Detroits bad for the front?

[K5dreamer]

Ok, so ive been planning on running detroits front and rear when i swap in my DRW 1tons and 37-38.5in tires. In a different thread (made this one as not to hijack) i saw that detroits are a problem in the front when you start to loose traction... thought the point of a locker was to maintain traction? My rig has to be safe to drive on the highway as the whole focus of my build is to avoid needing a trailer, and remain street legal, and more than that, street comforateable so i can drive from D.C. to my wheeling areas near JMU and up at Rouche creek (sp).

The truck is likely to see snow use, as i also voulenteer at the hospital to pick up staff and bring them to work in bad weather. as well as mud, rocks, trails, and highway.

So id run the detroit rear obviously, but what would yall recomend for the front? i want something simple, and preferably mecanical. an e-locker, and air locker adds complication to the system, and i want the rig as simple as possible. no computers, swapping to a purely manual gear driven drivetrain. mechanical pump diesel engine, manual roll up windows, etc. etc. you get the idea.

 

[Stomis]

As far as I'm aware the concern for a front detroit is it wiping hubs when you loose and then gain traction.

Personally I would look into a Lock Rite for the front. They unlock easily, are affordable, and they work.

I dont blame you one bit for not wanting an E locker or ARB. Theres always OX lockers which are actuated by a manual cable if your looking for a selectable bare bones option.

 

[folkenheath]

I have detroits front and rear, they work great in the front because it's locked for traction but still allows turning more than a spool does. I would advise that it is a great setup for all applications except using 4WD on the street (such as icy roads). When the detroit disengages and re-engages at road speeds on pavement it causes torque steer and makes the frontend want to go every way but straight.

I rarely drive in ICY roads so for me its easy to put up with, but for frequent winter driving its not the best setup.

For what you want to do, the best would be OX or ARB, but if you want to keep it simple I would suggest a Truetrac in the front, an all gear limited slip. However, be aware that this will allow one tire to spin if you get the other tire airborne in the rocks or something, but should work just fine in winter road driving.

 

[jms]

Ok, so ive been planning on running detroits front and rear when i swap in my DRW 1tons and 37-38.5in tires. In a different thread (made this one as not to hijack) i saw that detroits are a problem in the front when you start to loose traction... thought the point of a locker was to maintain traction? My rig has to be safe to drive on the highway as the whole focus of my build is to avoid needing a trailer, and remain street legal, and more than that, street comforateable so i can drive from D.C. to my wheeling areas near JMU and up at Rouche creek (sp).

The truck is likely to see snow use, as i also voulenteer at the hospital to pick up staff and bring them to work in bad weather. as well as mud, rocks, trails, and highway.

So id run the detroit rear obviously, but what would yall recomend for the front? i want something simple, and preferably mecanical. an e-locker, and air locker adds complication to the system, and i want the rig as simple as possible. no computers, swapping to a purely manual gear driven drivetrain. mechanical pump diesel engine, manual roll up windows, etc. etc. you get the idea.

Reading your intended use of the truck, I think you're entirely on the wrong track.

 

[scottsdale86]

Not only that but its damn near impossible to turn with 4wd on and locked in the front and back. Especially if using the stock setup. I have my k10 locked front and rear because i got a good deal on CL with some axles that were built by uncle sam.

 

[K5dreamer]

Reading your intended use of the truck, I think you're entirely on the wrong track.

please elaborate. id rather get a clue now before i spend any money. what would your alternative suggestion be?

 

[K5dreamer]

I rarely drive in ICY roads so for me its easy to put up with, but for frequent winter driving its not the best setup.

quote]

well, to be honest, its not like i live in vermont or anything. really we only get snow every once in a while, such as the feb blizzard last year, and maybe 1-6 inches when it does snow.

My current setup of open front / gov bomb rear, worked perfectly in the snow in feb, until i got cut off on the highway by a semi truck. at which point my lack of snow tires caused me to slide and hit the jersey wall. Thus far the ox locker front and detroit rear seems to be the most attractive. hahaha, this darned truck is gonna look like its got a lenko transmission, manual shifter, 203 shifter, twin stick 205, and an ox lever. lol.

 

[blazin' j]

i would recommend a selectable locker up front as in ox, ard, e-locker...i say this because when ur locked up front u tend to have torque steer which will cause ur front end to push u straight in curves/turns unlike an unlocked front end...offroad, detroit no question but for driving in ice snow on road a selectable is best imo...


btw, im detroit locked front and rear but no weather issues here in la...

 

[72blazerguy]

Reading your intended use of the truck, I think you're entirely on the wrong track.

I agree with jms here. Are you building a capable trail truck or a capable highway rig?

I rarely drive in ICY roads so for me its easy to put up with, but for frequent winter driving its not the best setup.

quote]

well, to be honest, its not like i live in vermont or anything. really we only get snow every once in a while, such as the feb blizzard last year, and maybe 1-6 inches when it does snow.

My current setup of open front / gov bomb rear, worked perfectly in the snow in feb, until i got cut off on the highway by a semi truck. at which point my lack of snow tires caused me to slide and hit the jersey wall. Thus far the ox locker front and detroit rear seems to be the most attractive. hahaha, this darned truck is gonna look like its got a lenko transmission, manual shifter, 203 shifter, twin stick 205, and an ox lever. lol.

Hate to break it to you, but losing traction when a car cuts you off is part of driving on slick roads. Lockers front and rear probably aren't going to help that much. When its slick out or when it snows less than 2', I get out my unlocked blazer with good tires.

My suggestion if you don't want to spend alot of money, is to buy some good tires. Lockers will not make you invincible on slick roads.

 

[bp71k5]

The purpose of a locker is to ensure both wheels keep turning if one looses traction. The locker doesn't guarantee traction between the road and your tires.

At road speeds, a working differential is actually pretty useful. Think of it this way: Your foot is on the gas when one tire hits a patch of ice and breaks traction. The wheel then spins faster causing even more traction loss. With a locker, the other tire will tend to also rotate faster and then break traction at both wheels. With a working differential, the other tire stops getting power and hence does not loose traction.

I am not an expert, but a locker is useful for maintaining forward movement in terrain where all four tires are not always on the ground, or for drag racing. There is no use for them at highway speeds.

 

[yellowK20]

Other than cost and the above mentioned Icy road manners of a detroit there is also this to consider (as I mentioned in the other thread.) if you were to break a hub or stub shaft or axle u-joint it can also in turn break the detroit locker.

for your application I would say Lock-rite,ARB, our a limited Slip

 

[K5dreamer]

no, dont get me wrong, i realize that a patch of ice always wins, and im not looking at the detroits to improove traction in ice. i guess maybe i worded that bad. But what i wanted to know, was will putting a detroit in the front make it handle WORSE if i have to drive in the snow, which seems to be a resounding yes.

The intent for this truck is....

PRIMARY - camping rig, offroad wheeling rig, play toy.
SECONDARY - tool, for hauling stuff to the dump, moving furniture for friends, doing runs for the local hospital on the rare occasion that they need 4x4 voulunteers.

REQUIREMENT - cannot be a trailer queen. i cannot afford, nor do i have space for a tow rig and trailer. so it must be capible of driving on the highway, at speed, safely. this does not mean it has to be a daily driver, i have the 2000 jetta TDI for that.

so thus far, the advice im gonna have to run with is detroit in the rear, and selectable in the front. I like the ox the best, because its cable operated, and if the cable breaks, it reverts to open meaning its good to drive home down the road, AND you can buy an threaded insert to lock it while youre on the trail. seems the most reliable setup to me compaired to the e-locker or ARB.

the only kicker is, now that i read the thread on the jana 76, i wanna put D70 stuff in my front pumpkin.... but the OX only has availability for the D60 stuff.... meh, my rig dosnt need warrant D70 guts in the front anyway i suppose.

 

[jms]

...
the only kicker is, now that i read the thread on the jana 76, i wanna put D70 stuff in my front pumpkin...

That's webwheeler talk right there. How many D60 R&Ps have YOU broken?

I find it remarkable how many people on this board are deathly afraid of ARBs...

 

[K5dreamer]

That's webwheeler talk right there. How many D60 R&Ps have YOU broken?

I find it remarkable how many people on this board are deathly afraid of ARBs...

no, i agree 100% that the jana 76 is cool, but i dont really need it. i just get exciteable sometimes. hell, the only reason i went with the 1 tons at all was i needed DRWs to run the H1 beadlocks, and i got a great price on em. 3/4 tons really would do me just fine more than likely.

as to the ARB, its really not as much about fear, as lazyness. i dont wanna run all the hoses and compressor, and switches, and solenoids, and all that chit that im sure would be needed. I just like mechanically operated things better. in my experience they are just more reliable.

 

[K5dreamer]

That's webwheeler talk right there.

K5dreamer = webwheeler extrordinare... but admitting it is the first step to recovery

 

[jms]

...
as to the ARB, its really not as much about fear...

Yeah, that's what they all say ...

I'd double-check the track record of the Ox - the locker itself, and the company...

 

[jms]

... and just on a side note: you don't have an air compressor in your truck?

 

[scottsdale86]

All the above crap plus not to mention price.

 

[K5dreamer]

Yeah, that's what they all say ...

I'd double-check the track record of the Ox - the locker itself, and the company...

will do

... and just on a side note: you don't have an air compressor in your truck?

nope. is that so rare?

 

[yellowK20]

Yeah, that's what they all say ...

I'd double-check the track record of the Ox - the locker itself, and the company...

I've heard some not so great things about the OX involving machine work and case strength , that was in Jeep axles though maybe the 60 stuff is better