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fender washers in kingpins on 31's?

muddybuddy

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well i put the 42's on and was getting really bad death wobble, so i put fender washers (3 on each side) between the caps and the springs. i had to take the 42's off so i could go get it aligned, and while driving it there it almost seemed like the death wobble was worse than before. is it just because with 31's you dont need the fender washers, only with big tires? when i put the 42's back on is it still going to act like that or should it be reduced because the extra weight of the bigger tires? thanks
 
Is there a steering stabilizer on the axle.

no steering stablizer (reverse hi-steer), but hydro-assist is going to be getting installed soon. i just wanted to try to get it running w/o issues before it just gets covered up with the hydro-assist
 
I would put the 42s on and give it a try. I ran 41s with 2 fender washers in each side. Im running 38s now with the same setup with an old steering stabilizer with no death wobble at all. Are all the components on the axle in good condition.
 
I would put the 42s on and give it a try. I ran 41s with 2 fender washers in each side. Im running 38s now with the same setup with an old steering stabilizer with no death wobble at all. Are all the components on the axle in good condition.

yea everything looks pretty good. the axle was in another truck i had and with 39.5 boggers that truck never had any death wobble and didnt have any fender washers in it either. once its aligned ill put the 42's back on and see how it is.
 
Big tires are what really cause death wobble. With 31's you shouldn't have to add any washers to eliminate death wobble.

What does your alignment look like?
 
Big tires are what really cause death wobble. With 31's you shouldn't have to add any washers to eliminate death wobble.

What does your alignment look like?

If the alignment was set with the larger tires it will be WAAAAYYYYY off with the smaller tires. That could be the cause right there.

Dik
 
you check the spindle nuts with the truck jacked up in the air??i tighted mine down on the ground and they didnt get tight all the way i had the dw when i turned
 
If the alignment was set with the larger tires it will be WAAAAYYYYY off with the smaller tires. That could be the cause right there.

Dik

so i should get it aligned with the 42's on or with 31's? i thought youd want to have it as close to "stock" as possible so the machine would read it easier. im taking the truck back to get aligned on tuesday so i can put whatever tires on there for alignment purposes. its got the 31s on right now but i can just put the 42's back on if thats the better way to align it
 
Big tires are what really cause death wobble. With 31's you shouldn't have to add any washers to eliminate death wobble.

What does your alignment look like?

yea i figured that washers with 31's would cause it to drive funny, im gona try putting the 42's on tomorrow and see how it is. i did put 3 washers in on each side, i duno how many everybody else put in?
 
so i should get it aligned with the 42's on or with 31's? i thought youd want to have it as close to "stock" as possible so the machine would read it easier. im taking the truck back to get aligned on tuesday so i can put whatever tires on there for alignment purposes. its got the 31s on right now but i can just put the 42's back on if thats the better way to align it


You will have to adjust your toe when you make that much of a jump in tire diameter. It has to do with how far your measuring point is from the center of the hub. Also the amount of recommended toe is different based on the size of the tire.

I am not 100% but I think the smaller tires require more toe in.

Dik
 
When my alignment shop sets toe-in they set it by toe angle, because it is more accurate and easier for them to measure. You don't have to account for tire size when doing it this way.

When measuring toe-in, with a tape measure, you have to account for the size of the tire so you get the proper toe-in angle.

My Chilton manual says:

Years____________________Toe-in (Inches) ____________Toe-in(Degrees)
'80-'81 K30_______________ 0 +-1/8"__________________ 0+-1/4*
'82-'84 K30_______________ 3/16" +-1/8"_______________ 3/8 +- 1/4*
'85-'87 K30 V30___________ 0 +-1/8"___________________ 0 +-1/4*

To figure the toe-in measurement using degrees you use this formula: SIN .375*=X/tire diameter
X is the distance you set the toe.

So with 31" tires and a 3/8* toe adjustment the formula would look like this:
SIN .375 = .0065
.0065 X 31 = X
.2015" = X

To figure out what the toe-in measurement for your tire size should be just multiply your actual (measured) tire size by .0065.

So when you were setting the toe-in you would:
1: Put a mark on the center of the tread on each front tire, I use masking tape with a vertical pen mark on it .
2: Set the axle on jack stands with the front tires off the ground and the wheels straight ahead.
3: Measure from the ground to the center of the front hub.
4: Rotate one tire so the mark is at the front and the same distance from the ground as the hub was.
5: Do the same for the other tire.
6: Measure the distance between the marks.
7: Write this measurement down.
8: Rotate the marks to the rear and measure from the ground like you did in step 4.
9: Now repeat step 6.
The rear measurement (step 9) should be .2015" or a little more than 3/16" (.1875") longer than the front measurement (step 9).
If not adjust the tie rod adjuster and repeat steps 4-9.

I hope this helps someone, I know it may not help you because you are paying someone to do the work.

When the alignment shop does the alignment it will be correct no matter the tire size.

How long has the axle been sitting not used? Have you jacked the axle up to see if anything is loose? Tie rod ends, drag link ends, pitman arm, kingpins top and bottom, wheel bearings, leaf spring bolts, or u-bolts.

By putting the fender washers in all you are doing is increasing the spring pressure on the kingpin bushing. If the kingpin bushing or the bottom kingpin bearing is worn it will still let the knuckle move side to side on the kingpin no matter how much downward pressure you put on the bushing.

By putting more washers in the most you will do is make it steer harder and wear out the plastic bushings faster.

Mike
 
thanks alot mike, i was going to pay, just to make sure it was correct, but if your way will work without spending the $$ then im all for it. i kinda did it when i had the front on jack stands, but i dont think i was as precise at measuring as the way you did it. i measured from the center of the rim lip to center of rim lip on the front and then did the same for the rear and then make the rear ~.5" longer for the toe in, but that was with the 31" tires. according to your calculations, i should do .0065x40 = .26 with my 42's. ill get more precise measurements and give it a shot. thanks mike
 
The alignment shop will also check your caster and camber.

Check this out if you want to know more about wheel alignment. http://www.familycar.com/alignment.htm

The easiest way to change the caster is to use degree shims between the springs and the spring perches. This will also affect the driveshaft angle. Another way to change caster is to cut the inner C forgings off and rotate them. Then weld them back on. My Chilton manual says caster should be 8*.

To change the camber they used to make a shim you could put between the knuckle and the spindle. I don't know if they still make that or not. The only thing that would change camber is a bent axle housing or worn out parts. Upper and lower kingpins and wheel bearings. My Chilton manual says camber should be:

Years______________________Min___________Prefered____________Max
'80-'84_____________________-3/16*________1/2*_______________1 3/16*
'85-'87_____________________3/4*__________1 1/2*_____________2*

Mike
 

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