greywolf
1/2 ton status
Can someone please post a link to the updated ac system. We are putting the ac back in the burb and they said it's like $400 for r 12 free on. Wtf? This seems incredibly high for free on
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ac thread
- Thread starter greywolf
- Start date
Nope. That sounds about right. Well, actually I paid $600 to have new hoses made, flush out the whole system, and charge it with R12 Freon. In hindsight, I wish I had swapped out my condenser with the 134a style and made the commitment to 134a. That would have saved me about $500 (since I could charge the 134a myself). I'm not sure if that's what you were wanting to hear or not.
greywolf
1/2 ton status
They said 400 just for free on. I might get a new 134 condenser but he said it won't cool as good in the old stuff.
There's some truth to that. From my experience, R12 is a little (little) better at cooling than 134a. But you probably won't notice it. As long as the conversion is done right (replace your condenser with one designed for 134a), you probably won't notice much of a difference except in your wallet. The 134a condenser has a lot more coils and surface area, and this is critical at removing heat from the Freon (drops the cooling temp). The same thing can be said about air flow through the condenser. I added an electric fan in front of my condenser that runs off a relay. Anytime I turn on the air conditioner (compressor) it trips the relay and turns on the electric fan to push air through the condenser. I don't know what compressor you have, but I am a fan of the factory pancake style (R4 compressor). A lot of folks like to talk bad about it, but it's personal preference I guess. Should you decide to convert, make sure the AC shop thoroughly flushes out your entire system to remove any R12. I think the orifice tube needs to be swapped out too in a conversion (less than $10).
rampage
3/4 ton status
Before you make your decision, Google the sh*t out of your options. There's a whole movement in Europe to use a propane based gas. They've been using it over there for years. I have a mechanic friend who charged his Ford Crown Vic with propane, and it will freeze you out of the car. A lot of folks will tell you that using propane in dangerous, but not one person has ever made the news for blowing themselves up using propane (because it's never happened). Like I said, Europe is using it in everything from tractors to taxis. I'm not trying to convince you to use one thing over another, but I am saying you've got lots of options out there.
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From what I have been able to tell, 134A is actually a little more efficient than 12. Which is part of the problem. It just removes more heat than 12 and the stock condensers cannot get rid of it.
Plus a system designed for 12 is just not quite right for 134A. But, there are a lot of conversions that work as well or better than stock.
All you have to do is get in a newer car that was designed for the stuff to realize real quick that it works.
So, if I had access to 12 for free, I would never change. And in fact, I have a couple of 30# containers that I bought before it got taxed out of sight.
But I use them to keep my own stuff going.
In your case, I would put my money into a good conversion with the more efficient type of condenser plus as big a one as I could squeeze in there.
Flush the system good, and change the drier and orifice tube. They make an "automatic" variable orifice tube that is supposed to work better than stock at low speeds, but the only one I know of that a mechanic friend of mine installed he wound up replacing.
The advantage to a conversion, is that if you wind up with a leak later, you have not thrown away your money on 12. If you are paying for a turnkey conversion, make sure they will guarantee that it will cool as good as stock, or will do what is necessary to make it so.
Plus a system designed for 12 is just not quite right for 134A. But, there are a lot of conversions that work as well or better than stock.
All you have to do is get in a newer car that was designed for the stuff to realize real quick that it works.
So, if I had access to 12 for free, I would never change. And in fact, I have a couple of 30# containers that I bought before it got taxed out of sight.
But I use them to keep my own stuff going.
In your case, I would put my money into a good conversion with the more efficient type of condenser plus as big a one as I could squeeze in there.
Flush the system good, and change the drier and orifice tube. They make an "automatic" variable orifice tube that is supposed to work better than stock at low speeds, but the only one I know of that a mechanic friend of mine installed he wound up replacing.
The advantage to a conversion, is that if you wind up with a leak later, you have not thrown away your money on 12. If you are paying for a turnkey conversion, make sure they will guarantee that it will cool as good as stock, or will do what is necessary to make it so.
There's no good reason to chase R12 any longer.
I don't know what year your Burb is - I'm guessing a squarebody (?). Those condensers had a large-diameter tube winding back and forth through the fins and worked fine for R-12. There's an updated condenser designed specifically for R-134a retrofits (parallel-flow design) which is a direct replacement. It is AC Delco #15-6960. They work great, and you'll run plenty cold if the install and the rest of the retrofit is done correctly. I can get a 45-50 drop below ambient no problem.
I don't know what year your Burb is - I'm guessing a squarebody (?). Those condensers had a large-diameter tube winding back and forth through the fins and worked fine for R-12. There's an updated condenser designed specifically for R-134a retrofits (parallel-flow design) which is a direct replacement. It is AC Delco #15-6960. They work great, and you'll run plenty cold if the install and the rest of the retrofit is done correctly. I can get a 45-50 drop below ambient no problem.
disenough
Registered Member
You can also use r152a which is whats in computer air duster cans.
I have it in my K10 and K5 right now and works pretty good.
I buy it at Sams for $10 for 4 cans and both trucks take 5 cans so thats only
12.50 a charge. You can find a lot of people on the internet using it.
I have it in my K10 and K5 right now and works pretty good.
I buy it at Sams for $10 for 4 cans and both trucks take 5 cans so thats only
12.50 a charge. You can find a lot of people on the internet using it.
Yes, believe it or not, R152A is EPA approved as an automobile refrigerant (url below). Also, there are independent tests that prove it cools better than 134a (Google them). If the EPA approves it, then no tree-hugger or anyone else can argue over its safety... period.
If you are looking for a drop in replacement for R12 (flushing system may be required), then you can try MP39 / R-401a.
R152a EPA approved - https://www.epa.gov/snap/acceptable...tioning-light-duty-medium-duty-heavy-duty-and
MP39 / R-401a - https://www.chemours.com/Refrigerants/en_US/products/Suva/SuvaMP39.html
If you are looking for a drop in replacement for R12 (flushing system may be required), then you can try MP39 / R-401a.
R152a EPA approved - https://www.epa.gov/snap/acceptable...tioning-light-duty-medium-duty-heavy-duty-and
MP39 / R-401a - https://www.chemours.com/Refrigerants/en_US/products/Suva/SuvaMP39.html
Hey disenough, did you have to flush your system to use this in your trucks? What condenser are you using (factory R12)? What temp drop are you seeing at your vents? I've been considering making the switch to R152a for a while, but I want to hear more from folks who have already made the switch.
Yes, it works very nice. Much easier to charge an old system with cheap refrigerant that doesn't require recovery tools than to upgrade tons of parts to use an expensive refrigerant. But I've posted so many times. So many A/C threads to search here before re-hashing. AFAIK, the information on R152 is the only new thing here. Haven't tried it yet, but it sounds promising.
disenough
Registered Member
I didn't flush anything just drain the oil out of the compressor and added ester oil.
Everything is stock. I also changed the accumulator and orifice tube.
Everything is stock. I also changed the accumulator and orifice tube.
Were you running R134a or R12 before the switch?
disenough
Registered Member
R12
Literally just finished redoing my AC. It has not worked since 2003. I'm using a new Delco R4 compressor, the weird adapter seals to make the compressor match the manifold, a chinese parallel flow condenser. I flushed the system, like 10 times, replaced all of the seals, filled it with oil and 134a. This picture was taken today, it's 90 outside today. There is no reason to go through the headache of using a new style compressor. The Delco R4 is a good unit. Avoid the remans and the Chinese knock offs. I did this all myself, in the garage, with CK5 helping me along.
That is pure sexy right there....
I just had a leak repaired in my 96 Impala today which uses R134A and the shop has it blowing 38* out the vents. They charged me $162 to dye check for any leaks after they repaired the leak I knew about (high pressure port valve went bad), replaced the high pressure port valve and the low pressure schrader valve and then recharged the system.
greywolf
1/2 ton status
I just left the factory condenser in there and replaced everything else. I haven't used ac in 6 years But my wife and daughters want it in there. New head liner going up next.
My suburban is charged with R12, shit blows cold.
And yeah it was like $475 out the door.
And yeah it was like $475 out the door.
