Drive Too Far Forward in Metric Starter?

[uglytruk]

I bought this metric starter from a local shop, and the drive wouldn't disengage the flywheel. So I brought it back to the small shop I bought it from, and he claims to have opened it and moved the shift fork to the proper location in the drive, (it was behind drive). Still Doesn't look right to me. I have it posing next to a regular starter for some reference.
What do youz guyz think?

 

[azblazor]

The bottom pictures look pretty similiar as far as the gear stick out. Is that what you are asking? The nose cone itself looks shorter to me though.

 

[1BadK-30]

sry to hijack your thread but im having trouble with my starter and one of yours it would work for me

which one is this circled and is it for a 350? and if so where did you get it? autozone keeps giving me one that wont grab onto the flywheel and yours looks like it would work. it looks like it sticks out some ways but could be the angle

 

[uglytruk]

Hi-jack? Hell no, blast away!

These are for DEEZELS, they are very similar, but prob won't fit small block. Much longer body, maybe different nose? You may have a starter for a different size flywheel. (Chev offered two?) I thunk the diff is starter bolts. Some are accross on one and diag on the other??? Thoughts???PS, How'd you draw the line 'round the starter? NEATO!

These are not the best pix due to angle. The issue is simply that the drive (gear) is too far out on the shaft. I'll take some more pix...

 

[1BadK-30]

ahh man i was really hopping that it would fit for my motor so i could solve this problem of it knocking and being so darn loud.

 

[uglytruk]

Here are a few more small block vs deezel starters

Pay attention to the alignment of the bolts. Much older ones had the bolts opposite as opposed to diagonal. the SB and deezel have the same bolt spacing. so the nose is very similar, if not identical. I didn't measure the distance from the flange to the shaft on different noses, but I would guess it may be diff because Chev offered two diff flywheel sizes. But I know no more. sorry...

 

[1BadK-30]

thanks a bunch, i guess im going to have to get autozone to pull both sets out so i can examin and get the correct one.

ps, i just paint shop pro and the eraser tool to circle the starter.

 

[imiceman44]

thanks a bunch, i guess im going to have to get autozone to pull both sets out so i can examin and get the correct one.

ps, i just paint shop pro and the eraser tool to circle the starter.

Are you sure you need a longer nose?
Do you have a 168 teeth flywheel or 153?
That is the only difference chevy had with starters for a small block.
They say auto V/s manual, I always swaped those around.
Shimming is another issue, you might need to shim your starter to make it work.
I had one truck that took me weeks to get it to engage.

 

[1BadK-30]

not sure on the teeth on the flywheel but its a 1982 stock 305 flywheel., we have never had to shim it before, but autozone insist we do it.

 

[imiceman44]

not sure on the teeth on the flywheel but its a 1982 stock 305 flywheel., we have never had to shim it before, but autozone insist we do it.

Did you tell them it's a 305?
You most probably have a 153 teeth.
You will need a 9teeth pinion on you starter, I will ask my friend for the part number, it took him a few trys with Autozone to finally get the right one.
As for shims, each starter case is different, some will have a stamp on them saying how much to shim.
I had a starter with shims on my diesel burb, and now I got a gear reduction starter and on the case is stamped, do not shim

 

[uglytruk]

Most deezel starters are cast "do not shim", even the old style. IMO the shims just tweak the meshing. Too tight and it'll "screech" after the engine starts. really tight and it'l screech while it's cranking. Not a pretty sound!. Or not dis-engage the flywheel when you let go of the key. I've heard plenty of starters, gas & deezel, that are obviously missing the shims, and it sorta' sounds like a loose fanbelt, just more mechanical.
Hard to imagine you're having this prob. The 305/350 is the most common engine, unless someone's changed something. Where's the starter/nose that wuz working on it?

 

[BKinzey]

Uhhhhhh? Will this help? As I'm not sure of the problem

My 1986 GMC Unit Repair Manual states:

Pinion Clearance Check
Can't be adjusted but should be checked
1 Disconnect the motor field connector from the solenoid & insulate
2 Connect a battery from the Solenoid Switch Terminal to the Solenoid Frame
3 MOMENTARILY flash a jumper from the Solenoid Motor Terminal to the Solenoid Frame. This will shift the pinion into cranking position and it will remain until the battery is disconnected.
4 Push the Pinion back towards the Communtator to eliminate slack.
5 Measure the distance. Should be between .3mm to 3.6mm or .01" to .14"

That covers the 5MT, 10MT and 27MT. Your new one is a 28MT (??) and I suppose it should be the same right?

 

[uglytruk]

I guess you're not clear on my prob. The manual describes ejecting the drive by energizing the solenoid. Lots of sentences to describe hitting the little screw with 12 volts!
My issue is that the metric unit is improperly assembled. The drive is halfway out. And the shop says he fixed it. Lots of wasted labor to install it just to check... anf BTW, pinion can be adjusted. heat and bend the shift fork. Crude, bet it's a Cheby... Now if only my guy had put the fork in the right place...