wasted wages
1 ton status
sounds like a lobe gone round....or best case a collapsed lifter..good luck...
Keep us posted..
Keep us posted..
CK5
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Bad Lifter?
- Thread starter livid4dirt
- Start date
Nope, intake has to come off. The pushrod holes in the head are way too small.
Gonna leave the wrenches alone today and celebrate the 4th "thanking those who have served our country and those that still are!" I will yank the intake tomorrow.
Thanx again.......Roger
Thanx again.......Roger
Pulled the intake......
Pulled the intake everything is spotless......no metal
. Cam lobes look great, the bottoms of lifters all looked like they should. New lifters and gasket set coming right up, so things are good!
Pulled the intake everything is spotless......no metal
. Cam lobes look great, the bottoms of lifters all looked like they should. New lifters and gasket set coming right up, so things are good!Check with some of the experts here about changing the lifters.
I know if you pull the lifters for any reason, normally you always put the lifters in an egg carton or something so to make sure they do not go back in different holes.
Otherwise, the wear patterns won't match, and the cam and lifter will have to "break in" again.
And they might not have that much wear left in them.
I would think that new lifters on an old cam would have the same problem.
That was why I suggested taking the guts out of a new lifter, and putting them in the lifter shell of the one that was bad.
That way, the wear part would stay the same.
But there are folks here that have more accurate opinions than me.
J.
I know if you pull the lifters for any reason, normally you always put the lifters in an egg carton or something so to make sure they do not go back in different holes.
Otherwise, the wear patterns won't match, and the cam and lifter will have to "break in" again.
And they might not have that much wear left in them.
I would think that new lifters on an old cam would have the same problem.
That was why I suggested taking the guts out of a new lifter, and putting them in the lifter shell of the one that was bad.
That way, the wear part would stay the same.
But there are folks here that have more accurate opinions than me.
J.
I like your thinking on that idea of using same lifter housing and swapping guts. Although i was under the impression that you can re-use a cam but always use new lifters. Maybe i'm having a brain fart on that idea? Thanx for the input Fordum.
DO NOT do that. The lifter components are a precise machined MATCHED tolerance item and you should never be swapping pieces from one to another.
There is no problem installing new lifters on an old cam IF the cam lobes are still good, you just CANNOT run used lifters on a new cam.
I would take his word for it. He has done a lot more of this stuff than I have.
I did exactly one gutswap....Wow, that sounded a lot better in my head than it looks on the screen.
The car had a lot of miles on it, and one lifter spring broke. We were able to snake that lifter out through the head.
It was a stock lifter. We went and got another and compared them.
Then, I took them apart, and compared metering hole sizes under a dissecting microscope in the botany lab. ( We were all going to college at the time)
Then, we snaked another one out, and did an informal, and unscientific leak-down test between the new one and the good used one.
Then, between the good used one and the rebuilt used one.
Everything seemed kosher, so we went with it.
Car ran great, for at least 2 more years before he traded it.
So, I got away with it once.
Doesn't mean a thing. I know people who have kissed a rattlesnake once.
Don't mean it will work twice.
I'd go with the experts.
No, actually, if it were my personal car, I would probably try the GutSwap again. But, I like pushing the envelope sometimes.
You should listen to him.
You know, it does not look any better with two caps either.....
J.
OK, I got curious.
Here is what Crane Cams has to say on their website.
Might not be the final word, but I freely admit that they know more than me.
I changed the pertinent part to bold italic.
<Must new (Standard Design) lifters always be installed on a new camshaft?
YES! All new standard hydraulic and mechanical camshafts must have new lifters installed. The face of these lifters have a slight crown, and the mating lobe surface they ride on has been ground with a slight taper. The purpose of this is to create a "spinning" of the lifter as it rides on the lobe. This is necessary to prevent premature wear of the lifter and lobe.
Therefore, these parts will be mated to one another during the initial break-in period. Used lifters will not mate properly, causing the lobe to fail. If you are rebuilding an engine and plan to re-use the existing cam and lifters (in the same block) it can be done, as long as the lifter goes back on the same lobe it is mated to. To keep your components in order, a Crane Cams "Organizer Tray" part number 99015-1 would be helpful. If the lifters get mixed up, they cannot be used, and a new set will be required. The new lifters would also have to go through the break-in procedure to mate to the old cam.
Can used Roller Lifters be installed on a new camshaft?
YES. "Roller" lifters are the only ones that can be re-used. This design lifter has a wheel (supported by needle bearings) attached to the bottom of it. The lobe the roller lifter rides on does not have any taper. This is a very low friction design and does not require the lifter to mate to the cam. As long as the wheel shows no wear, and the needle bearings are in good condition, the "hydraulic roller" or "mechanical roller" lifter can be re-used.>
Sounds like its ok, but you might want to consider a break in oil like they have been discussing on other threads here, and maybe do a fast runup for a few minutes, like you would for a new cam and lifters.
Again, check with the experts here about how they break in a new cam and lifters.
4X4HIGH is good, even if he does have to ask his wife how to turn off the passenger side airbags on their car....<G>.
J.
Here is what Crane Cams has to say on their website.
Might not be the final word, but I freely admit that they know more than me.
I changed the pertinent part to bold italic.
<Must new (Standard Design) lifters always be installed on a new camshaft?
YES! All new standard hydraulic and mechanical camshafts must have new lifters installed. The face of these lifters have a slight crown, and the mating lobe surface they ride on has been ground with a slight taper. The purpose of this is to create a "spinning" of the lifter as it rides on the lobe. This is necessary to prevent premature wear of the lifter and lobe.
Therefore, these parts will be mated to one another during the initial break-in period. Used lifters will not mate properly, causing the lobe to fail. If you are rebuilding an engine and plan to re-use the existing cam and lifters (in the same block) it can be done, as long as the lifter goes back on the same lobe it is mated to. To keep your components in order, a Crane Cams "Organizer Tray" part number 99015-1 would be helpful. If the lifters get mixed up, they cannot be used, and a new set will be required. The new lifters would also have to go through the break-in procedure to mate to the old cam.
Can used Roller Lifters be installed on a new camshaft?
YES. "Roller" lifters are the only ones that can be re-used. This design lifter has a wheel (supported by needle bearings) attached to the bottom of it. The lobe the roller lifter rides on does not have any taper. This is a very low friction design and does not require the lifter to mate to the cam. As long as the wheel shows no wear, and the needle bearings are in good condition, the "hydraulic roller" or "mechanical roller" lifter can be re-used.>
Sounds like its ok, but you might want to consider a break in oil like they have been discussing on other threads here, and maybe do a fast runup for a few minutes, like you would for a new cam and lifters.
Again, check with the experts here about how they break in a new cam and lifters.
4X4HIGH is good, even if he does have to ask his wife how to turn off the passenger side airbags on their car....<G>.
J.
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For the record, it is not our car (it belongs to my FIL). I would NEVER buy a BMW or the like. That is nothing more than an overpriced status thing for people trying to compensate for short comings elsewhere.
NOW, back to the topic at hand, just use Valvoline VR1 racing oil when installing a new cam or lifters and run it for at least 500 miles. It is best to keep a high idle for the first couple minutes to help with oil splash to the cam lobe and lifter since that is the only way it gets lubed (unless someone grooved the lifter bores to provide a constant oil supply to the cam lobe).
What he said.....For the record, it is not our car (it belongs to my FIL). I would NEVER buy a BMW or the like. That is nothing more than an overpriced status thing for people trying to compensate for short comings elsewhere.
NOW, back to the topic at hand, just use Valvoline VR1 racing oil when installing a new cam or lifters and run it for at least 500 miles. It is best to keep a high idle for the first couple minutes to help with oil splash to the cam lobe and lifter since that is the only way it gets lubed (unless someone grooved the lifter bores to provide a constant oil supply to the cam lobe).
Also for the record, this is the last damn post I am going to make tonight/this morning.
I have to get up in about 3 hours and have a full day ahead of me.
And, despite my personal opinion, it seems I am not as young as I used to be.
But I don't believe it.
Anyway, here is the link to the Crane Cams procedure for breaking in cams.
I figured it would be a good thing to have around here.
Especially if someone were to download it and save it here.
BTW, it looks like Crane is rising from the dead. I hope so.
Here is the link.
http://cranecams.com/pdf/548e.pdf
Wait, does that mean we have to worry about Zombie Cams???
Too Late......Must Sleep.....
J.
