normally buy NOS 1 tons way cheaper than that...and just spend money upgrading rather than rebuilding.

 

[big dan]

rigs that use rock and no rear steer need about 125 ft to turn a circle in. I am not kidding about that, they don't turn worth a dang.
quote]

sorry for the highjack but could you elaborate on the reasoning behind this?

 

[imiceman44]

rigs that use rock and no rear steer need about 125 ft to turn a circle in. I am not kidding about that, they don't turn worth a dang.
quote]

sorry for the highjack but could you elaborate on the reasoning behind this?

Turning radius is very big, i don't know if it's the knuckle design that limits it or the fact they run such big tires that the tire hits the frame before it can turn enough.
That is why people started to run steering rears to double the turning and cut the radius in almost half.

But I will elaborate on something else too:
Before you worry about the cost, you need to realize that the rocks have that big chunk that happens to share the space with your engine so your lift will be so big that you are going to need a ladder to get in. Unless you move your axles forward of the engine with 3 or 4 link suspension.

 

[blazinzuk]

Just on experience, I have put rocks under 3 rigs and wheeled with quite a few, the guys with only front steer have issues. The rear steer guys can turn in their owm length if they are built right

 

[big dan]

Ive been around a few rigs with rocks but they all had rear steer. never would have thought they had a larger than normal turning radius without it.

oh well thanks for the info

 

[nvrenuf]

The Super 8 kit is crazy expensive. If you decide to run steering axles, Mad Mac on Pirate offers an 8 lug conversion using 14 bolt hubs but it only works for steering axles because he machines down the removable spindles.

I see you're in Tx so it's a coin toss as to this truck being a crawler or mud toy but iceman's right, you'll need a fair amount of lift to clear the front diff.

I believe Ouverson offers 4.10's if the 6.72's are too deep (probably not since you mentioned 42-46" range tires).

 

[sweetk30]

watch out on mad mac from what i hear these days . few guys and 1 member here had huge delivery problems and lots of b/s storys to go with it.

my stuff was slow to get to me also year or so ago. but thank god i did get it.

 

[fallguy]

No way rocks end up cheaper. Especially if you are building $6k worth of 1 tons, you'll spend 10K to build Rocks.

Stay the course. And how are you going to spend $6k? You can normally buy NOS 1 tons way cheaper than that...and just spend money upgrading rather than rebuilding.

The 6K figure came from spending around 2600 on the fully built rear (wich is not a problem because I have the cash from selling my old stuff). Then figuring around 3 to 4K to build the 60.

 

[fallguy]

The Super 8 kit is crazy expensive. If you decide to run steering axles, Mad Mac on Pirate offers an 8 lug conversion using 14 bolt hubs but it only works for steering axles because he machines down the removable spindles.

I see you're in Tx so it's a coin toss as to this truck being a crawler or mud toy but iceman's right, you'll need a fair amount of lift to clear the front diff.

I believe Ouverson offers 4.10's if the 6.72's are too deep (probably not since you mentioned 42-46" range tires).

The truck already has a well engineered stupid high lift , but I am heavily considering lowering it back down. I have too much money invested in this truck for it not to be practical.

 

[MTBLAZER89]

The 6K figure came from spending around 2600 on the fully built rear (wich is not a problem because I have the cash from selling my old stuff). Then figuring around 3 to 4K to build the 60.

Please elaborate on how you are arriving at these figures.

 

[blazinzuk]

2600 for the rear.

Gears are what 250 install kit 150, even an ARB is only 750 or so, disc brakes are 500 if you want an e brake ( way cheaper if you don't ) Diff cover 75, pinion gaurds are what 50?

Setup on the gears 250 or so. new bearings are like 80 a side?

Okay I could see a totally refurbished axle being like that if a shop did it. But everything other than the gears is a bolt on affair.

 

[fallguy]

2600 for the rear.

Gears are what 250 install kit 150, even an ARB is only 750 or so, disc brakes are 500 if you want an e brake ( way cheaper if you don't ) Diff cover 75, pinion gaurds are what 50?

Setup on the gears 250 or so. new bearings are like 80 a side?

Okay I could see a totally refurbished axle being like that if a shop did it. But everything other than the gears is a bolt on affair.

The rear is figured on a shop doing it:

600 for a newer model 14 bolt W/ factory disc & emergency brake already on it, also it comes wide enough so I dont have to get wheel spacers to match the D60.

Gears-290
Detroit-460
Install Kit-200
Labor-200
1350 U-Bolt Yoke W/ U-Bolts-75
Truss & Traction Bar Built-In-600
Plus Shipping to get it to me.

I tried to find somewhere local to setup the rear but I was looking at the same price for less of a setup.

On the front I'm looking around 950 for single wheel hubs & knuckles. Thats without tax or shipping figured. Then I still have to figure kingpin rebuild, gears, locker, diff cover, & steering. Do the math on that

This is not going to be cheap, I realize that. I'm just trying to weigh my options & I'm tired of breaking stuff. So whatever I do it will be overbuilt. Like I said before I already have the D60 front, but it needs some attention. Thanks for all the help so far

 

[sweetk30]

you sir need to search and read more.

2.5 tons are a HUGH axle for diff clearence and parts prices and tools needed to work on them. plus you think 1tons add up quick try 2.5 ton stuff. hell need a cheery picker to remove the center diff on them huge pigs. and have you ever seen the axle shafts next to a dana 60 set of shafts ? not much bigger at all.

much better deals out there. and the 14ff is a stupid easy axle to set up gears in for first time guys. and outer wheel bearings hardly go bad in them that saves you bigtime.

also skip a full locker on the front for 500-600 and go lockright in the open diff for 1/2 price guys been usin them here with great luck in 60 fronts with 38-44 " tires.

and buy used off the forsale section on parts. save 1/2 the price.

and only need srw hub/rotors to convert drw to srw nothin else other than time and 2 wheel seals.

take your time and read up. its all there for much less.

few guys here did hydro steering for under 300 with vendor parts and it works as good as 1k doller hydro kits.

few good write up threads on traction bars also that work for NOT limiting flex and KEEPING axle wrap under control.

you paid your 25 bucks use it and be thankfull you did.

 

[blazinzuk]

The rear is figured on a shop doing it:

600 for a newer model 14 bolt W/ factory disc & emergency brake already on it, also it comes wide enough so I dont have to get wheel spacers to match the D60.

Gears-290
Detroit-460
Install Kit-200
Labor-200
1350 U-Bolt Yoke W/ U-Bolts-75
Truss & Traction Bar Built-In-600
Plus Shipping to get it to me.

Where exactly are you shipping it from? 600 bucks for a truss is quite a bit IMHO, it better be one super cool truss.

Why a 1350 you lose some operating angle, if you are switching anyway go 1410 more angle capability.

How about some pics of the truck? What tires you going to run, I am guessing 44s?

 

[fallguy]

Where exactly are you shipping it from? 600 bucks for a truss is quite a bit IMHO, it better be one super cool truss.

Why a 1350 you lose some operating angle, if you are switching anyway go 1410 more angle capability.

How about some pics of the truck? What tires you going to run, I am guessing 44s?

I am not stuck on the 1350, thats just what was quoted to me after discussing what I was using it for.

The truss is super cool, but I think I will be using something different.

 

[fallguy]

you sir need to search and read more.

2.5 tons are a HUGH axle for diff clearence and parts prices and tools needed to work on them. plus you think 1tons add up quick try 2.5 ton stuff. hell need a cheery picker to remove the center diff on them huge pigs. and have you ever seen the axle shafts next to a dana 60 set of shafts ? not much bigger at all.

much better deals out there. and the 14ff is a stupid easy axle to set up gears in for first time guys. and outer wheel bearings hardly go bad in them that saves you bigtime.

also skip a full locker on the front for 500-600 and go lockright in the open diff for 1/2 price guys been usin them here with great luck in 60 fronts with 38-44 " tires.

and buy used off the forsale section on parts. save 1/2 the price.

and only need srw hub/rotors to convert drw to srw nothin else other than time and 2 wheel seals.

take your time and read up. its all there for much less.

few guys here did hydro steering for under 300 with vendor parts and it works as good as 1k doller hydro kits.

few good write up threads on traction bars also that work for NOT limiting flex and KEEPING axle wrap under control.

you paid your 25 bucks use it and be thankfull you did.

I am not stuck on the 2.5 tons, I am just checking on other options.

I already have a hydro assist kit that works great.

The single wheel hubs I need to convert from the dually hubs that were on the D60 when I got it. A couple of searches I did on converting the dual hubs to single makes me kind of weiry. Seems like there are some mixed feelings on doing this. I'm not sure either way but if someone here has done it & it works well, I'm all ears .

I will try the lockright thanks for the info.

I'm still deciding on the traction bar, I ran the truck for two years before I tore it apart with no issues.

 

[sweetk30]

all my dana 60 axles except 2 i have used had been drw 60. i converted them all to srw. like i said before its a simple swap its the same axle other than drw or srw hub/rotors.

 

[blazin' j]

Jus curious what u plan on doin to ur d60 for $3000-$4000??? I had mine completely rebuilt, upgraded to 35 spline outers, diedenbear knuckles, new rotors, calipers, and everything else in between for around $2000 n that was at $85/Hr...u may wanna check a few more places before u spend that kinda $$$...14b's are relatively cheap to get n they don't need much work...I had my one ton swap done n Pomona ca back in 07 @ $125/Hr along with new rims, tires, shocks, t-case rebuilt, exhaust, hitch installed n a few other things n that was around $9700 so since u already have a d60, u shouldnt even b near 6k...