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Cut and Turn Dana 60

First, like I said. You don't remove it to just rotate it on the tube. Hell, don't even undo the ubolts.
I'm not saying that the youtube dudes are wrong, but I have built many custom kingpin fronts and replaced two bad Cs with my own hammers.

If you warm up the C, the heat soaks right into the tube just as fast so they expand at the same rate. If you're worried about it, stuff a cold towel from the ice chest in the tube and around the exposed tube.

If you have someone with a bar through the C for leverage applying pressure while you hit it, it will rotate. That helps.
 
Years ago i saw a jig some BIG shop made to bolt in the housing and they had a bottle jack under the pinion and the inner "c" bolted with the knuckles on to side plates . Then the angle finder was on the top of the knuckles and pump the jack till you hit the # your shooting for .

But for 99% of us wont ever use this more than 1 time ever .
 
1-ton said:
Your saying three different video's showing guys beating the hell out of dana-60 c's with a bfh, and not getting them off, then resorting to heating them and then beating them off with a bfh where wrong?
Click to expand...

You are confusing removing with moving. He's saying, at least in part, you do not have to actually remove the C from the housing.
 
In the videos i watched they tried to just turn the c's with a bfh. That did not work. Then they had to completly remove them with a bfh and heat.

After the c's where removed they showed how the c's where slightly galled enough during the press fitting process that turning the c's on the axle tube would be like trying to turn a splined shaft. There was also a small build up of rust and dirt between the c's and axle tube.

This was the reason for completly removing the c's, and prepping the axle tube surface with a wire wheel and emory cloth. Then heating the c's again, and rinstalling them.
 
This is the only picture I have of the inside of a C fresh off the tube. This one was hammered off and there's no real galling or deformation. These are the actual Cs on my 70f in my 91.

I wouldn't let that particular scenario scare you. I have cut apart 30 axles at least with no significant or at least memorable tube issues.

Screenshot_20211222-154901_Gallery.jpg
 
I did it to my D60 when I linked it around 2010. I gouged the welds out with my plasma using a gouge tip, not a cutting tip.

Then we pressed them off in a huge press at a local shop, one took 60 tons, the other side 40 tons. Made a large noise! I was afraid to heat the C too much for fear of weakening it. But keep in mind you do weld it back on, so some heat may reduce the force necessary to pop it loose. Some people out of the rust belt have them come off much easier.

Once they were off I cleaned up the galling (caused by corrosion forming between and then pressing it off) and they were a nice snug slip fit you could tap on and it wouldn't move unless you tapped it again.

Used an angle gauge to set the caster with the pinion at the proper angle and welded them back on both the inside edge of the C and the end where the tube was flush with the C. I'd shoot for 8 degrees of caster.

Total worth it if you have the the means to do the job, driveshaft angle is much better at both ends, and more caster makes it handle better. Better all around really.

EDIT: I should add we tried with sledge hammers and huge pipes, giant pipe wrenches with the axle housing literally welded to a ~1000 lb I-beam and the torch to heat it up. They were not moving easily at all, I felt like we would destroy the inner C before we got it to budge doing that (hence the 60 tons of pressure). We had to press them off, and then we saw why, they had corroded together. The corrosion expands the iron a little and they won't budge, and when you do move them the corroded particles grind into the metal and gall it up. Once you clean that off after pressing it apart, its easy peasy. I don't think you would have that much trouble if it was an Arizona rig or something out of the rust belt. My truck I bought in TX, but the front axle was out of an old farm truck in the midwest. I guess my point is, it probably varies a lot, some pop right off after you gouge the welds out, and some take 60 tons of force or more.

I do not believe the press fit is tight from the factory, but I can't say for sure. I think its just a nice snug fit you can tap on with a small hammer. I did not remove any of the base material, I just cleaned up the galling marks and it went back together without a problem.
 
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folkenheath said:
I did it to my D60 when I linked it around 2010. I gouged the welds out with my plasma using a gouge tip, not a cutting tip.

Then we pressed them off in a huge press at a local shop, one took 60 tons, the other side 40 tons. Made a large noise! I was afraid to heat the C too much for fear of weakening it. But keep in mind you do weld it back on, so some heat may reduce the force necessary to pop it loose. Some people out of the rust belt have them come off much easier.

Once they were off I cleaned up the galling (caused by corrosion forming between and then pressing it off) and they were a nice snug slip fit you could tap on and it wouldn't move unless you tapped it again.

Used an angle gauge to set the caster with the pinion at the proper angle and welded them back on both the inside edge of the C and the end where the tube was flush with the C. I'd shoot for 8 degrees of caster.

Total worth it if you have the the means to do the job, driveshaft angle is much better at both ends, and more caster makes it handle better. Better all around really.

EDIT: I should add we tried with sledge hammers and huge pipes, giant pipe wrenches with the axle housing literally welded to a ~1000 lb I-beam and the torch to heat it up. They were not moving easily at all, I felt like we would destroy the inner C before we got it to budge doing that (hence the 60 tons of pressure). We had to press them off, and then we saw why, they had corroded together. The corrosion expands the iron a little and they won't budge, and when you do move them the corroded particles grind into the metal and gall it up. Once you clean that off after pressing it apart, its easy peasy. I don't think you would have that much trouble if it was an Arizona rig or something out of the rust belt. My truck I bought in TX, but the front axle was out of an old farm truck in the midwest. I guess my point is, it probably varies a lot, some pop right off after you gouge the welds out, and some take 60 tons of force or more.

I do not believe the press fit is tight from the factory, but I can't say for sure. I think its just a nice snug fit you can tap on with a small hammer. I did not remove any of the base material, I just cleaned up the galling marks and it went back together without a problem.
Click to expand...

I rest my case on how dicficult turning c's on dana-60 can be.
 
I have had jobs that were clean fight me hard and nasty looking sh!t jobs go stupid easy . . . Were only giving real world feedback from jobs we have done and honest answers. Atleast you get that here compared to other sites or online places with total B.S. info and god complex egos.

Hope we dont scare you away and keep us updated on that sexy truck ! :saweet:
 
1-ton said:
Your saying three different video's showing guys beating the hell out of dana-60 c's with a bfh, and not getting them off, then resorting to heating them and then beating them off with a bfh where wrong?
Click to expand...
I would use leverage instead of bfh.
Run a cheater pipe through the king pin holes and twist.
I didn't do this on a 60, but I have dealt with press fit parts and found that constant pressure from leverage does more than hammering.
Sometimes it takes both, apply leverage and persuade with a few blows
 
obijuank5 said:
First, like I said. You don't remove it to just rotate it on the tube. Hell, don't even undo the ubolts.
I'm not saying that the youtube dudes are wrong, but I have built many custom kingpin fronts and replaced two bad Cs with my own hammers.

If you warm up the C, the heat soaks right into the tube just as fast so they expand at the same rate. If you're worried about it, stuff a cold towel from the ice chest in the tube and around the exposed tube.

If you have someone with a bar through the C for leverage applying pressure while you hit it, it will rotate. That helps.
Click to expand...
I see you beat me to the answer.
Leverage is your friend
 
We tried mechanical leverage with a giant long lever arm. I think it would work sometimes, didn't on mine. It ended up taking hydraulic leverage, which is still leverage. But we couldn't get 60 tons of leverage with a cheater pipe. Maybe if we had five 200 lb guys hanging from the end of a 30 ft long pipe, then it might of achieved the same surface shear force in torque. But logistically a pipe that long with 5 guys hanging from it would need to be too large to actually work. And then how would you support the axle in that situation? And would you bend something on it?

I quickly realized if I used heat and a BFH, that the inner C may not be useable when I was done, I wanted to rotate my Cs, not destroy them.

The hydraulic press was the ticket, it put all the force directly on the inner flange of the inner C and the end of the axle tube itself, not putting any forces anywhere else.

To be honest that part was cheap, I think they guy only charged me $80 to press the stuff off. Compared to all the axle parts(locker, 35 spline outers, u-joints, kingpins, locking hubs, bearings, rotors, calipers, etc, that was small. It's just a matter of gouging the welds out and finding a large press to hire/rent. And this was a bare housing of course, I was rebuilding it before I put it in my truck.

I now have an old 50 ton press I bought used. If I raised it up a foot or set it sideways on the floor, I could probably fit an axle in it, but it might not be enough....
 
folkenheath said:
We tried mechanical leverage with a giant long lever arm. I think it would work sometimes, didn't on mine. It ended up taking hydraulic leverage, which is still leverage. But we couldn't get 60 tons of leverage with a cheater pipe. Maybe if we had five 200 lb guys hanging from the end of a 30 ft long pipe, then it might of achieved the same surface shear force in torque. But logistically a pipe that long with 5 guys hanging from it would need to be too large to actually work. And then how would you support the axle in that situation? And would you bend something on it?

I quickly realized if I used heat and a BFH, that the inner C may not be useable when I was done, I wanted to rotate my Cs, not destroy them.

The hydraulic press was the ticket, it put all the force directly on the inner flange of the inner C and the end of the axle tube itself, not putting any forces anywhere else.

To be honest that part was cheap, I think they guy only charged me $80 to press the stuff off. Compared to all the axle parts(locker, 35 spline outers, u-joints, kingpins, locking hubs, bearings, rotors, calipers, etc, that was small. It's just a matter of gouging the welds out and finding a large press to hire/rent. And this was a bare housing of course, I was rebuilding it before I put it in my truck.

I now have an old 50 ton press I bought used. If I raised it up a foot or set it sideways on the floor, I could probably fit an axle in it, but it might not be enough....
Click to expand...
You already said your case was a little more uncommon though.
There should not be the corrosion in there since normally it should be sealed welded from both sides right.
I love my press for the stuff that I do on it, yes it's not 60 ton but at 20 ton it's done everything I needed so far.
 
imiceman44 said:
You already said your case was a little more uncommon though.
There should not be the corrosion in there since normally it should be sealed welded from both sides right.
I love my press for the stuff that I do on it, yes it's not 60 ton but at 20 ton it's done everything I needed so far.
Click to expand...
For me 100% of them I've done are that way, ha ha.

Seriously though, the axle was in good shape, and from an 80s truck, it's probably quite common in the midwest. I can't speak for them all, it wasn't super rusty inside, there were still clean areas that were bare metal underneath, it doesn't take much to seize it up. But it definitely wasn't all clean and smooth like the other picture in this thread I saw. I could see the separation line all the way around the weld I gouged out, but it still wouldn't budge.

And no, the factory didn't weld the outside, most don't. It was only welded on the inside close to the pumpkin. Not sealed between the tubes at all. You should be able to see this just peaking in by the u-joint. Whatever fits between the tube and inner C can seep in from the end of tube and corrode it.

If I was doing another I would certainly try my press before I took it anywhere else. I would also try the leverage and a hammer, it might work, obijuan seems to have good luck with it where he lives.

I would just be prepared to take it to a larger press if necessary to not damage the inner C.
 
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