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Flat tow with brake actuator

B

bdegs

1/2 ton status
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Obviously the major downside of flat towing is the lack of brakes and non-fixed front end... but has anyone tried overcoming that?

The problem: I have a heavy K5 with D60/D70hd axels, 454 tied to a 203/205 doubler, running on M1 wheels wrapped in 39.5" tires and I'd like to tow it with my Diesel Colotado - tow rating of 7500#

Solutions? What if I add an electric/hydraulic brake actuator to my K5 so I can brake the rear axle when towing? What if I fab up something that fixes the steering? Other options?
 
here is a dexter hydro pump for this type of stuff on trailers with hydro brakes . http://www.dexterpartsonline.com/page/407541566 never seen anyone use one for this type of system you are thinking but maybe it would work . could put in 2 shut off valves 1 after the master/prop valve to isolate the system and 1 after the electric pump for when your not towing it . do this so they both dont try and over fill fluids and or super low pedal .

and with the wheel base length you do want the axle to steer in the front a bit . even farm wagons have some sort of front axle steering be it tie/rod and knuckle or solid axle 5th wheel turning plate . otherwise the tires would bind you up so bad it would make your tow vehicle not turn . years ago i ran a rollback tow truck and had my safety chains to tight on the vehicle i was towing on the rear wheel lift and when i tried to make a hard turn it bound up so bad i couldnt turn the whole med duty tow truck worth a crap .

have you looked in to a tow dolley ? they can be had with electric brakes on them . and this could be the ticket and worst case have to put on 2 smaller tires up front just when towing to fit inside the fenders . be a lot better option i think over all the work on the trail rig and also use it for other stuff if need be . and its got its own turning system to solve your problem .
 
Exactly what I was thinking with the shut off valves and thanks for the steering clarification. I'm not a master tow-er by any means.

Over thought about a dolly but definitely don't want to pull these huge tires. The more convenient the more I'll use it. Someone on here was building a custom heavy duty dolly that looked great but no brakes and a huge pricetag. Maybe I'll fab one up myself
 
If you used 2 sets of disc brake brackets you could add a second set of calipers. You could then have a dedicated towing brake on the rear axle. Not sure on the actuator. I had a military trailer with a hydraulic surge brake, might work in that setup.
 
Flat towing tends to have problems when the towed vehicle weighs more than the towing vehicle, has a bad habit of bossing around the towing vehicle. Plus the wear on the offroad tires cuts into the wallet.

Since you mentioned "the more convenient the more I'll use it", why not go to a 7k rated flatbed or car hauler trailer? combined weight would be within the rating of the truck and they can be picked up for cheap.
 
Going with a full trailer sounds like the popular option. I guess I'm just worries about adding even more weight.

I might need to go to the dump and weigh the beast. Any idea how much the average 7k hauler weighs? If the Colorado has a tow rating of 7500# do you think I can get away with a trailer/blazer combo that weighs that much?
 
1200-2500 lbs seems to be the common weight range for that size of trailer. It is some extra weight getting near max but you gain alot more control as compared to flat towing.
 
i have driven a lot of years for work and also been a tow truck guy for over 5+ years . . . .

i will say this DO NOT push these so called tow ratings to the limits . seen way to many small vehicles get wrecked from trailers pushing them all over the place and trashing good stuff .

this k30 truck i built i just ran it over the scale . no plow on its 6,300 lbs by its self 40 gal of gas nothing in the bed other than rubber floor mat .

so if your k5 is on 1tons and huge tires and all geared out your in the same class as me for weight .

1227181605a.jpg
 
Thanks for the info. That's exactly what I was worried about. In your opinion should I try to:
1) Find a #1200 trailer and come in around #7500 against the #7700 rating,
2) Fab up a dolly with brakes, weighing less than a full trailer,
3) Fab up a row bar and brake actuator on the K5 and flat tow it?

I know everyone advises against flat towing but it seems attractive to me as the lightest and lowest center of gravity option. And if I manufacturer a braking system on it.. how different is it from a flat trailer anyway?
 
In my opinion and experience it's not the braking when flat towing that is the biggest problem, it's turning. A lighter towing vehicle has zero control over a heavier towed vehicle. See this ALOT with the folks in the military surplus vehicle groups.

Some of my personal experiences with it. Friend towing my old m35a2 deuce and a half (about 13,500 lbs) with his m923 5 ton (about 21,000 lbs) using a towbar. driving through town at about 40mph when we ran over a few rocks that were maybe half the size of a fist near some road construction when we suddenly feel the back end of the 5 ton start getting pulled off the road and something dragging like an anchor. The front tires of the deuce had turned all the way to the right when they went over those rocks (we'd been driving in a straight line).

95 2 door yukon pulling a 98 land cruiser (cruiser is a bit heavier, like your setup). Making a wide left turn and the land cruiser decides it doesn't want to follow, nearly jacknifed the vehicles in the turn. Ended up having 1 person steer the land cruiser through turns while the other person drove the yukon.
 
The description of your experience definitely helps me realize the does of flat towing. Thanks.

I'm thinking a custom dolly might be the best answer. Should track better making the turns less dangerous and it will be significantly lighter than a full trailer.

Anyone have suggestions for what to include in in the dolly build?
 
better figure a lot out such as over all width of the dolly for legal road width spec .
tire capacity and wheel hubs with the brakes .
tow dolly units have a turning plate the vehicles tires sit on and strap down .
what kind of frame work you plan to use ?
i would suggest looking at a few tow dolly units first hand with your rig there next to it and a tape measure . take lots of notes .
as i said before them big tires will kill it for you on width if going on a dolly . you dont want to make it ride to high also as center of gravity will kill it for safe highway speed.
 
I don't have a tig setup or experience so the frame will be steel. I've seen a few dollys but none with turning plates yet - still on the hunt so I can get a better model for building.

The width is definitely going to be an issue... thinking through different options like perhaps tires in front and behind the K5 tires, or replacing the fronts for the tow...

If I dolly, will the K5 suspension do the work or will I need some sort of suspension on the dolly?
 
pin in the center of almost all dolly units is for some degree of turning in the unit .

and dolly units with brakes . just make sure the gvw of the dolly will be good for your rig . https://www.campingworld.com/roadmaster-universal-tow-dolly-with-electric-brakes

and about any dolly will need skinny tires to fit our stuff in and if dana 60 best measure for sure and maybe tall skinny tires to help .

and i hate to say it again but i think that Colorado is a bit small for all this weight . its going to push you around i think .

s-l1000.jpg


p-5934-master_tow_dolly_80thdsb_with_surge_brakes.jpg
 
red EOD said:
In my opinion and experience it's not the braking when flat towing that is the biggest problem, it's turning. A lighter towing vehicle has zero control over a heavier towed vehicle. See this ALOT with the folks in the military surplus vehicle groups.

Some of my personal experiences with it. Friend towing my old m35a2 deuce and a half (about 13,500 lbs) with his m923 5 ton (about 21,000 lbs) using a towbar. driving through town at about 40mph when we ran over a few rocks that were maybe half the size of a fist near some road construction when we suddenly feel the back end of the 5 ton start getting pulled off the road and something dragging like an anchor. The front tires of the deuce had turned all the way to the right when they went over those rocks (we'd been driving in a straight line).

95 2 door yukon pulling a 98 land cruiser (cruiser is a bit heavier, like your setup). Making a wide left turn and the land cruiser decides it doesn't want to follow, nearly jacknifed the vehicles in the turn. Ended up having 1 person steer the land cruiser through turns while the other person drove the yukon.
Click to expand...
I forgot about that, it did happen a lot so learned to slow down a lot before the curves and take the curve sloooow.
And my crew cab was no lightweight.
Actually I just towed this year to moab with my big rig and a car trailer.
When the electric brakes were not working I took a turn and had to stop in panic and it pushed the rear end of my semi truck sideways
 
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