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Got a question about my wife's...JEEP!?

Redwookie

Redwookie

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Howdy fellas. SO here's the story my wife just ahd to have her one of thos Jeep Wagoneers as she grew up loving them. So now we got her one. A 1991 Grand Wagoneer to be exact. And a nice one that was used in hollywood movies and such!

But it's got a real problem I can't figure out. The guy that owned it before me said he was having over heating problems so he replaced the radiator and clutch fan with an aluminum radiator w a 16" electric fan from "Derale". Well the thing has still always overheated.

We've since had the engine rebuilt (360) new fuel system including 4bbl edelbrock, had it tuned at the local tuners shop and yet the bugger still overheats!

The 16" fan blade is surrounded to the very edge of it by an aluminum shroud that is right up against the radiator. This whole radiator set up seems wrong to me? I mean having an aluminum shroud that covers the whole radiator except the fan and is right up against doesn't seem like it would breath well? I dunno. It also has a flex-a-lite hard wired adjustable fan controller and still overheats. Gonna toss the derale 16" fan and try a 16" Spal instead.

You guys think I should lose the shroud all together as well?

PLease help me out guys I'm stumped!

If I was the original owner I woulda left the clutch fan but alas I'm not...

HELP ME OUT:confused:
 
You might have cracked head/ block and not even know it. The water pump might be bad. The Thermostat might be in wrong or bad. Hell, a bad radiator cap could cause it to over heat.

I'd find the source of the over heating first, before I started replacing stuff randomly.
 
I'll take a double gander at stuff but don't forget the block was just redone from the ground up. Same with the heads and the water pump and thermostat are all brand new
 
did they start messing around with reverse rotation water pumps like chevy did at that time for a serpentine setup?
 
The fan shroud should cover the entire radiator and only leave enough room for an engine driven fan (fan blades should be half in and half out of the shroud opening).
 
What are the overheating symptoms? Boiling over, steam shooting out? Or just a high reading on the gauge"?

And when does it do it? Idling, or highway speeds, or both?

Plus, do you have any long term history? When did it start doing it with the PO?

And, a couple of pics of the fan/shroud setup would help.

You seem to have already done/checked the usual stuff, now we need some information to start see where to start looking.

J.
 
OK well let me try to give ya what I can as far as history and discription here as I'm ouy and about for the day and pics aren't possible right now. The truck has overheated since the day we bought it. Until our move of four weeks ago the truck had spent all it's time with us in central Arizona (phoenix). It's fine for the most part during the winter months here.

AS for a description it's an aluminum aftermatket radiator that's 20"x20" with a 17" curved blade plastic fan attached to it. It's a pull moter attached behing the radiator and both are pur in place where the standard radiator for the wagoneer would'ce normally sat. There is an aluminum 1/8" thick sheet acting as a shroud. It's flush with the radiator and has a whole the exact diameter of the fan cut out of the middle which is where the fan is mounted flush in that spot. It fits the size and shape of the 17" fan perfectly but no other air escapes through the radiator. I also would like to add after comparing the fan to a friends set up where he simply had a used Ford Taurus fan mounted in front of a radiator in the same type of Jeep and with the same Flex A Lite fan controller, his Taurus fan seemed flow much more air than mine.

Now as for the problem as it appears to the driver. The car starts fine and runs/idles just fine. As I mentioned the motor/plugs/wires/everything is brand new or recently rebuilt in this Jeep. It has also been through two different dyno tuning shops and seems to run terrific except for the overheating. So if the temperature is about 80 degrees the Jeep will increase in temperature until it hovers between 220-240 and stay there. Once the temperature reaches the high 80s to 90+ it begins to overheat and will continue to slowly increase in temperature until the Jeep is shut off and allowed to cool off. When it's tight on the edge of taking off from controlled to uncontrolled status the things that usually push it over the edge are the following: Turning the A/C on. Sitting in the traffic. Hauling anything. When on the edge there are sometimes a few things that will also cool it off: Driving un-interupted at highway speeds. Or, turning the heat on full blast.

Now does anybody again, think it could be anything besides a weak electric fan and/or radiator? Thanks Blazer Heroes lol....
 
When does the fan engage? Does the controller have a temp switch somewhere?

I would try running a switch I could manually control it. Turn it on sooner and see if the temp continues to rise. Or leave the fan off, and on and see if the temp rises the same. It may be a fan that just doesn't pull enough air.

Also is the radiator a direct-fit replacement. Or is it a cheap universal one? It may not have enough cooling capacity either. Just do some comparison checks and see if anything points to one or the other. Thats what I would do. Or just put a manual clutch fan back on.
 
Thanks. I'd love to change it back to a regular clutch fan but the way they chopped it up in there I'll never be able to get the O.E. back in there. The radiator itself is actually at least the same size and aluminum instead of painted brass which I think is better. I could change the fan controller but again I think I have a good one in a Flex A Lite solid state fan controller with no relays to fail! It doesn't have a manual switch with it but you can buy an optional manual switch to hook up to it. It does, however, have a dial that gives you an adjustment knob for like forty degrees! I don't think that's it. I appreciate the help though. My guess is it's gotta be a too wimpy fan god knows what??
 
if that 1/8'' plate is flush against the radiator then your only moving air thru that circle there should be a little space between the back of the radiator and that sheet metal to allow air movement..can it be spaced back from rad some?

i helped put a 350 in a toyota and w/went electric fan and then an aluminum radiator & still over heating..we ditched the electric fan and cut down a spacer and went back to oem clutch fan and she stays cold now..that would be nice if you could go back stock
 
The 1/8" "sheet" that is mounted against the radiator is probably what's casuing all of your problems. A true fan shroud does not sit against the radiator flush there is usually about 4" of space to allow for air to move through the cooling fins of the radiator and then get sucked past the fan and into the engine compartment. Does this electric fan have its own shroud? If so I would remove the 1/8" sheet from the radiator and try it that way.
 
OK, here is some information.

First of all, you need to download or read this.
http://www.flex-a-lite.com/auto/31165-99943.pdf

Its the instructions on your controller. Looks like you need to turn the screw all the way counterclockwise for now.

One thing to remember, this is a variable speed controller. If for some reason it does not go to full speed, you are going to have overheating problems.

It should not hurt anything to temporally bypass this unit and wire the fan straight.
Hooked to the ignition switch, of course so it does not stay on when the car is off.
A simple relay with a temperature switch in the radiator would work.


EDIT: DISREGARD THE SIZES BELOW!
I misread the fan sizes. The 180 is actually 15 inches fan size, but they say it is the most powerful single fan made.


Also, you say that is a 16 inch fan.
The company that makes your controller also makes fans.
They have a vehicle selector on their website that tells which fan to use with which car.

Yours calls for a model 160 or 180. One is a 3000 CFM and the other is a 3300.
Table here.
http://www.flex-a-lite.com/auto/html/electric-fans.html

The most they show a 16.5 inch fan putting out is 2500.
Of course another company may have a 16 incher that can put out 3300, but I would be suspicious.

I would examine their website, paying attention to mounting instructions and do's and don'ts.

Also, one of things I was alluding to last night, but forgot to make clear, never trust a temperature gauge in an overheating situation unless you see other signs like boiling over, etc.

If you don't see any other signs, I would borrow or buy a mechanical gauge to verify that the engine is getting as hot as it shows.

J.
 
Last edited:
4X4HIGH said:
The 1/8" "sheet" that is mounted against the radiator is probably what's causing all of your problems. A true fan shroud does not sit against the radiator flush there is usually about 4" of space to allow for air to move through the cooling fins of the radiator and then get sucked past the fan and into the engine compartment. Does this electric fan have its own shroud? If so I would remove the 1/8" sheet from the radiator and try it that way.
Click to expand...


+1

That "shroud" you have is your problem. You need some space between the shroud and the radiator.

Modify that shroud as appropriate or get a fan with built in shroud. I hate to say it but Ford does make some really good high flow fans. The Taurus ones do a great job even on supercharged small blocks. Cheep at the local junk yard.

Rufus
 
im not an expert , but i agree with the guys above. If the 1/8" plate is flat mounted against your radiator with just the cut out for the fan . That is your problem. Think about the winter screens for truck in cold environments. Obscure part of the radiator to increase the heat retention in the system. all shroud have some funneling proberties . they allow air flow thru the whole radiator and then funnel it thru the fan itself. Myself i would first try to space that plate away form the radiator an inch or 2 and see if you do not have increased air flow. might be better with an after market fan that has a small shroud around it and deleting that plate.

just my thoughts .
 
Thanks for the idead guys. I'm with ya on the no room with the 1/8" shhet with no room. I'm gonna get in there tomorrow and dig around and see if it helps. I'll let you know what I come up with!
 
I'm with the guys who think the "shroud" is at fault. A shroud should taper from the outside edges of the radiator to the diameter of the fan.

Pics would help.
 
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