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4.11 gears and 4.10 question
- Thread starter stoney126
- Start date
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
people call it what ever they feel like............it's the # of teeth on the ring gear divided by # of teeth on the pinion.
41-10
thats a 4.1:1..........4.10:1............4.10's. the zero actually doesn't have to be there. 4.1 TO 1 thats a partial non-hunting gear set. It needs to be timed. if you take it apart and re-use the gears set.
thats probably what you've got in that 14bolt hey?
41-10
thats a 4.1:1..........4.10:1............4.10's. the zero actually doesn't have to be there. 4.1 TO 1 thats a partial non-hunting gear set. It needs to be timed. if you take it apart and re-use the gears set.
thats probably what you've got in that 14bolt hey?
you won't have a problem. Its a matter of what teeth count can fit on the larger vs smaller ring gear/pinions on various axles.
I wheeled 3.08s in the front and 4.10s in the rear once. Had to pin it and get the front end broke loose and the rear would roll at ground speed. Was in the middle of an axle swap and wanted to wheel damnit!
I wheeled 3.08s in the front and 4.10s in the rear once. Had to pin it and get the front end broke loose and the rear would roll at ground speed. Was in the middle of an axle swap and wanted to wheel damnit!
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
right to actually answer the question IIRC you can use upto 5% difference front to back.
DEMON44 said:
I was thinking I heard 3% but wasn't sure so didn't say. Remember 3 or 5% isn't like 4.10 vs 4.13 or 4.15, its a percentage not to be confused with the decimal or tooth count. Apply mathematics here not tooth count
Tominator II
1/2 ton status
My 73 plow/tow/whatever truck has axles from a 71 Suburban that have 4.10in the rear and 4.09 in the front. Maybe thats why I've blown up so many sets of pinion gears? Naw, I've snapped front axleshafts and axleshaft u-joints even more. 
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
MNorby said:
may 3%.........I'll find out for sure tommorrow.
DEMON44 said:
Yeah find out and let me know, its been to long tha tI have worried about it and thought about it. Good stuff to remember especially when mix and matching various brand stuff that doesn't always work out perfectly.
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
I'm actually dissassembling a 38,000lb 2 speed Eaton in the shop right now. talk about a big brute.
sweet, Had to replace the front rear in my fraightliner yesterday, shelled out the bearings/bushings in the diff locks
atho
1/2 ton status
Gm doesn't help alot either. I really do not understand the point of having 4.09, 4.10, and 4.11 all for the 14 bolt. But all 3 are out there.
you probably won't notice a difference with that split. On hard road it will bind somewhat no matter what
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
I didn't go in today....but got to thinking I think you're right with 3% variation.
shouldn't operate any 4wd system on dry pavement or any high traction surface............unless you have a center differential. Such as a full time 203.
shouldn't operate any 4wd system on dry pavement or any high traction surface............unless you have a center differential. Such as a full time 203.
Col_Sanders
3/4 ton status
One of the trucks in this months Four Wheeler thats trying to get into TTC is running that combo. Doesnt seem like enough of a difference to hurt anything .
blazin_blazer
1/2 ton status
my truck is running 4.11:1 up front and 4.10:1 in the rear, no problem! the 4.10 gear set will mate the same exact ring gear tooth to the exact same pinion tooth alot more frequently, therefore allowing it to create a wear pattern as opposed to the 4.11.
same teeth match every 41 revolutions, whereas the 4.11 only see same tooth on tooth every 411 revolutions, so repeated tooth to exact tooth is alot further between, allowing a wear pattern to wear more even, where every 41 revolutions will develop a wear pattern alot sooner since the same teeth meet at 41 turns versus 411(that way if a tooth has a ridge or imperfection, it will take over 400 turns b4 same pinion tooth meets exact same ring tooth)
again my 4.10 meets the same teeth every 41 turns, allowing the gears to wear faster....if this is incorrect, please by all means straighten me out.....just had it explained like this to me once. i'm not sure tho how much this effects longivity...any1?
thats why a gear with a # 2 places past decimal is supposed to be better, but at same time, i was told a 4.10 gear is beefier(don't understand that 1, think guy was sale pitching the 4.10 14bff to me, but some of it made sense, the teeth per rev)
same teeth match every 41 revolutions, whereas the 4.11 only see same tooth on tooth every 411 revolutions, so repeated tooth to exact tooth is alot further between, allowing a wear pattern to wear more even, where every 41 revolutions will develop a wear pattern alot sooner since the same teeth meet at 41 turns versus 411(that way if a tooth has a ridge or imperfection, it will take over 400 turns b4 same pinion tooth meets exact same ring tooth)
again my 4.10 meets the same teeth every 41 turns, allowing the gears to wear faster....if this is incorrect, please by all means straighten me out.....just had it explained like this to me once. i'm not sure tho how much this effects longivity...any1?
thats why a gear with a # 2 places past decimal is supposed to be better, but at same time, i was told a 4.10 gear is beefier(don't understand that 1, think guy was sale pitching the 4.10 14bff to me, but some of it made sense, the teeth per rev)
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
If all else equal and properly timed where needed, none wear faster than the others. just the need for timeing marks on non-hunting and with partial non-hunting from and and especially when reuseing a gearset. when they're lapped in at the factory the mesh pattern is set, and maximum service life comes from correct timeing and a good setup pattern.
non-hunting ratio is a round whole number to 1......4:1.......5:1........2:1 where a pinion tooth will hit the same teeth on the crown that # of times per revolution every revolution
partial non-hunting is any ratio that has a decimal that mathematically ENDS. in 1, 2 or 3 places. 4.11 and 4.10 what are the Actual tooth numbers for each? maybe its a difference in decimal rounding. it may take X full revoltions before the pinion gets back on the original crown teeth.
Hunting is any ratio that has a mathematically repeating decimal......which needs no timeing whether new OR used, because there is no set wear pattern.
The actually mathematical answer of crown divided by pinion is most important....maybe its 4.11111111111111111111 Repeating. so its a hunting gearset.
hope that helps
non-hunting ratio is a round whole number to 1......4:1.......5:1........2:1 where a pinion tooth will hit the same teeth on the crown that # of times per revolution every revolution
partial non-hunting is any ratio that has a decimal that mathematically ENDS. in 1, 2 or 3 places. 4.11 and 4.10 what are the Actual tooth numbers for each? maybe its a difference in decimal rounding. it may take X full revoltions before the pinion gets back on the original crown teeth.
Hunting is any ratio that has a mathematically repeating decimal......which needs no timeing whether new OR used, because there is no set wear pattern.
The actually mathematical answer of crown divided by pinion is most important....maybe its 4.11111111111111111111 Repeating. so its a hunting gearset.
hope that helps
blazin_blazer
1/2 ton status
so is it correct that the 4.10 set sees matching teeth every 41 revs and the 4.11 every 411 revs, or does the repeating decimal make it even more revolutions b4 the same teeth mesh?
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
Sorry had to put the little one to bed.......the math eludes me right now, but thats why you'd need to know the actual # of teeth on the crown and teeth on the pinion not just a given ratio......... 411 revolutions before it hits the original crown teeth that is a hunting gearset. there is no way a pattern can setup with that many rotations between matching teeth. That doesn't sound right off the top of my head though. The extra digit on the decimal doesn't automatically add (a hundred) to the rotations.
But......partial non-hunting vs. hunting doesn't affect service life. thats what I was trying to say. a 4:1 ratio that has a pinion tooth hit that same 4 crown teeth every revoultion does not wear faster than a hunting gearset that may have a pinion tooth hit the original crown teeth every few hundred revolutions..........once a gear has frosted and healed during its run-in period the gears will have equal service lives {ALL other factors being the same} except ratio.
But......partial non-hunting vs. hunting doesn't affect service life. thats what I was trying to say. a 4:1 ratio that has a pinion tooth hit that same 4 crown teeth every revoultion does not wear faster than a hunting gearset that may have a pinion tooth hit the original crown teeth every few hundred revolutions..........once a gear has frosted and healed during its run-in period the gears will have equal service lives {ALL other factors being the same} except ratio.
