'72 K5 - AJ's Gray Matter Build

[AJs72K5]

Looks real good!!! Glad to see you've been able to make some progress.

Were you able to check the end play on the cam after installing the button? If there isn't any end play the cam gear will try and chew through the block, too much will cause timing issues.

You may have to space the engine up a half inch or so to get the headers to fit. I don't know if you can make some spacers or if you'll have to make new motor mount brackets to work with the DIY crossmember. Big block headers are always an adventure. Try jacking up the motor and fudging it around a little to gain a little clearance, sometimes 3/4 of an inch makes all the difference in the world.

Glad to see you're healed up and getting back at it.

I do need to recheck the end play. But, the Comp timing chain I put in has a bearing built into the back.

 

[AJs72K5]

Update 12/05/09: The motor mount crossmember plan. Did a lot of thinking the past couple of days on how to handle the headers not fitting with the DIY4x crossmember. I didn't want to cut the headers...if I ever needed a new set, I'd be looking at customizing them again. I wasn't crazy about going back to a factory crossmember either. So, like any good CK5er, I figured I'd fab my way out of it.

Headers on, you can see that I'm roughly 1 1/8" away from seating the crossmember to the mounts.

So, I trimmed the flange down 1". I'll have to redrill the top holes, but that's no biggie. Why didn't I seat the crossmember all the way? I'm going to have Kert fab up some new motor mount brackets that will raise the engine 9/16".

Still not there yet, but I already knew this. Next, I'm gonna push the frame boxes deeper into the frame by 1/4" and put a spacer in between the flange and the frame box. This is how I should end up clearance-wise. There's about 1/8" - 1/4" between the header and the frame box. The pic just has a scrap piece of 1/4" steel to represent the clearance of the new spacer.

I'm happy with how it turned out. So, I took another picture of the motor... with the real camera this time.

 

[docjake]

Mmmmmm mpfi, that thing is going to run nice. What are you using for your ECM or did I miss that somewhere?

 

[Teck]

Motor looks great, what are you doing with the oil pan?
Thats still not much room for the header if it ever flexes.

 

[AJs72K5]

Mmmmmm mpfi, that thing is going to run nice. What are you using for your ECM or did I miss that somewhere?

The Edelbrock MPFI setup comes with its own ECM. I'm sure it's a reworked GM piece.

Motor looks great, what are you doing with the oil pan?
Thats still not much room for the header if it ever flexes.

It's a Milodon factory replacement style pan, but the coating is beat up enought that it's time to paint it. Once I get the push rods in, I'll flip the motor over and paint it.

 

[Greg72]

AJ,

Do me a favor and post up a good side pic of the header for each side if you don't mind... Do you have a part number for those headers? I'm not settled on anything yet for my 502, but I think a 2" primary tube will be the right way to go for me as well. I'm going to have a whole host of fitment issues as well I'm sure.

I had to go back and reread your crossmember post...the first time I thought it was more of a crossmember to frame issue, not a header clearance issue.

 

[thealien]

Will raising the engine affect the transmission/transfer case mounting at all?

 

[AJs72K5]

AJ,

Do me a favor and post up a good side pic of the header for each side if you don't mind... Do you have a part number for those headers? I'm not settled on anything yet for my 502, but I think a 2" primary tube will be the right way to go for me as well. I'm going to have a whole host of fitment issues as well I'm sure.

I had to go back and reread your crossmember post...the first time I thought it was more of a crossmember to frame issue, not a header clearance issue.

The engine is still on the stand. Are you wanting side shots of how the crossmember sits with the headers?

Will raising the engine affect the transmission/transfer case mounting at all?

It shouldn't. Raising the engine will pivot the drivetrain at the tranny crossmember. It will actually cause the transfer case to drop a hair. The only thing I'm remotely concerned about with that is how will it affect my rear pinion angle. I'm guessing maybe a degree.

 

[Greg72]

AJ,

Nope, just want to see how the tubes themselves sweep down and back toward the collector and how easy/hard it might be to modify a set to make them run "outboard" of the framerails.

My thought process is that I could add a straight 4" extension to each tube just as it comes off the header flange, then re-weld the remainder of the header/collector back onto the those extensions.... maybe.

I don't really like the headers I've got now on my mockup. They block the oil filter area so I can't add the filter (how dumb is that) and the passenger side collector sweeps up into the footwell area in a way that is unacceptable. Basically, I'm looking for a set of headers that are more smartly designed so that I don't have to do as much work to them to get them to fit.

 

[AJs72K5]

AJ,

Nope, just want to see how the tubes themselves sweep down and back toward the collector and how easy/hard it might be to modify a set to make them run "outboard" of the framerails.

My thought process is that I could add a straight 4" extension to each tube just as it comes off the header flange, then re-weld the remainder of the header/collector back onto the those extensions.... maybe.

I don't really like the headers I've got now on my mockup. They block the oil filter area so I can't add the filter (how dumb is that) and the passenger side collector sweeps up into the footwell area in a way that is unacceptable. Basically, I'm looking for a set of headers that are more smartly designed so that I don't have to do as much work to them to get them to fit.

The engine is wrapped up in plastic right now. I'll get to the shop either Saturday or Sunday to get some pics for you.

Headers I got are Hooker 2455's (Summit part# 2455HKR)...they're for a 1972 Chevelle. I just got the black painted ones for now. Once I'm happy with how everything fits, and I break in the motor, I'll send them out to get coated.

Talked to Kert @ DIY4x and he's working on the parts I need to make the crossmember work. Also got a call today that my pushrods came in.

 

[NV_K5]

http://coloradok5.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2318130&postcount=17

 

[AJs72K5]

UPDATE 12/13/09: We have pushrods!! The new pushrods came in this week. I got them all dropped into the motor. Last thing to do on the engine is set the rocker arms and bolt down the intake. I figured I'd also drop the oil pan and give it some fresh paint to match the block.

Comp Cams Magnum pushrods. They feel beefy.

Freshly painted oil pan...drying in the garage.

For those that wanted to see the full sweep of the headers on the engine. Here's both sides. Just another excuse for me to take pics of the engine.

This pic also shows the fire extinguisher that I didn't see when the engine caught fire.

 

[Teck]

AJ, that motor looks real sweet.

 

[AJs72K5]

Update 12/20/09: Crossmember 2.0. Made a call to Kert at DIY4x to fab up some parts to get make some more room on the engine crossmember for the headers. All of the measurements came out right and we are spot on to where I thought it would end up. You da man Kert! Still have a few things to do to the crossmember before I consider it complete:

1. Weld the spacer plate to the existing crossmember flange
2. Drill the new upper holes for the flange, spacer, and frame boxes
3. Spray some paint on it.

I started with some new motor mount brackets. They raise the engine up 9/16". To level set, here's the pan clearance using the original motor mounts.

Here's how it sits with the new mounts. Probably enough clearance for a deep sump pan later.

Here's the money shot. Spacer is cut to size here. Test fit with the headers and the crossmember fully bolted up to the motor mounts

Shot of the original frame box. Sticks out from the frame about 1/4"

Shot of the new frame box. It sits flush with the frame.

Everything bolted up in the frame. Yup, still fits.

If all goes as planned over the next couple of weeks, the engine may be in the truck by New Year.

 

[cybrfire]

Update 12/20/09: Crossmember 2.0. Made a call to Kert at DIY4x to fab up some parts to get make some more room on the engine crossmember for the headers. All of the measurements came out right and we are spot on to where I thought it would end up. You da man Kert! Still have a few things to do to the crossmember before I consider it complete:

1. Weld the spacer plate to the existing crossmember flange
2. Drill the new upper holes for the flange, spacer, and frame boxes
3. Spray some paint on it.

I started with some new motor mount brackets. They raise the engine up 9/16". To level set, here's the pan clearance using the original motor mounts.

Here's how it sits with the new mounts. Probably enough clearance for a deep sump pan later.

Here's the money shot. Spacer is cut to size here. Test fit with the headers and the crossmember fully bolted up to the motor mounts

Shot of the original frame box. Sticks out from the frame about 1/4"

Shot of the new frame box. It sits flush with the frame.

Everything bolted up in the frame. Yup, still fits.

If all goes as planned over the next couple of weeks, the engine may be in the truck by New Year.

Sweet AJ!! Looks like I did at least one thing right last week.... Maybe that was the week before.

Looks damn good though. Nice work.

 

[Greg72]

Sweet AJ!! Looks like I did at least one thing right last week.... Maybe that was the week before.

Looks damn good though. Nice work.

I have to say I'm always impressed with how far Kert will go to make sure his parts work for people....even when the issue is someone else's fault (in this case, the header manufacturer).

Well done!

 

[AJs72K5]

UPDATE 01/01/10: Drivetrain relocation. What better way to ring in the new year than to spend the afternoon at the shop working on the truck? I couldn't think of a better one. Onto the good stuff. By drivetrain relocation I mean: getting the engine off the stand; getting the tranny off of the floor; and putting them where they're supposed to be.... in the truck!

First I had to reintroduce the engine and the tranny... they've been separated for quite some time and it was an arranged marriage after all.

Now to consummate the marriage...

To quote Mr. Happy Gilmore, "This is your home. Don't you wanna go to your home? GO TO YOUR HOME!!" It was a battle getting the engine in. The master cylinder and booster had to be removed, then I had to remove the motor mount brackets from the block to get it to clear the crossmember mounts. The fresh paint on the oil pan took a beating. It'll have to be repainted.

Finally settled in.

Driver side header fits well. No clearance issues.

The passenger side...not so good. The number 6 tube is hitting the shackle. The number 8 tube within a milllimeter or two of the firewall. Worst of all, the collector flange is not playing nice with the clocked up transfer case. This header is going to require a bunch of rework. Can't really tell in this pic, oh well.

The good news is that with the work I had done on the firewall, and even with raising up the engine 9/16", everything on the engine still clears and looks good. The distributor clearance is the only remaining question now...I was too tired to check.

All in all, it was a great way to start the year!

 

[Yukon Jack]

Too bad about the passenger side header - nothing can ever be easy it seems!

 

[Big Blzn]

AJ, are you just using two bolts per side on the cross member that attaches to the frame mounting thing? Looks like there are two unused bolt holes. I don't recall if you mentioned that earlier.

 

[AJs72K5]

Too bad about the passenger side header - nothing can ever be easy it seems!

No kidding!! When test fitting with the crossmember, the passenger side had the least clearance issues. I was only worried about how it would fit with the clocked up 241. Didn't even think about the shackle until after the engine was in the frame

AJ, are you just using two bolts per side on the cross member that attaches to the frame mounting thing? Looks like there are two unused bolt holes. I don't recall if you mentioned that earlier.

I welded up the original top holes in the frame box. Then redrilled new upper ones thru the crossmember flange, spacer and frame box...3/4" of steel drilled 4 times with a cordless drill == not a lot of fun. There's 4 bolts on each side holding the crossmember to the frame box...it shouldn't go anywhere.