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Considering Propane

L

lochenjons

1/2 ton status
Joined
Sep 13, 2006
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Location
Santa Cruz, CA
Pros? Cons? I know the obivous pros for offroad so I'm more interested in cost, availbilty, legality, etc for a truck that get also gets driven on the road. Its a little cheaper than gas but I hear you get a little worse mpg. I was looking at gotpropane.com and looks like they have kits for about $900. How ahrd is this swap? It seems pretty straightforward. Am I gonna get a hard time for running propane in Comifornia? Tell me whatcha know
 
I was reading up on it for a while and from what i found out it seems like you need to build the engine for it (bump up the CR) to run optimally. Seems like an easy enough swap you only have to run a power and ground and all the propane lines. You can probably source the parts through ebay and other places cheaper than the gotpropane.com setup too.
 
Helped a buddy do it to his truck a while back.
Only real pain is availability. He was always whining about having to fill up. 10 gallon tanks dont go very far with the loss of power and mileage. IMO, not a good idea for a DD.
 
tank not suposed to be in passenger compartment, they will refuse to fill it,.i found a 40 gal propane tank that goes where blazer tank goes when i was loooking into it....from what i uderstood you lose 1/10 of a mile every mile....so howerver much gas gets you a mile,..the same amount of propane gets you 9/10ths
 
I've also heard that with the mileage loss, you also lose some horsepower. But on the plus side, you can run your vehicle at insane angles and not get any fuel starvation problems since propane is delivered under pressure so in effect, it's like having EFI.
 
they call it a poor man's efi...

and the only reason i heard people run it is because of the angles you can drive at; which is any angle..

besides that there is no real reason to do it IMO
 
habitatxskate said:
besides that there is no real reason to do it IMO
Click to expand...

What about no fuel pump, IAC, injectors, computer etc. to have fail on you?

The good:

Propane is ridiculously simple, the fuel and equipment are cheap, very high octane (~110), oil stays clean much longer, etc.

Downsides:

Unless you run a ~11:1 or 12:1 compression ratio you will lose a little power and some mileage. Fuel is tougher to find, though if you plan a little isn't a big deal at all. Propane tanks are generally smaller, heavier and more expensive than gas tanks.



I fully plan on replacing the Q-jet on the buggy with propane in the near future :thumb:
 
I have no problem filling mine and its a duel fuel if I have to run it on gas. The mileage is about the same, if you are going to run it from the start then build an engine for it. Do not do the dual fuel set up that I have its ok but you sacrifice power on both sides. The set up is a little different for power.

Mine is for sale
 
Availabilty isnt a problem for me I just realized, theres a 76 station that has propane. According to gotpropane with propane youll get the same if not the same power.
 
lochenjons said:
Availabilty isnt a problem for me I just realized, theres a 76 station that has propane. According to gotpropane with propane youll get the same if not the same power.
Click to expand...

Propane has less energy than gasoline, if both are running correctly gas will make a little more power (only a few percent).

The guy that runs gotpropane.com claims many people get more power because most carburetors are not tuned correctly and that switching to a properly running propane setup often results in more power.
 
38377k5 said:
The guy that runs gotpropane.com claims many people get more power because most carburetors are not tuned correctly and that switching to a properly running propane setup often results in more power.
Click to expand...

Well I probably fall into that catergory so Ill prob get more power :o
 
My personal feelings on the subject are go fuel injection. You can get a holly tbi kit for less than 900. I think propane is awesome for a trail rig. I have had several freinds switch to propane and then forget to fill their tanks, have to run to that one station to get them filled, plus around here some places had no problem filling them up some places refused too, just too hit and miss for me. Plus I don't like the smell. Even a well tuned propane setup still stinks to me.
 
blazinzuk said:
My personal feelings on the subject are go fuel injection. You can get a holly tbi kit for less than 900. I think propane is awesome for a trail rig. I have had several freinds switch to propane and then forget to fill their tanks, have to run to that one station to get them filled, plus around here some places had no problem filling them up some places refused too, just too hit and miss for me. Plus I don't like the smell. Even a well tuned propane setup still stinks to me.
Click to expand...

I've heard some not so great things about the holley tbi kit. Theres several places near where I live that fill up propane...hopefully theres places like this at places I wheel like hollister hills or pismo or someplace. Plus I like the simplicity of propane without all the electronics and sensors of FI, simplicity is why I've kept the carb so long, its simple and reliable and easily fixed on the trail if something des go wrong. With propane it seems theres even less to go wrong and in my opinion by the far the most ideal fuel for the trail, while not as ideal for the road I think I can put up with the downsides
 
I just put propane on my samurai so this is all pretty fresh in my mind.

First off i'll say this, My samurai quit running quite some time ago so i'm going from memory here a little bit as to the specifics on how it ran before.

Putting the conversion on does not take too long really. I believe 2 guys could easily knock it out in a weekend. It took me 2 weeks since I don't have much time to spend on my own rigs. I did take some extra time weeding out all the old computerized carbeurator junk and so forth. I still have to remove the old fuel lines yet.

Once the conversion was done, what do ya know, the frickin' thing runs. It is a simple system,

Pressure from the tank through main pressurized supply line to the Vaccum lock off. This device uses a vaccum signal from the engine to open a valve and allow the high pressure liquid propane on through the system. No vaccum no propane. Now you have the regulator/vaporizer. This changes the high pressure liquid to low pressure vapor. This device also has two heater hose attachments to keep it from freezing up. Now the propane vapor travels via a low pressure rubber hose into the mixer where it gets mixed (go figure!) with air. The mixer sits directly on top of a throttle body which bolts to the intake via and adapter or not depending on what throttle body or intake your using.

Installation is simple, keep the lines protected. My tank is inside. I pop the tank out and bring it to the guy and tell him I need it filled. he fills it at the fill station, not in the vehicle. They have to put it on a scale where I go anyway so have no idea how they'd even do it in a vehicle. They also have no reason to refuse filling it for you. I will also be adding a second tank as a reserve.

As to performance, well it wasn't running before and it does now. The samurai is no speed demon. I am cruising to and from the shop at 60 mph. so I'm happy. It didn't do that before. Seems a bit hard starting. I think it has to do with the regulator/vaporizer being cold. Most guys that I have talked to that have used it are in warmer climates. As for MPG I haven't had enough time with it to do a good measurement. Still getting things adjusted as well.

Ignition timing is a hit and miss sort of situation. Some guys are running manifold vaccum on the dizzy. Some none at all. I have tried both and was happy with neither. I put a port in the air intake tube and its better but i'm sure its to far away from the intake to have significant vaccum. I have another solution that I will be trying this weekend.

I'm sure there is more details but I can't think of any right now. It looks kinda secksy on there. Used a K and N snowmobile air filter and made my own intake tube. Need to add a heat shield to the intake tube at some point.
 
l have talked to the guy kary (sp?) at gotpropane since he is justa mile away and know a few people that wheel with him, with two 10 gallon tanks, seems the toyota guys love the crap out of this stuff :) but they are also me mpg friendly to start.

I was directed to the guy in canada, propaneguy.com prices are nice and he claim s t have systems that can handle up to 700hp

but having gotpropane local to me is a big selling factor

being that I wil hae a thirsty motor I want to use 2 10 gal tanks and keep a spare on the trailer.
 
38377k5 said:
What about no fuel pump, IAC, injectors, computer etc. to have fail on you?

The good:

Propane is ridiculously simple, the fuel and equipment are cheap, very high octane (~110), oil stays clean much longer, etc.

Downsides:

Unless you run a ~11:1 or 12:1 compression ratio you will lose a little power and some mileage. Fuel is tougher to find, though if you plan a little isn't a big deal at all. Propane tanks are generally smaller, heavier and more expensive than gas tanks.



I fully plan on replacing the Q-jet on the buggy with propane in the near future :thumb:
Click to expand...


This pretty much sums it up. I think propane is the way to go for any trail rig with stock to mild HP. I'm going to run 'pane on my Blazer. I'll have a little less than $500 into my set up once it's installed:

$213 for a rebuilt 425 Impco mixer & evaporator & gasket for the mixer
$50 shipped for the fuel lockoff
$50 for both my propane tanks
$60 for both my tank clamps shipped
~$100 for hoses & fittings...this is just an estimate

And of course, propane is abundant where I live :D



There's a really good article on austink5 written by nonesuch on propane. Since the site went down, the files are only accessible thru texas4x4 but only to previous members of AK5. If anyone's interested, I can try to email the write up.
 
Propane is also cheap compared to gas. Had propane delivered at $1.79 the other day and gas is $3.

For a wheeler seems to me there's no question.
 
I am seriously considering this too for my trailrig. I plan to have a buggy with a 250 I-6 motor and I think that 2 10gal tanks would last quite awhile with it. I don't know the guy Cary with Gotpropane personally but I do know he wheels with one of the most hardcore rockcrawling crowds around and if it didn't work he wouldn't run it. Hell he even turbo charged his Toyota motor for more power.

I used to work at a sheetmetal shop that had a 12K rated Hyster forklift with 250 I-6 Chevy in it and even running the crap our of that forklift we would only have to replace the 10gal tanks every 4 days or so. If I can get 2 days out of a 10gal tank on my rockbuggy I would be totally fine with propane. 2 tanks on the rig and one on the trailer.

Harley
 
everyone talks up the guy from gotpropane.com, but IMO I thought he was an a$$hole when I spoke with him. I called to ask him for some help with my Impco setup and was hoping to get some stuff off of him, but before I could even finish, he was pretty much like nah well i don't sell that here so i can't help you & pretty much hung up. Damn right pissed me off. I know he's a business, but c'mon...I've called ORD (and spoken to Stephen), DIY4X (spoken to Kert), RuffStuff (spoken to Dan), Poly Performance (spoke to Dave), NWF (spoke to Max, Jason), HAD (spoke to Jess), Great Lake Offroad (spoke to Shawn)...my point being that all of these guys have been great, even when most of the time I've only called to ask questions on their products, suggestions for my Blazer build, or even asking about someone else's product.
 
The reason some of the stations here were hit and miss is because if they sell the fuel to you and don't charge you road tax, its a big ol fine for them. If your vehicle is registered they have to charge road tax. So some stations even though we just brought the tank in and told them it was a trial rig only wouldn't fill it.
 
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