Forking window!

[K5Jimmy]

Years ago I replaced my window motors, felt, etc. Not long after that my passenger side started working intermittently only went halfway down, super slow, etc. So I had some time on my hands and decided to fix it again.

I've had the solenoid kit sitting on a shelf for awhile (12 years?) decided the time was right to fix it. Wired in the upgrade, it worked faster but still quit halfway down. So I bought a new motor (ac delco), made in china, it was shiney and life was gonna be good again. Swapped the motor, cleaned the blood off my arms, plugged it all in with new switch and had a super zippy window that went all the way up and down.

That was 2 weeks ago. Yesterday on the way home from town, I zippy'd it down, wind in my hair, full tank of gas, large truck stop coffee, Fred Eaglesmith cranked....I was farting thru silk.

Got home, went to put the window up...no zippy. Solenoids clicked, no zippy, nada. So I took it all apart, everything still looked right, made in china motor was still shiney, I wiggled eveything around, still nothing. Lucky l accidently ordered 2 motors last time, so I disconnected the regulator to change out my shiney new chinese motor, got the window lifted in place and braced just as it started to rain. I left my tools on the floorboard, cleaned the blood off my arms, fixed a big glass of ice water flavored with Jim Beam, sat on my porch watching it rain and had politically incorrect thoughts about shiney new chinese window motors. I'll work on it later.

 

[rampage]

You must mean the relay kit, not solenoid.
Wonder why the motors die. Have you tested them after you take them out and do they smell like anything has burned inside? And just out of curiosity, when you first overhauled your window, did you clean and re-lube the channel that the rollers slide in. The original grease turns hard after many years and slows down the motor. If you have the original grease that could be killing the motors.

 

[wasted wages]

Meanwhile in China there is a shiny new window motor maker guy kicked back with a hot sake and a few hot geisha girls tending to his every need thinking.... stupid Americans....

 

[K5Jimmy]

You must mean the relay kit, not solenoid.
Wonder why the motors die. Have you tested them after you take them out and do they smell like anything has burned inside? And just out of curiosity, when you first overhauled your window, did you clean and re-lube the channel that the rollers slide in. The original grease turns hard after many years and slows down the motor. If you have the original grease that could be killing the motors.

I cleaned and relubed the first time I redid the motor and replaced the felts. I cleaned and relubed this last time also, the felt is still in good shape and clean. The old motor never smelled, but it ran slow and "paused" when I played with it after removal.

On the relay, with everything connected, I get 0v to the motor when I operate the switch. With the relay unplugged, I have 14 ohm to the motor from the plug, 12v from the switch when operated. The relay clicks when plugged in and switch operated.

I can probe the output to the motor at the splice and have no volts with the switch operated. (used a variety of grounds) I swapped relays with the same result. I have spares from the driver side kit which is not installed. No smells or discoloration, no heat, etc. I think I should have voltage to the motor when the relay clicks since that should be all relay function. It measures 0v at both up and down splices. I'm sure the splices are good since I have 14 ohms looking at the motor from the plug. All these measurements are for both relays (up and down). Using a Fluke.

It just now occurred to me to plug up the uninstalled motor to see what happens. I can't do that until Monday since we have a housefull this weekend.

What am I overlooking, missing, or under thinking?

 

[rampage]

I cleaned and relubed the first time I redid the motor and replaced the felts. I cleaned and relubed this last time also, the felt is still in good shape and clean. The old motor never smelled, but it ran slow and "paused" when I played with it after removal.

Two reasons that it may be pausing when you tested it. First and most likely is that just behind the white cap on the motor assembly where the harness plugs into is a protective thermal contact switch. When too much current passes through the motor the contacts heat up and break contact with each other to protect the motor and when they cool down they make contact again. Second reason is that the same grease that GM used for the window tracks is also used for the 3 gears inside the motor assembly. If they weren’t cleaned off when it was rebuilt then they could be catching. If you’re so inclined just drill out the 12 rivets and IIRC a clip of some sort on the shaft you see and take a look inside. You can use something like 10/24 bolts to reassemble. And just as a side note, when I rebuilt a window motor I tested it and it lifted a 50 lb weight 4 ft (think it was 10A - I’d have to find my notes). It slowed down a good bit but never stalled.

On the relay, with everything connected, I get 0v to the motor when I operate the switch. With the relay unplugged, I have 14 ohm to the motor from the plug, 12v from the switch when operated. The relay clicks when plugged in and switch operated.

0V? Obviously not right. You do have the a probe on each of the wires going to the motor as opposed to one motor grounded to the body and the other to one of the motor wire?. The wires switch polarity (via the switch) depending on if it’s in the up or down position. So if you have one probe of your meter on chassis ground and the other measuring the ground wire of the motor I could see you getting 0V.
14 ohms going to the motor sounds about right, just measuring the windings on the motor.

I can probe the output to the motor at the splice and have no volts with the switch operated. (used a variety of grounds) I swapped relays with the same result. I have spares from the driver side kit which is not installed. No smells or discoloration, no heat, etc. I think I should have voltage to the motor when the relay clicks since that should be all relay function. It measures 0v at both up and down splices. I'm sure the splices are good since I have 14 ohms looking at the motor from the plug. All these measurements are for both relays (up and down). Using a Fluke.

on the Fluke

Let me think about this overnight - need to start packing for a trip. Should get back to you tomorrow on what else it could be.

 

[K5Jimmy]

OK!! I a Dumbass! Relay operates because it uses factory window voltage at the switch. ...no voltage out of the relay is direct from the battery.....because the 15a inline fuse is blown. Duh!!

 

[rampage]

OK!! I a Dumbass! Relay operates because it uses factory window voltage at the switch. ...no voltage out of the relay is direct from the battery.....because the 15a inline fuse is blown. Duh!!

That could be a problem!
Both windows operating at the same time can pull 20A which is why there’s a 20A (? or is it 30A) fuse for the windows.