78Suburban said:
Nope, it's all my fault for not going along with the status quo.... So be it...
CK5
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Insanely cool paint on a budget thread
- Thread starter 78Suburban
- Start date
Nope, it's all my fault for not going along with the status quo.... So be it...
odoa3
1/2 ton status
Ryoken,
I have never painted before, but have been thinking about spraying the K5. Can you put together a tech piece for 100% newbies to painting? Something the average guy with a compressor and cheap to average gun can do in the garage, for as cheaply as possible? What needs to be done for prep, techniques for spraying, sanding, finish work, etc? Tipping, what is that, proper way to wet sand, etc? Heck, you could probably get them to post it the tech section and be one of the "cool" people with wrenches by your name.
I have never painted before, but have been thinking about spraying the K5. Can you put together a tech piece for 100% newbies to painting? Something the average guy with a compressor and cheap to average gun can do in the garage, for as cheaply as possible? What needs to be done for prep, techniques for spraying, sanding, finish work, etc? Tipping, what is that, proper way to wet sand, etc? Heck, you could probably get them to post it the tech section and be one of the "cool" people with wrenches by your name.
rwright07
1/2 ton status
Quote***
"Heck, if you want detailed instruction on how to roll and tip, I'll be glad to write out a post.. I just get a little tired of the "Oh yeah! 24 rattle cans came out sweet!" mentality that is so prevelent on this board... "
The paint on my 76 is starting to crack and peel
if anyone would do a detailed write up on how to roll and tip that would b awesome... a 17yr old student that allready is payin for gas w/ a 400sb doesnt exactly have the money for neone else to do much of any work on the blazer, nevermind droppin 3k on paint...
thanks in advance
"Heck, if you want detailed instruction on how to roll and tip, I'll be glad to write out a post.. I just get a little tired of the "Oh yeah! 24 rattle cans came out sweet!" mentality that is so prevelent on this board... "
The paint on my 76 is starting to crack and peel
if anyone would do a detailed write up on how to roll and tip that would b awesome... a 17yr old student that allready is payin for gas w/ a 400sb doesnt exactly have the money for neone else to do much of any work on the blazer, nevermind droppin 3k on paint...
thanks in advance
Here's a quickie method.
If you're not looking for a show car finish, it's not that difficult to prep and paint. Just time consuming. Thoroughly wash the vehicle with dishsoap, dry, then wipe down with Prep-sol (wax and grease remover).
If your paint is in decent condition (like mostly still there, and not peeling!), find your local auto paint dealer and purchase some red scotchbrite pads. It's cheaper to buy them by the case, and you'll use them in the shop for other things eventually. Thourghly scuff every inch of your rig. Make sure that it's scuffed to the point that there's no shine left to the paint. If you're not fixing any dents, you can paint at this point. (directions follow later)
If you have dent/rust repairs, Sand with 80 grit paper ( use a DA sander if you've got one. I'ts worth buying a cheap one if you don't), apply filler, then sand that with 80. Leave the filler a little high, then come back with 220 grit. Still leave it a little high. Spray 2 coats of 2K urethane high build primer, then take a spray can of fast drying black paint and hold the can back about 8" from the repair and lightly fog a coat on the primer. You just want a vague speckled effect.( if you put it on too heavily, it's a bear to sand and clogs your paper!) This is called a guide coat. It gives you visual to find high and low spots on your repair. Let it dry, then take a sheet of 220 Wet/Dry paper. Lay it flat on the hood, place a Paint paddle on it and roll it up tightly. This gives you a flat sanding block to help keep you from sanding grooves into the repair. Block with the 220 until you can see that most of the black speck is gone. When the paper get's clogged, just flip your paddle over, next time it gets clogged, rip off thse to used edges and keep going. Now you can see low spots (where there is still black) or high spots (where everything else still has specks, but one spot doesn't) Apply two more coats of primer, fog the black on again, then block again with 220, just enough to cut the primer, then switch to 320. 320 is the finest grit you really need to use before painting, unless it's really cold.
Once your repair is blocking out flat, you're good with it. It may take several coats of primer before you get the hang of it.
When all repairs are done, you need to seal the entire vehicle. Even if no repairs are done. This will give you an even base for your paint, which will mean you use less paint to achieve good hiding. There are sealers available that don't have to be mixed. Just tell the paint store that you want a ready to spray sealer. Buy a cheap spray gun. You don't need anything high dollar, a $30 gun will work. a $100 gun is more pleasant to use. You don't need a $400 gun!
Pressure depends on the product, and the type of gun. (gravity feed, siphon or pressure, HVLP) Find an old hood, fender etc. to practice on. You'll need to play with the fluid adjustment needle and fan pattern to get it to spray an even pattern without running. When you feel like you've got it, you're ready to start painting.
Usually, start with the top. You've got to keep moving from one side of the vehicle to the other, or your paint edges will start to dry and leave a dry looking area in the finished product.
Spray the roof in 2 or four quadrants, depending on what you can reach. Stand on a crate and move your gun back and forth like you are spraying to figure out how far you can reach.
Always keep your air hose in your other hand, so it doesn't drag throught the paint.
Once the sealer is on, let it dry according to manufacturers directions. Usually about 30 minutes. Then apply the paint the same way. You'll need to readjust your gun, because the paint will be thicker than the sealer. I'd probably use a single stage urethane enamel paint. (Use hardener with it. Some folks don't, but it will last longer, and if you ever paint it again, it will be MUCH easier to sand. Without hardener, the paint just melts under a sander!)It's kind of a midgrade, but holds up well, and sprays well. All of the major manufacturers have their own lines, and they're all good quality. PPG, Sherwin Williams, Dupont, whatever.
Make sure you tape the vehicle carefully. Don't use newspaper, the paint will bleed through. Get a roll of 18" masking paper, and a roll of 6" to tape the door jambs with. (don't want paint blowing into the car!) Do your taping the day before you spray, and give yourself all day to spray, so you don't get in a hurry.
Ask the paint dealer for product recommedations. Oh, and clean the gun thoroughly when you're done, and and leave little thinner in the gun. You can get cheap clean up thinner, rather than using the expensive stuff that you mix in the paint.
Its just a quick satisfactory paint job, great for a trail rig, good for a daily driver. The results of prep work will show in the paint work so what you put into the prep is up to you.
Feel free to criticise or add comments as you fell necessary (like I need to ask for that)
If you're not looking for a show car finish, it's not that difficult to prep and paint. Just time consuming. Thoroughly wash the vehicle with dishsoap, dry, then wipe down with Prep-sol (wax and grease remover).
If your paint is in decent condition (like mostly still there, and not peeling!), find your local auto paint dealer and purchase some red scotchbrite pads. It's cheaper to buy them by the case, and you'll use them in the shop for other things eventually. Thourghly scuff every inch of your rig. Make sure that it's scuffed to the point that there's no shine left to the paint. If you're not fixing any dents, you can paint at this point. (directions follow later)
If you have dent/rust repairs, Sand with 80 grit paper ( use a DA sander if you've got one. I'ts worth buying a cheap one if you don't), apply filler, then sand that with 80. Leave the filler a little high, then come back with 220 grit. Still leave it a little high. Spray 2 coats of 2K urethane high build primer, then take a spray can of fast drying black paint and hold the can back about 8" from the repair and lightly fog a coat on the primer. You just want a vague speckled effect.( if you put it on too heavily, it's a bear to sand and clogs your paper!) This is called a guide coat. It gives you visual to find high and low spots on your repair. Let it dry, then take a sheet of 220 Wet/Dry paper. Lay it flat on the hood, place a Paint paddle on it and roll it up tightly. This gives you a flat sanding block to help keep you from sanding grooves into the repair. Block with the 220 until you can see that most of the black speck is gone. When the paper get's clogged, just flip your paddle over, next time it gets clogged, rip off thse to used edges and keep going. Now you can see low spots (where there is still black) or high spots (where everything else still has specks, but one spot doesn't) Apply two more coats of primer, fog the black on again, then block again with 220, just enough to cut the primer, then switch to 320. 320 is the finest grit you really need to use before painting, unless it's really cold.
Once your repair is blocking out flat, you're good with it. It may take several coats of primer before you get the hang of it.
When all repairs are done, you need to seal the entire vehicle. Even if no repairs are done. This will give you an even base for your paint, which will mean you use less paint to achieve good hiding. There are sealers available that don't have to be mixed. Just tell the paint store that you want a ready to spray sealer. Buy a cheap spray gun. You don't need anything high dollar, a $30 gun will work. a $100 gun is more pleasant to use. You don't need a $400 gun!
Pressure depends on the product, and the type of gun. (gravity feed, siphon or pressure, HVLP) Find an old hood, fender etc. to practice on. You'll need to play with the fluid adjustment needle and fan pattern to get it to spray an even pattern without running. When you feel like you've got it, you're ready to start painting.
Usually, start with the top. You've got to keep moving from one side of the vehicle to the other, or your paint edges will start to dry and leave a dry looking area in the finished product.
Spray the roof in 2 or four quadrants, depending on what you can reach. Stand on a crate and move your gun back and forth like you are spraying to figure out how far you can reach.
Always keep your air hose in your other hand, so it doesn't drag throught the paint.
Once the sealer is on, let it dry according to manufacturers directions. Usually about 30 minutes. Then apply the paint the same way. You'll need to readjust your gun, because the paint will be thicker than the sealer. I'd probably use a single stage urethane enamel paint. (Use hardener with it. Some folks don't, but it will last longer, and if you ever paint it again, it will be MUCH easier to sand. Without hardener, the paint just melts under a sander!)It's kind of a midgrade, but holds up well, and sprays well. All of the major manufacturers have their own lines, and they're all good quality. PPG, Sherwin Williams, Dupont, whatever.
Make sure you tape the vehicle carefully. Don't use newspaper, the paint will bleed through. Get a roll of 18" masking paper, and a roll of 6" to tape the door jambs with. (don't want paint blowing into the car!) Do your taping the day before you spray, and give yourself all day to spray, so you don't get in a hurry.
Ask the paint dealer for product recommedations. Oh, and clean the gun thoroughly when you're done, and and leave little thinner in the gun. You can get cheap clean up thinner, rather than using the expensive stuff that you mix in the paint.
Its just a quick satisfactory paint job, great for a trail rig, good for a daily driver. The results of prep work will show in the paint work so what you put into the prep is up to you.
Feel free to criticise or add comments as you fell necessary (like I need to ask for that)
odoa3 said:Ryoken,
I have never painted before, but have been thinking about spraying the K5. Can you put together a tech piece for 100% newbies to painting? Something the average guy with a compressor and cheap to average gun can do in the garage, for as cheaply as possible? What needs to be done for prep, techniques for spraying, sanding, finish work, etc? Tipping, what is that, proper way to wet sand, etc? Heck, you could probably get them to post it the tech section and be one of the "cool" people with wrenches by your name.
Heath, I'd be glad to help you out.. I really probably should have just saved my PM's, think I've written nearly 100 pages out to folks on body stuff....
After the blasting I've taken in this thread I'm not real sure i want to bother putting in the effort to write out a tech article for this site on proper bodywork procedures.. I'd hate to go thru that work to be scoffed at as bling.. Obviously not a priority for most here...
Good thought tho, awesome you'd like to learn how to yourself.. In the meantime, if you have any questions shoot me a PM at any time..
Great, bondo over paint... Keep up the good work!
OK taking some things for granted I guess.........sand to bare metal, like it would say on the instructions....then proceed.......Jeez why don't you just say that and contribute........no wait that would be above you evidently.ryoken said:Great, bondo over paint... Keep up the good work!
contribute?
Yeah ok pal, go in my profile and thumb thru my previous posts, about 90% of my posts over the years are trying to help people with tech...
Since you are apparently so versed in bodywork it was more just a nudge to post correct tech as opposed to promoting poor bodywork habits..
It takes the same amount of time to do it correctly by GRINDING out the repair area properly...
Yeah ok pal, go in my profile and thumb thru my previous posts, about 90% of my posts over the years are trying to help people with tech...
Since you are apparently so versed in bodywork it was more just a nudge to post correct tech as opposed to promoting poor bodywork habits..
It takes the same amount of time to do it correctly by GRINDING out the repair area properly...
odoa3
1/2 ton status
Ryoken,
Sounds good. When it comes time I will shoot you a pm. Thanks!
Sounds good. When it comes time I will shoot you a pm. Thanks!
pm to ya...
Not meaning to piss you off, but add some helpful tips.....my reply was in response to a few wanting a quick cheap way to paint.....thats all..If you have better ideas post em. or add a link to your tech tips for us all to benefit from........Wow most people still know how to read directions on the stuff they buy too.
I just found it amusing the thread went from bashing me, including yourself, for even considering using a gun for refinishing a truck, to directions on how to spray a truck from one of my detractors in the same thread..
Kinda ironic...
this thread isn't the be all, end all of refinishing for CK5, thus I didn't feel it appropriate to drag this off on an alternative topic other than rolling and tipping... If I saw a thread in the body shop regarding how to spray refinish a truck on the cheap, I would certainly reply with a post trying to help...
I've spent countless hrs typing out PM's for folks on this board concerning bodywork, hopefully i've been of some help to them. I'm sure some thorough searchs would bring up quite a few good threads... As I stated earlier, I would even consider a thorough bodywork section on my webhost, but honestly from the response in this thread, i'm not sure it's worth the additional effort above and beyond the help i already try to provide...
As far as the can reading aspect, sounds like an excuse for poor advice to me. There where a few things a would do differently than your advising, but they where relatively harmless and didn't feel the need to point them out... but when i see recommendations for applying bondo over paint, I felt the need to point that out. I'm sure it was just an oversight on your part, but i can't be assured everyone reading that is going to double-check you and find the right procedure...
Maybe you'll understand where I'm coming from, maybe not.. Either way, enjoy your time here at CK5..
Kinda ironic...
this thread isn't the be all, end all of refinishing for CK5, thus I didn't feel it appropriate to drag this off on an alternative topic other than rolling and tipping... If I saw a thread in the body shop regarding how to spray refinish a truck on the cheap, I would certainly reply with a post trying to help...
I've spent countless hrs typing out PM's for folks on this board concerning bodywork, hopefully i've been of some help to them. I'm sure some thorough searchs would bring up quite a few good threads... As I stated earlier, I would even consider a thorough bodywork section on my webhost, but honestly from the response in this thread, i'm not sure it's worth the additional effort above and beyond the help i already try to provide...
As far as the can reading aspect, sounds like an excuse for poor advice to me. There where a few things a would do differently than your advising, but they where relatively harmless and didn't feel the need to point them out... but when i see recommendations for applying bondo over paint, I felt the need to point that out. I'm sure it was just an oversight on your part, but i can't be assured everyone reading that is going to double-check you and find the right procedure...
Maybe you'll understand where I'm coming from, maybe not.. Either way, enjoy your time here at CK5..
surpip
1 ton status
you sir, are a moron76zimmer said:
Ryoken is probally one of the more respected members on this board, and probally one of the most knowledgable body presons on here to.
mabye you should sit back and read a little before making assinine statement's about somthing you know nothing about
Wow, hope my ugly little head doesn't get swollen from that compliment.... Thanks for the kind words brother...
I feel bad about this whole thread, I really do.. I probably got too defensive throughout and I'm truly sorry it degenerated into this and I want to apologize to 78Burb for ruining his thread..
I'm sure 76zimmer is a good guy and his intentions where good and I should know better than to respond to everyones criticism the way I have. I just take alot of pride in refinishing, whether it's a frame, whole truck or valve covers and like to see things done right.. Sometimes I'm overly zeolous in that passion I suppose..
I feel bad about this whole thread, I really do.. I probably got too defensive throughout and I'm truly sorry it degenerated into this and I want to apologize to 78Burb for ruining his thread..
I'm sure 76zimmer is a good guy and his intentions where good and I should know better than to respond to everyones criticism the way I have. I just take alot of pride in refinishing, whether it's a frame, whole truck or valve covers and like to see things done right.. Sometimes I'm overly zeolous in that passion I suppose..
surpip
1 ton status
nothing wrong with beeing passionate, its when people (newbs in particular)dont respect the words of someone who really know's thier ****, that is what pisses me off.
every one know's a spray gun quality paint job aint right for a trail truck.
also everyone know's that paint method aint gonna win any shows
should have just been left at that.
every one know's a spray gun quality paint job aint right for a trail truck.
also everyone know's that paint method aint gonna win any shows
should have just been left at that.
surpip said:you mean you are getting rid of the pimp gold color?
Yeah, maybe in Oakland the golden bling might be cool, I never liked it. Maybe if it was more of a Forty-Niner gold. And, my doors are fallin apart, cancer, and whatnot. I think the doors I got from you are in good enough shape to be 'rebuilt'. I paint all my tools with rustoleum Hunter Green, my favorite color, I think the K5 would look saweeeeet painted that color. You still got that full hardtop at your folks' place?
surpip
1 ton status
nope sold it
that truck is all bye bye now
that truck is all bye bye now
78Suburban
1/2 ton status
I added a poll 
