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A few Sub/amp questions...

68MUDSTUD

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OK, first of all, how should I mount a couple subs in my K-5? I have no idea how I should do it. I'd like them to be on both sides, behind the front bucket seats facing the middle..... I'm thinking about getting 2 10"s, and some better speakers up front (under front seats?).

What kind of amp/sub combo should I go with? I realize I'll probably have to run two diferent amps (which would sit under the rear bench).

Thanks!
 
Oh, and I would like it to not fry any of my electrical in my blazer... :haha:

A you can tell, I'm a total n00b when it comes to speakers/bass.

I'm just saying, because I'm running my stock alternator (65amp?), and when I have the headlights on, and the heater on, when I shut the heater off, lights get about 30% brighter. :eek1::haha:
 
Ok, go to the bathroom, grab a cup of coffee and find a comfy chair to sit in because this is possibly my longest post ever :doah:

First off let me say I am by no means a "professional" audio guy but do some tinkering so here's a few thoughts of mine. First off, don't waste your time putting any speakers under the seats for your front stage. The front speakers are better off in the doors or in a kick panel type setup like these http://cgi.ebay.com/Q-LOGIC-Q-FORM-...5|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1308|301:1|293:1|294:50
You don't necessarily need a component speaker with a seperate woofer/tweeter, just a good 2 way speaker mounted in the door would also work fine. A component system like what is used in the kick panel setup are going to require more power so an amp would be needed. A standard speaker with a lower power requirement would probably do ok running off deck power but would most likely benefit from an amp also.

Subwoofer placement is kind of a tough one because every speaker, enclosure & vehicle is going to sound different. If you put them behind the front seats facing each other you may run into problems with the sound waves crashing into each other and sounding bad. I suppose if you mounted them angled slightly facing the front that might work. You could go with the standard dual sealed box route, somthing similar to this http://cgi.ebay.com/New-10-Inch-Dua...5|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318|301:1|293:1|294:50
Typically this would go in the very rear of the truck and speakers would face the tailgate allowing the sound to bounce of the rear gate/window area.
Couple other ideas would be to make a smaller enclosure that would go in the center console area with a downfiring sub, bass would be right up front and therefore would not need to be as loud or require a ton of power.
I've also thought about builiding a thinner flat box for the rear that would go across the entire rear floor area behind the back seat using a new slim design sub, again in a downfire type design. This way you could still load stuff in the rear and if the box was carpeted it wouldn't look like anything special.
You could get a multi channel amp to run both the speakers & subs if you want to simplify things. Most important thing is to match the power requirements of the speakers & amp. No point in having 1,000 watt subs and 50watt amp. The other way is ok, more amp than what speakers need. This is called headroom, where the amp is capable of producing more power than what you really need, just turn it down to a level before the speakers start distorting.
The alternator probably should get upgraded anyway from what you're describing. Here's some good charts to look at that will give you an idea about amps, power requirements and cable sizing. Actually the website in general is loaded with good info, http://www.the12volt.com/info/recwirsz.asp

Here's a couple decent car audio places to get some deals,
http://www.woofersetc.com/
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-kANsbFpmAAN/ (more expensive but killer customer service)

Oh yeah, don't forget all the sound originates from your head unit so it can only be as good as what that is capable of.

Clear as mud yet ? :D
 
WOW!!!:eek1:

awesome post! Thanks!
 
Ok, If I didnt want to go with another / upgraded alternator, what would be the best amp/sub combo to use?
 
I would think about maybe just going with a single sub and a smaller amp (2-300watt). It will depend on what it is you want the sub to do, fill in some of the lower frequencies to complement the music or a bigger sub(12,15" ) to give that real boom kind of sound. A 10" is a happy compromise between some good tighter bass for pop/rock music but will still give decent boom for dance/rap type stuff. We put a 10" in a small sealed box running of a dedicated sub amp(just a little 150watt) in my buddies 2 door s-10 and it sounded great and he listened to everything from marching band to hip-hop.
Even with a smaller amp if you are using a lot of other electrical on your truck and have the music cranked you may be underpowering stuff. It might be a good idea to have the alternator load tested while on the truck just so you know a real world number of it's output. It's possible from what you were describing about the lights dimming that the alternator isn't putting out what it's rated for, of course at idle situations it can't produce a whole lot anyway. There are specific high output alternators that are capable of producing over 100 amps at idle :eek1: where yours is rated to 65 amps but tested at an engine speed of 2-2500 rpm.
 
Oh, and I would like it to not fry any of my electrical in my blazer... :haha:

A you can tell, I'm a total n00b when it comes to speakers/bass.

I'm just saying, because I'm running my stock alternator (65amp?), and when I have the headlights on, and the heater on, when I shut the heater off, lights get about 30% brighter. :eek1::haha:


you ARE going to need a better alternator, and/or a MASSIVE cap
 
you ARE going to need a better alternator, and/or a MASSIVE cap

x2

And after this past week's adventure with the electrical system in my house ( :doah:) I'll say you should think twice about trying to run a modern audio system on a 40yr-old electrical system. It simply wasn't built for that sort of thing.

Also, make sure to run a good heavy, dedicated power line to your amps, with it's own fuse coming straight off the battery.
 
Don't waste your money on caps they dont give you power to nothing put the amp. Caps store power for the amp to use when the atl. Cant handle the surge. Just use the money on a 100amp alt. Add a 100amp alt and that will take care of most of your surging power lost.
 
Can't remember how much room is under the back seat but not much. I bought these subs for under my trucks back seat. 2-12's

http://www.kenwoodusa.com/Car_Entertainment/eXcelon/Subwoofers/KFC-XW1200F

Bought this amp to push them

http://shopper.cnet.com/car-amplifi...mclg&part=yahoo-ssp-cnet&subj=q11189304151436

But just got this from a friends friend for little to nothing :D

http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Kenwood%20KAC-7203%20Car%20Amplifier:1994640812

You may not need to go that excessive but i have to go LOUD!! :D

EDIT: oh and if you're looking for highs and mids i've never went wrong with Infinity ;)
 
I'm not really looking for mids or highs, I really like low bass. Like the bass that you cant really hear but you can feel...

I'm not really wantig to change over to a newer style alternator, so you guys think i'd be ok just running two 8"?
 
Ya know i've never had to upgarde or even buy another alternator cause of what i ran off it. I may have just been one of few.

I HAVE changed alternators before but not cause of a system. I had a 91 Grand Prix and everytime the bass hit the headlights and volt gauge would drop to like 9 or 10 :haha: Ran it like that for like 2 years
 
8's will do just fine as long as you use the right box and amp. I've heard 8's in many cars and trucks that would blow your mind.
 
OK, I just had an epiphany....

While im doing this, Why don't I do it right?

Im going to go with either a 100 or 140 amp alt.

Think 2 12s will push enough air in my blazer?

Also, what kind of sound deadening material is the best bang for the buck?

You only live once, right?
 
OK, I just had an epiphany....

While im doing this, Why don't I do it right?

Im going to go with either a 100 or 140 amp alt.

Think 2 12s will push enough air in my blazer?

Also, what kind of sound deadening material is the best bang for the buck?

You only live once, right?
I had two 12" Infinity Reference 1230w subs in my blazer at one time in a diamond box. I only had a 350-400 watt Rockford Fosgate amp pushing them and i had some friends listen from a distance. They could hear me for almost a mile :D

Surprised the hell outta me.

I say GO FOR IT!!

As for the air thing i have no idea wat you're talkin about :haha:

and sound deadening material?? What's that :doah: I like the whole tin can Chevy rust sound :haha::haha:
 
Ok, since you're after the low deep bass gonna have to go with some 12's at least :D
Two 12's in the right box will definitely make some noise in a k5. Sound deadening will help keep the sound inside the truck and make it sound better. Here's a couple alternatives to the overpriced Dynamat stuff
http://www.raamaudio.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi?p=pr
http://www.secondskinaudio.com/vibration-mat/damplifier.php

As far as the alternator goes, if you're going to upgrade might as well have some extra on tap. This guy sells some high output alternators on EBAY, seen good reviews on the stereo forums but have no personal experience with them. They have some older Chevy alternators listed with the model/design numbers, might be able to see if they have something that will fit.
http://stores.ebay.com/Iraggi-Alter...QfsooZ1QQfsopZ1QQsaselZ35089818QQsofpZ0QQtZkm

Now for the important stuff, wiring! Don't skimp here whatever you do. Use the minimum size wiring(or preferably larger) the amp you get is designed for. Use the chart from my first post from The12volt.com for amps/length of cable/wire gauge size. Also if you do a search for "The Big Three" explains the basic power/ground wiring upgrades you can do to get the most out of your electrical system.
Here's a couple pics for 'ya, first one is some wiring size comparissons.
Red=10 gauge Blue= 4 gauge Grey=0 gauge :saweet:
Second pic is my girl holding one of my amps I'm holding onto for a future project. That amp would actually overload a 100 amp alternator if it was pushed hard enough.....it's only a little 1400 watt.

for sale '09 029.jpg

PPI amps 008.jpg
 
Music is transient. Unless you are listening to sine waves at full power, your amplifier will never draw full power for more than a very brief time. For wiring, assume maximum current draw possible. But this method is not necessary for sizing an alternator, and will result in your purchasing a much larger piece than you probably need.
 
Im not an audio expereither but have some electronic and electrical experience.

I agree and disagreeon the max current draw. Under normal operation withing the specs of the amp you are correct. but if you push an amp too far the output transistors get to a point they can no longer cunduct any more electricity called saturation, this causes the sound to flatten out the wave , called clipping . at that point the amp is drawing maximum current. That is why you blow an amp or sub when you use too small of an amp. you are better off buying an amp rated about 10 or 15 % above the rated continious wattage rating of the speakers and then back off the gain on the amp so as not to blow the speakers. as far as the speakers them selves; go with what sounds good to you , everyone hears differently and has thier own tastes. find what you like sound wise and if it fits in your given air space then size the amp to that sub.
 
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