Front suspension and steering issues/questions

[HawK5]

Hey guys, I’ve got some issues with my front end I need some help with:
1. Bump steer, after reading a thread from Stephen from 2017 I’m pretty sure my drag link is too flat, I just don’t know if I need a different pitman arm or what..
2. There is a bit of slop, the steering wheel feels more like a suggestion as to what direction the wheels are pointing, but any outside influence makes the wheels go a different direction and I have to over correct to get them pointing where I want..
3. There is a popping sound that happens as I turn the wheel that has recently started after I disconnected the front sway while rock crawling. I’ve reconnected the sway bar and it persists, found a torn sway bar bushing and replaced it, no change. It can be felt with your hands on any piece of the steering component throughout, but sounds loudest near the steering box/driver side front leaf spring mount, it feels like something is binding and releasing suddenly.
4. The front end of the truck shakes constantly, seems to change at different wheel speeds, and can be tamed for a second with steering input but returns immediately.. I have had the wheels and tires balanced which seemed to help for a little while but it returned..

I need some trained eyes to look at my front end, tell me what is right and what is wrong as all of this work was done by the PO. The frame has been welded and beefed up at the steering box, so I don’t think that’s the issue.. I know it’ll never drive like a Porsche but it’s gotten to the point where it makes me nervous driving it on the highway and quite frankly it’s not fun to drive which defeats the purpose of having a rig like this..

 

[sweetk30]

Stock pitman arm on the steering box will fix that drag link angle proble. . You are over corrected with both drop pitman and raised steering arm on axle .

 

[Blue85]

The best way to find loose stuff is to have someone else steer while you look and listen. Be careful, as there are some places not safe for your hands. A prybar also helps on balljoints, TREs, etc. Definitely put a wrench on the steering gear bolts to make sure they are tight. You usually can't see frame problems until the box is removed. Look for the springs moving side to side, especially at the center pins or the bushings being blown out. The upper shackle bushing always blows out, but you don't always hear it until the weight is transferring on and off the front end.

You might look through the advice in this one, too: https://ck5.com/forums/threads/sloppy-scary-steering.343396/

 

[HawK5]

Yeah I’ve done the old turn the wheel while someone looks listens and feels with 3 different mechanically inclined people, and there is nothing obvious.. all though the drag link ends do have a little slop..
I’m wondering if getting an alignment is due..
It also sounds like I should consider cross over steering.. I’ve definitely experienced the steering lock up with the drivers wheel fully drooped..

 

[HankScorpio]

Crossover helps a lot.
There isn't much to align. Toe is adjustable. Camber is fixed. Caster can only be changed with angled shims on the leaf springs. The drag link only centers the steering wheel. An alignment check would confirm if you needed to change something but its not a simple adjustment other than the toe.
Check the spring pins, they can break and make a popping noise.
I would loose the sway bar. Causes binding on a lifted truck and the springs are usually plenty stiff.
Check the ball joints.
Check the wheel bearings.
Check the bushings at the shackles, spring side and frame side.
Check the shock bushings.

 

[HawK5]

Yeah I was thinking of checking the toe, but I suppose I could put a tape measure on the tires to make sure it’s in the ball park, sounds like they should be slightly toe in?

I gather The sway bar isn’t really necessary? My concern would be a potential roll over on the highway if I have to make a quick maneuver to avoid a collision.. but maybe it’s not that big of deal?

Good call on all of those bushings and center pins, how does one check the ball joint and wheel bearings? Jack the truck up and see if the tire wiggles around?

 

[HankScorpio]

Yeah I was thinking of checking the toe, but I suppose I could put a tape measure on the tires to make sure it’s in the ball park, sounds like they should be slightly toe in?

I gather The sway bar isn’t really necessary? My concern would be a potential roll over on the highway if I have to make a quick maneuver to avoid a collision.. but maybe it’s not that big of deal?

Good call on all of those bushings and center pins, how does one check the ball joint and wheel bearings? Jack the truck up and see if the tire wiggles around?

Toe in.
Yes, jack up truck, grab tire at top and bottom and wiggle tire up and down. Should be tight. If it moves its ball joint or wheel bearing. Hard to both lift tire and watch the joints, need a helper.

 

[skunked]

1/8" toe-in has been my target. Take the wheels off and use angle iron across the rotor face.

Any slop in that drag link is going to cause a problem. Also inspect the upper spring hangers (at the shackle), they look like the OE style with the smaller bushing that wear out fast.

 

[sweetk30]

Drag link between axle and steering box is for steering wheel centering .

Tie rod kuckle to knuckle is toe .

No slop is always best otherwise you are chasing your adjustments in slop .

 

[Blue85]

the drag link ends do have a little slop..
It also sounds like I should consider cross over steering.. I’ve definitely experienced the steering lock up with the drivers wheel fully drooped..

If a DLE (or other steering component) has slop, it should be replaced. That's a no-brainer. Then you can move on to whether or not there are additional issues.

You should totally research crossover. The truth is that under some conditions bump steer is worse. But that's compared to a properly set up push-pull steering system, which hasn't been done yet.

Oh, "mechanically inclined" is not the same thing as vast experience with square bodies. 10x more true if they haven't put pry bars and such on all the components. Also, never jump to the idea that "everything needs to be replaced." There are so many crap parts on the market today, and every swap leaves opportunities for stuff to be done wrong that an old part that hasn't failed is better left in place. Help yourself out and use science.

 

[Stephen]

I kind of skimmed this so others may have hit these points too.

look for cracks in your main eye brackets
your pop could be shifting crossmembers from loose rivets. Same with the shackle hanger bracket. And shackle bushings. Or slotted out main eye bolt holes
welding stuff together is on the table. Make the main eye bracket all one piece (or put on our new one) Weld the crossmember to pieces together. Put some weld between the crossmember and frame. If you don't have a box brace, definitely do that. Look for cracks in the engine crossmember, it's common. We have a new one because of it.

We have a crossover swaybar too if you find you need it.

 

[Keitha]

I had a pop in mine and it turned out to be a slipping Pitman arm on the steering box shaft. I didn't think that could happen, but the internal teeth on the stock one were all worn down. Under load, when turning, I would feel a pop. The steering wheel would be off center by a bit.

 

[HawK5]

Yeah the thought crossed my mind that was actually one of my first thoughts, but the steering wheel isn’t changing clock positions.. and sometimes the popping is loud under harder load and some times quieter or less intense with less steering load..

 

[sweetk30]

I had a pop in mine and it turned out to be a slipping Pitman arm on the steering box shaft. I didn't think that could happen, but the internal teeth on the stock one were all worn down. Under load, when turning, I would feel a pop. The steering wheel would be off center by a bit.

Had a drop pitman arm after 20 years do the same . It can happen for sure .

 

[imiceman44]

Yeah I was thinking of checking the toe, but I suppose I could put a tape measure on the tires to make sure it’s in the ball park, sounds like they should be slightly toe in?

I gather The sway bar isn’t really necessary? My concern would be a potential roll over on the highway if I have to make a quick maneuver to avoid a collision.. but maybe it’s not that big of deal?

Good call on all of those bushings and center pins, how does one check the ball joint and wheel bearings? Jack the truck up and see if the tire wiggles around?

So did you check on the spring pins?
Having the sway bar helps take a load off the spring pin, when you removed it it's possible you sheared the pin on driver side.
I would look for evidence on the spring from movement back and forth.
The other thing I had happen was ball joints, I had never greased them and they started popping when I turned one big pop.
Greased them and the popping went away