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Hazards not hazarding when braking

Kia

Kia

1/2 ton status
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Location
Holland
Rig: 1989 K5 stock

I swapped out all my lamps to LED (apart from the main headlamps) swapped out both relays. Everything works perfectly. Turn signals flashing, the hazards flashing etc.

However, when I have the hazards on and apply the brakes, the hazards stop flashing, both on the dash and the lamps.

I have tested it out by swapping the flasher relays (they're both the same from what I can tell) still having the same issue.

If I change to the old relays, nothing will flash, so I know it's not that.

Anyone brainstorm with me as to what the issue could be?
 
Barrman said:
The blinker/hazard bulbs are the brake light bulbs. They don’t flash with the brake lights on.
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Oh, I wasn't aware of that! That's a little annoying.

The lamps where setup with extra orange blinkers (EU regulations for imports) with a mess of wiring in the rear. So I turned it back to stock US style lights (brake lights blinking etc.) I thought I may have missed something.
 
That wasn’t a thing 40 years ago. Though there probably is a kit that would do that. It would need some kind of controller and a relay

What was with the other non-stock items you mentioned?
 
Bent77 said:
That wasn’t a thing 40 years ago. Though there probably is a kit that would do that. It would need some kind of controller and a relay

What was with the other non-stock items you mentioned?
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So the car was an import into the UK, and in order to be road legal, you have to have separate orange blinkers and brake lights in the rear brake. So instead on one light doing three things, they have to be 3 separate things.

That was done years ago before I bought the truck. Now that it's classed as a classic, it can be a 'true' original.

Hence making it back to one light doing Brake, Tail and Turn signals.

Again, everything works perfectly, apart from the hazards not blinking when applying the brake.
 
Is that something that is a vehicle code there, regardless of age?
 
Bent77 said:
Is that something that is a vehicle code there, regardless of age?
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In the UK yes, every car has to do that. But classic cars can revert back to original.
 
That type of thing may exist to retrofit for your own piece of mind. Haven’t ever seen one here, but it’s not a terribly complex piece to make that work.
 
Bent77 said:
That type of thing may exist to retrofit for your own piece of mind. Haven’t ever seen one here, but it’s not a terribly complex piece to make that work.
Click to expand...
Gonna see if I can find anything here. I wasn't aware that it was 'normal' on US cars for it not to blink when braking.
 
Kia said:
Gonna see if I can find anything here. I wasn't aware that it was 'normal' on US cars for it not to blink when braking.
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Completely an EU thing as I understand. Even the most of the new European cars sold here dont do that

Certainly wasn’t done by any manufacturer when yours was built, here or there
 
Bent77 said:
Completely an EU thing as I understand. Even the most of the new European cars sold here dont do that

Certainly wasn’t done by any manufacturer when yours was built, here or there
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Yep, true. Going by the cutting and soldering, it was done by whoever imported it from the US. I just revered the cabling and all was fine except this issue.
 
I know there is a device that will split the turn signal from the brake light but I don't know if it would allow the hazards to hazard with brakes applied.
 
If iirc correctly the turn signal switch controls how the power is pathed.
The converters everyone is thinking of are to convert a European car to 4 wire flat trailer plug.
ATM am at a loss to come up with a remedy for this. Here in the US it used to be a violation to drive with the flashers on.
Modern US brands can have the hazards lamps blinking and the brake lights work.
 
I
Wes Harden said:
If iirc correctly the turn signal switch controls how the power is pathed.
The converters everyone is thinking of are to convert a European car to 4 wire flat trailer plug.
ATM am at a loss to come up with a remedy for this. Here in the US it used to be a violation to drive with the flashers on.
Modern US brands can have the hazards lamps blinking and the brake lights work.
Click to expand...
aha understood.

In the EU you have be able to do it due to towing another car.

When you tow another car, you have to have the hazard lights on, but you also have to be able to tell the person behind the towed car that you will be braking also.

So both have to work in their respective ways at the same time.
 
Here in the US flat towing a car, with a legal tow bar, the towed vehicle lamps have to work as if it were being driven.
On a trailer then only the trailer lamps need work.
Towing with a rope or a chain and a second operator in towed vehicle is discouraged, or a violation.
So if that is the only reason to have flasher work.
A trailer brake controller may be the solution.
Use the trailer brake controller to activate the brake lamps, with the towed vehicles hazard lamps working. This won't have working hazards on the K5, only the towed vehicle.
 
Wes Harden said:
Here in the US flat towing a car, with a legal tow bar, the towed vehicle lamps have to work as if it were being driven.
On a trailer then only the trailer lamps need work.
Towing with a rope or a chain and a second operator in towed vehicle is discouraged, or a violation.
So if that is the only reason to have flasher work.
A trailer brake controller may be the solution.
Use the trailer brake controller to activate the brake lamps, with the towed vehicles hazard lamps working. This won't have working hazards on the K5, only the towed vehicle.
Click to expand...
That's a worthwhile solution. Will have a look around to see how I can do that. Cheers!
 
It seems like I never realized before that when you turn on your blinker, there is no brake light on that side, but it's exactly how 4-pin trailer hookups work. I smashed it all together below. You can see how they combine the front and rear blinkers in the turn signal switch so that only the rear blinkers come on as brake lights. It's also clear how the brake light power feeds all 4 hazard bulbs. The dash turn signal indicators are in parallel with the front turn signals.

C_K turn signal brake wiring.png


Would it satisfy the requirement to attach temporary magnetic lights to serve as brake lights? You could disconnect the brake light switch so it doesn't feed the turn signals and instead run it straight to the temporary lights. It seems like you could reverse it so the brakes used the running lamps instead of the blinkers, but then you wouldn't have running lamps at night. The only way to have these things truly separate is to add filaments. I haven't heard of a reproduction taillight that does this. Plus, it would be major rewiring.
 
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