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Auto hub to manual swap help needed

eodcoduto

eodcoduto

We could have been closer.
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I have searched the forums and most of the threads on this subject are old and the pictures no longer work. I have an '85 K20 Suburban with stock axles and the auto hubs, 8 lug 10 bolt. The passenger side hub is ticking and I happen to have a set of locking hubs from an M1009 CUCV (1/2 ton blazer 10 bolt). The CUCV hubs were easy to pull and about the most fun I have had pulling parts in a while. I pulled the auto hub on the Suburban and the manual hubs won't seat far enough in to put the axle snap ring in place. I watched one video where a guy pulled an axle nut then swapped in the manual hubs, is this correct? Or are the 6 and 8 lug 10 bolts different and I need a different set of manual hubs? Any help is appreciated.
Gage
 
It’s been many years since I did the swap to Warn premiums, but IIRC there is a washer that can be removed and left off if they don’t seat far enough as per Warn instructions. Also, make sure the axle shaft is pushed all the way outward. How far before the snap ring goes on?
 
I took the washer out behind the snap ring and I need about 1/8-1/4". After watching a few more videos it looks like the outer hub nut needs to come off to remove the spacer behind it.
 
When you go from Auto to Manual the snap ring does not fit and is not needed.
 
As mentioned above make sure the axle shaft is slid outwards first. On my old 10-bolt it was pretty common to have to take a big screwdriver or prybar and pry the axle shaft outwards around the u-joint.
 
There are two snap ring patterns on these axle shafts. Manual and automatic hubs use different grooves and I do not think they are adaptable. You will be fine without the axle snap ring, just make sure that you have the internal snap ring holding the lockout into the hub.
 
Stock shaft with automatic lockouts:

imgp3916-jpg.160949


Stock shaft with both grooves:

imgp3918-jpg.160950


This is the snap ring position you'll need to run 20990-style manual lockouts. Shown with a drive flange because that's the picture I have available at the moment.

imgp3921-jpg.160951
 
Good stuff @campfire, I never realized the stubs were different for auto vs manual hubs. I wonder if the same is true of a D60?
 
Did D60s ever come with auto hubs?
I don't know, I don't think I've ever seen it. But I also haven't seen many stock D60s LOL
 
Yes but for just a few years, something like 82-84 or so. Trivia; auto hub 1 tons would have had the rare synchronized np205 (shift on the fly between 2hi-4hi under 30 mph).
 
I just helped a buddy with an '89 suburban, 10 bolt 8lug. We tried replacing a set of old mile marker hubs with warns. Could not make them fit. Same thing, 1/8" gap. After several trips to napa and oreilly with no real solution we were told there is a year break where the warns don't fit. I wasn't there for the actual explanation but in the end new mile marker hubs dropped right in. I will ask him what the reasoning behind it all was. After reading this I wonder about snap rings now.
 
nvrenuf said:
Good stuff @campfire, I never realized the stubs were different for auto vs manual hubs. I wonder if the same is true of a D60?
Click to expand...

To clarify, were the stubs different, or did GM just use what they had on hand?

Pretty sure when I converted my '83 ten bolt over to manual hubs from auto, it had both grooves.

Unfortunately can't remember what year my axle is supposed to be, I'll have to pay attention next time I take it apart though...I'm quite certain it was auto hubs originally.
 
dyeager535 said:
To clarify, were the stubs different, or did GM just use what they had on hand?

Pretty sure when I converted my '83 ten bolt over to manual hubs from auto, it had both grooves.

Unfortunately can't remember what year my axle is supposed to be, I'll have to pay attention next time I take it apart though...I'm quite certain it was auto hubs originally.
Click to expand...

I would guess they used whatever was handy and would fit. We are talking about the company that phased in front 10-bolt axles over several model years. There were lots of exceptions on the production line.

My '84 with auto hubs had only the auto groove.
My '79 with drive flanges had both grooves.
My '85 axle had both grooves.
My '86 M1009 axle had only the manual lockout groove (I think).
 
Dang, thanks for the pictures and all of the info. The cucv hubs are in without the snap ring so we shall see what happens.
 
They run fine without the snapring, no problem. It's kind of there to pull the seals up tight to the back of the spindle but tolerances are large enough that it's not guaranteed it'll happen anyway.

We see WAY more synchro'd 205s than auto hub D60s. Not sure if that's because the auto hubs just didn't live very long or if they built way too many synchro'd 205s but I strongly suspect the latter.

On a side note, at one point I purposely kept the auto hubs on my 'sub since they were great for winter use around here. We have too many steep driveways separated with drives down the highway and it was nice not having to get out to lock and unlock the hubs all the time. They lived OK but I was pretty gentle on them.
 
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