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A modern day K5?

Man, not to bash on your idea but have you actually seen a Willy's? There is not a chance you will be able to just make parts for it or work on it if you aren't mechanically inclined. Yes they have flatter panels than a chevy but that just makes it easier do body work/welding on them. If you are already are inclined enough to be doing that then an old chevy truck is really no different.
 
I teach mission based training for DOS. (Dept of State). We offroad until it hurts in order to prepare personel for Afghanistan and other unpleasant places. We repel jeeps off of small cliffs and inclines, build roads and bridges over impassable terrain with what ever is lying around. If something breaks, we have to fix it or make a mission focused decision to (virtually) use a thermite grenade and not leave behind any goods for the enemy.

This experience has played well taking vacations that include some form of offroading. We are building a Suburban for a family cross country adventure.


My worst offroad failure was burying a CJ5 in the snow when traveling some hard packed snowmobile trails in northern NY state. It took me 6 hours to hike out, get a ride home to load a sled with gear, and hike back into the woods to rescue my ride. 3 hours after that I was back on pavement. Sweet victory.
 
An 80's K5 has got to be as good at it gets for most of your criteria. Almost any part on them is on the shelf at any parts store in any dinky town in the country, and they are the cheapest parts due to quantity. First time I replaced my water pump I was blown away that I could fix that problem for $25 and an hour of my time. Body panels are dirt cheap too,

From a survivability perspective, switching to EFI was probably the worst thing I did, since the software is custom and now I have a pump in the tank waiting to fail. A spare carb would be cheap insurance and can be swapped in minutes. Maybe I'll go back some day... :thinking: A spare computer and a little door in the bed over the tank might work too.
 
I agree that the K5 is a great choice for a rugged off roader. It's only limitation is getting into tight areas. Any argument against the K5 would have to be pretty well layed out.

The biggest change I would make to a K5 is to power it with a cummins and outfit it with modern disc brakes.

The gasoline fuel injection is a good choice in my opinion as factory systems are fairly bullet proof and increase range with greater efficiency.
 
Yeah, I wouldn't argue that the K5 is tops for off-roading necessarily, but in terms of cheap/easy to maintain and ability to go on an expedition and not get stranded far from home. They must be the most widely supported platforms in the US.

The new diesels seem too reliant on a lot of tech for my tastes. Even though they are somewhat weak, I love the old 6.2 diesels for simplicity. They have the off camber benefits of EFI but are purely mechanical. If my 350 blows up I'll seriously consider it. I think 6.5's are pretty much the same, but I have no experience with them. Not sure if they make much more power.
 
The Cummins 4BT is purely mechanical and is the most bullet proof power plant available. They have a continuous duty cycle and can run nearly non stop. I can't imagine anything more durable than say, gravity.
 
I know right. 30 years of technology past the 6.2 and I'd still prefer my 6.2. Sure a brand new diesel has way more power. But mine is cheap, easy to work on, gets the same mpgs and does all I need :dunno:

And it don't need cat pee to run either :D
 
mrschaeferpants said:
Now, there is some vehicle, I don't remember a model of range/land rover or something, my buddy is always talking about it. That literally the entire body unbolts. You could zip it down to the chassis/floor pans/firewall in minutes.
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This is what I envision... taking an idea like this to the extreme... for the whole vehicle..


Here's the main thing, there's no demand. I don't mean the 5-10 people here on CK5 who would like something like that, or the hundreds or thousands of people on these automotive forums, or the 10s of thousands in this country.
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You are probably right.. my hope was that maybe if I asked aloud others would realize they felt the same way if you know what I mean...

But I honestly think if someone made a vehicle like this it would take off like the bug did...
 
Carcinogen said:
Man, not to bash on your idea but have you actually seen a Willy's? There is not a chance you will be able to just make parts for it or work on it if you aren't mechanically inclined. Yes they have flatter panels than a chevy but that just makes it easier do body work/welding on them. If you are already are inclined enough to be doing that then an old chevy truck is really no different.
Click to expand...

My hope is that we could make something even more user friendly than the Willys.

I have an idea I am planning to do some little diagrams of and will post it when I get a chance.
 
ZombieBlazer said:
But I honestly think if someone made a vehicle like this it would take off like the bug did...
Click to expand...

Unfortunately I don't think so. Wrangler is the closest thing on the market and it's already plagued by heated mirrors, power locks, drive by wire, etc etc. Even though Wrangler is the most popular enthusiast 4x4 right now, 99% of them are not driven by enthusiasts and just go to work and back, etc. If there was a demand, even say, 20% of buyers, I think they'd have a package to cover it (bare bones, vinyl floor, etc.). The fact that the Rubicon package is linked to a bunch of convenience BS tells you that most people who get the Rubicon are just buying it because they can afford it, not because they are really planning to off-road it in a serious way.
 
Mastiff said:
Unfortunately I don't think so. Wrangler is the closest thing on the market and it's already plagued by heated mirrors, power locks, drive by wire, etc etc. Even though Wrangler is the most popular enthusiast 4x4 right now, 99% of them are not driven by enthusiasts and just go to work and back, etc. If there was a demand, even say, 20% of buyers, I think they'd have a package to cover it (bare bones, vinyl floor, etc.). The fact that the Rubicon package is linked to a bunch of convenience BS tells you that most people who get the Rubicon are just buying it because they can afford it, not because they are really planning to off-road it in a serious way.
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But I think car manufacturers got smart... they realized that the bug was stupid to sell from their perspective...

Why sell someone a vehicle that they would never need to replace or get worked on etc etc... You can't get rich that way...

This is why I feel so strongly if we want a new BUG Or a 4x4 bug... we have to figure out a way to do it ourselves. With the government fighting us on behalf of the car companies too! :haha:
 
What people "say" they want to a Marketing focus group and what they actually buy are two totally different things....

Humans are funny creatures that way. You put a stripped-down, featureless vehicle for sale with a low price (just like people insisted they wanted) and they'll say.... "Well, that's good but it seems too "cheap". Are these seats heated?". :D

Manufacturers are building cars filled with crazy options because it sells.... The majority of people (the ones with money who actually buy new cars) want heated seats , Bluetooth, cruise control and all the other goodies. It is true that we live in a disposable society, and the reason that most people don't care about serviceability is because the warranty covers them until it's time to buy ANOTHER new car (with even MORE gizmos). 98% of the drivers out there don't care about working on their own car.... They probably don't even like the inconvenience of driving it somewhere to have the oil changed. I will bet there are people out there who never opened the hood of their car the entire time they owned it.

You should really start posting some of your renderings or design ideas in this thread to keep it going.... :deal:

-G
 
ZombieBlazer said:
This is what I envision... taking an idea like this to the extreme... for the whole vehicle..




You are probably right.. my hope was that maybe if I asked aloud others would realize they felt the same way if you know what I mean...

But I honestly think if someone made a vehicle like this it would take off like the bug did...
Click to expand...

I think a lot of us do feel the same way in some regard. If someone built what you're describing I'm sure many of us would like/want/buy something like that. But, I don't think it'll happen for the many reasons listed.

It couldn't be a manufacturer, it'd have to be some type of shop mass producing it under the radar, using older frames/bodies/VINs to get around the modern day rules. Build it, they will come :waytogo: I know if I was driving down the road and saw a car lot with 10 restored K5s I'd definitely stop and check it out.

I mean, what's a full resto job cost, 20-30 grand depending? It's not a unique 50 year old car, parts are readily available, so in that lower end I imagine. You employ a highly skilled team of Chevy enthusiasts, stock parts new and old, bolts, misc items, get a system going, and it could be cheaper than a typical restoration because all you do is 73-91. Probably $15k, then you in house finance, all of your workers get paid, shop gets paid and profits from the $15k in the restoration like any other shop, sell it for $20 grand, and with financing you're making money.

Plausible. I mean, old trucks don't die, they just change owners, right :D So there's a demand. Sure average person buys a $2k truck off CL, but that's cause no one finances that $8k one that someone restored in their garage and is now selling for less than he put into it.
 
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ZombieBlazer said:
My hope is that we could make something even more user friendly than the Willys.

I have an idea I am planning to do some little diagrams of and will post it when I get a chance.
Click to expand...


Yeah, sketches would be cool. Right now I'm envisioning something you could build out of an Erector set(but on a much larger scale).
 
Greg72 said:
Manufacturers are building cars filled with crazy options because it sells.... The majority of people (the ones with money who actually buy new cars) want heated seats , Bluetooth, cruise control and all the other goodies.

-G
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Precisely...seems to me that's what caused the birth of the 'aftermarket"...back when cars were "plain" we would buy stuff to put in them....aftermarket items that ended up getting attached to the dash or under the radio...when new technology would come out we would add it ourselves...now they are just building it in...I remember the old aftermarket cruise control kits.
the car companies are giving the people what they want.....but, just like with clothing, they do set the trend....so they do "drive" the styles and looks of vehicles....
 
Carcinogen said:
Yeah, sketches would be cool. Right now I'm envisioning something you could build out of an Erector set(but on a much larger scale).
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That is what I envision holding up the body structure of the Kubelwagen from the pictures I have looked at but it's hard to tell.

Sorry I haven't got the sketches up yet but I have a lot of crazy stuff going on.. I am still getting unpacked from having moved cross country and lots of other craziness..

I will try to get something up later tonight. :sign29:
 
I just found something... I had no idea this existed but I was doing research on Kubelwagens and found this...

http://www.kooblekar.com/kooblekar

It's a kit car... I can't tell if 20,000 is for one they put together or just parts.

But if you look this thing is very simply put together... It's made of very basic parts. I am wondering if we could make something like this for significantly less.

Here is a thread where I read about the kit.. and they have good pictures of how the body/chassis is made...

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=377278&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

This is very similar to what my sketches were going to be of how the body is constructed but I was was thinking of using bolts and rivets.. they seem to have welded these structural pieces.. But I have some more ideas that I can put in the sketches, too. I would like to try to come up with some different body styles. I have ideas.. hopefully they work.. :D
 
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Renntag said:
The Hummer concept is a sweet looking ride.

xx-hummer-hx-f3401.jpg
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Hey.. I just got to look closely at this thing.. it is cool.. and look at all the flat panels! This is the kind of thing I was thinking could be done. Simple but very cool looking.... that's something we could do on our own I believe.

What is really funny though is it demonstrates an idea I had... I was looking at vehicle pics and I saw a pic of a Landrover defender CGI model someone had made.. but it was a low polygon model - kind of blocky. Imagine a land rover defender but all the curved angles were turned into little flat planes like this Hummer demo...
 
You're almost all the way there......

The vehicle you seem to be unwittingly gravitating towards is the German UniMog.


...you'll see.


-G
 
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