H1 hummer 16.5 Double Beadlock wheels and Balancing Questions

[pma4x4]

Ok, I know there have been some threads and articles on recentering a used H1 wheel and then using it on the street. Some have claimed no problem, most noticed a balance issue The thing is every thread and article I found on them whether at CK5 or else where the users had military take offs.


I am looking for input from people that have the recentered H1 wheels and have gone with a different tires like a BFG AT in 35x12.50x16.5” Or just anything else then the surplus tires and actually have driven this on the road extensively.

What have you done about balancing? I was looking at the Centramatics (http://centramatic.com/Home.aspx)


My plan was to get the 12 bolt H1s. Build a runout jig for the wheel, use the pressed recenter with the fixed backsapce of 3.5” get the TWB PVC beadlock pieces and call it a day.

If you are running such a setup can you post which H1 wheel 8, 12 or 24 bolt. which if any inner beadlock/runflat device and what tire.

 

[stan1688]

I've had 2 sets of h1s, some 8 bolts and now some 12 bolts. I ran the 36" Goodyear take-offs and 38.5" SSX Swampers on the 8 bolts and never did anything to balance them. They ran pretty well down the road, too.

I'm running the BFG Baja take-offs on the 12 bolts now and used Airsoft BBs to balance them. They work pretty well and have limited vibration considering I recentered them myself with flat centers and didn't get them all perfect.

 

[sweetk30]

i run 35" general grabber m/t radials and no weights or beads in them . ride great.

when thay get big and radial of good quality you can get away with a lot.

 

[rompinstompinmudmonkey]

I run 12 bolts with the military goodyears. I tried every different type of way to balance my tires and then broke down and bought a set of centramatics. They flat out work. They solve the balance issues, keep the tires from cupping, and I am very happy with them

 

[K588]

I run a set of recentered 12 bolts with the 36" Goodyear bias ply and magnesium runflats. They are not balanced. The tires themselves will flat spot from sitting but once they warm up.everything is fine. When these wear out I might try to find a set of the radials but I've come across people locally selling the 36's for $25 a tire its hard to pass up. Mine were from trailworthy fab if that makes a difference and no rock ring as this truck doesn't need it.

 

[K85 Octane]

I run 12 bolts with the military goodyears. I tried every different type of way to balance my tires and then broke down and boight a set of centramatics. They flat out work. They solve the balance issues, keep the tires from cupping, and I am very happy with them

pics or it didn't happen


I would have thought 2lbs of air soft BBs would have worked, but maybe not. Either way, it's cheap enough to try.

 

[rompinstompinmudmonkey]

I should also mention that my rims are not re centered.

I tried air soft, but found that they started to disintegrate after a few thousand miles. I also tried lead shot, but after they bounce around in a tire for awhile the bb's aren't round anymore, so they don't move in the tire like they should. I even tried RV antifreeze, and that was horrible. What I do now is spin balance the tires and get them as close as possible with lead weights then let the centramatics do the rest. I have put over 10k on them this way and have not had to re balance or even rotate the tires yet.

 

[pma4x4]

There is a company that sell ceramic beads for this exact issue. they even have a chart so you know how much to put into one tire.

http://www.innovativebalancing.com/index.php

There is also this.

http://www.magnumbalance.com/How%20Magnum%20Works.htm

 

[Blue85]

Dyna beads work in the same principle as BBs or air-soft pellets, except way more expensive. The only advantage is that they are tiny enough to add through the valve stem.

I have recentered H1's with the Oz radials and can't get them smooth. There is considerable runout either from the rims themselves or the recentering process. Plus the tires are not entirely round. I have a load of air soft in each one and a PVC insert. Everything is OK up to about 60-some MPH, then the shaking gets noticeable. I have swapped tires between wheels and rotated tires on wheels to try to get as close as round as possible (with a total of 6 tires and 5 wheels), but it still annoys me on the freeway. On 55MPH roads it's no problem. I've spent a lot of time marking them with masking tape and a dial indicator and have grown tired of messing with it. The rig was fine on the freeway with alloys/35's. When I first got the H1 stuff I had to crank all my spring and shackle bolts down just to drive on the highway. I wish I could try my rims with a set of Baja's or something just to know if there is hope for them.

I don't know if TWF could have done it any differently. The pressed centers drop into an existing ridge in the H1 wheel. The wheels may just come in from combat bent or with excess runout. I wonder if a wheel shop can do anything to straighten a 2-piece?

Something that's always bothered me on the 8-bolt wheel is how the outer "ring" centers on the main wheel. It bottoms out in the O-ring area, but seems to have some variation based on how much each wheel bolt is tightened. When I take them apart and re-assemble I get a different bolt pattern in the paint.

 

[pma4x4]

Something I have added to the list of this possible build is getting the centering washers for the studs. This is suppose to help keeping the outer ring center properly. I had also thought of once the wheels are ran out mark the two pieces so they can go back together in the same position.

 

[russgt]

I've got a set of recentered 8 bolts with 33/12.5 interco truxus M/ts with the rubber inserts. I havent run them yet but will probably try them without weights first and then look into the balance beads.

 

[Blue85]

When I looked into centering washers, the little info I found said they would only work with the 12 bolts. Anybody have success with them on 8-bolts?

 

[Blue85]

I've made more progress on this issue. At least 3 of my wheels have pretty low run-out. Whether the run-out comes from the recentering or original manufacturing tolerance or previous abuse is anybody's guess. What I found is that the runout of the outer clamping ring can be quite different than the wheel itself and this translates to significant runout (side-to-side) on the tread surface. This is despite careful efforts to go around and around the 8 wheel bolts many times to draw the wheel together slowly and evenly. By mapping out which side of the tire is the most "in" and "out", the sequence of tightening the bolts can be changed. Which ever ones are tightened first tend to end up "in" the most. It's like the ring tends to push one way or another during tightening. By working against this tendency things end up straighter. If the ring is mis-centered to cause runout, it also has to throw off the effective roundness of the tire. My measurements have always shown that runout and out-of-round are directly linked. This also makes the tire more out of balance.

Using this method I was able to get the tread surfaces close enough that runout is hardly visible. I have a hard time measuring tread runout with a dial indicator, but by putting a fixed object with some kind of pointer between the tread blocks (like the end of the dial indicator or sprayer on a Windex bottle) and spinning the tire by hand, the runout becomes visible enough to track changes with.

I'm now able to drive at higher speeds without shaking.

The tread runout is like death wobble. I find that it comes and goes periodically, like once a minute. My theory is that the two front tires both have lateral runout, but they are slightly different diameters. As the two come into the same phase, the frontend shakes. Then as the phases change, the two tires are kind of cancelling each other out and things are smooth.

 

[Blue85]

Also, a word on air-softs. I have been running them for years and they are making some dust. They are dimpled now, kind of like little golf balls. Now the dust could clump with moisture. I don't know - it always seems bone dry inside the tires when I look and they get aired up/down a lot. The problem with the 2-piece wheels is that when you take them apart, the dust gets in the o-ring surface and then the wheel leaks. So the tire has to be really flat before unbolting. I used to get them down to like 5psi and then let the pressure "pop" as I unbolted the wheel (because that last few psi takes forever - it's probably best to pull the shrader). This puffs the dust out between the 2 pieces.

This would be a win for the ceramic. Anybody know which brands/types of airsoft hold up the longest?

 

[wheeler]

I used to get them down to like 5psi and then let the pressure "pop" as I unbolted the wheel

I would not do that, I know it's only 5 psi, but I've seen way too many pictures of people cut in half, or severely mangled by split rims to even loosen one nut untill they are dead flat. Not saying anyone's going to get hurt, just seems like a really bad idea to me.

 

[Blue85]

I don't actually have a gauge that reads that low, so I don't know the pressure. I can push the sidewall in with my hand, so it's pretty much done. I let the air out with a Staun auto deflator with the top pulled off. It keeps hissing for a while even when there is virtually no pressure - until all the nuts are backed off a bit. Then the hissing stops. I've was trying to learn patience, but it took too long.

I know better than to open one that's inflated. One sidewall is about 800 in^2. At 30psi, that's 24,000 lbs. The tread surface is about twice as long in circumference as the wheel, so let's say the wheel sees 1/3 of that force. That's still 1000 lbs tension on each bolt and 8000 lbs on the ring. This is a simplification, but still shows the point.