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More engine thoughts/ideas

The Griff

The Griff

High drag, low speed
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I mentioned before that I am getting a bit tired of the 200-some thousand mile 305 in the Blazer. I mentioned the big Cadillacs, I still want to put one in something, (Been thinking about Silverado/Sierra C10 all original but for some 14 inch mags and the Caddy) But I'm thinking for the Blazer more along the lines of an SBC or a BBC, since the Caddy would take a bit of fab work, while I know me and a friend of mine can have a small bock out, and another small block or big block in in the space of a day.

Point is, Now that I may have some funding, I can start looking for parts and pieces, and our local junkyard has a flat rate of $120 for any Chevy V8.
I'd be a bit leary of most of the engines in the pickups and cars out there, but they have at least a dozen C65's and C70's that were grain trucks that got scrapped when the farmer got a new truck. Most all of these things have tall-deck big blocks with less than 50,000 miles. If my interest in the Cadillac motors said anything, it was that I have a thing for torque, and from looking up a 366, numbers are 260 Horse and 530 Torque. What do we think?
 
Now that is a good idea.


The more I think about it, the more I feel like I should go find the truck I've always wanted, a 70's round headlight K20 in Silverado/Sierra trim, and put a tall deck big block in it.
 
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Obviously you have a thing for the obscure motors. The tall deck big block is pretty easy to get maintenance parts for since only the dizzy, intake, and timing covers are different.
 
This first part doesn't answer your question directly, but my "dream" engines right now are 4.3 v-6---these CAN tow quite a bit with enough gears......

Or 383HT; This would depend on and require analysis or budget and annual miles driven/or miles driven per week.

2) Now, if you like the Cadillac engines, then go for it but be aware it's going to take longer than you think and cost more than you think to put it in----especially exhaust and engine mounts. The 383HT could be in, in a day as you say......

3) i've driven a 366 in a 6500 U-haul rental and they're not bad, but why not go with a "regular" big block; i think crewcabs with the 454 can be picked up all day at sub $2500 prices, then sell the rest of the truck.

a) i also had a 305 which went for 36 years (came from a 78 malibu) until i stupidly overheated it a few weeks ago (see my other post entitled "how hot is too hot") That is why i am switching to the 4.3 v-6 i have in my garage.
 
I think I can answer alot by saying "Overkill"

The tall deck big blocks were built to be truck engines, I.E., meant to be around 75-90% of their output for all day, whereas a car or pickup is around 25%.
 
The 366 has 4 ring pistons,I am not sure about the tall deck 427's but I wouldn't be surprised if they do also...(my BBC books are out of reach at the moment)..

I know a few guys who ran 366's from old school busses,they were no 454 as far as brute HP,but they are probably one of Chevy's toughest V8's to kill...one of the guys used a 366 and kept the 5 speed clark tranny that came in the bus,he installed it in a '58 Apache pickup (2WD)...I've seen a few with Alison automatics too,but they aren't adaptable to a 4x4 unless you used a divorced transfer case...


A school bus usually makes a good donor,because they get frequent oil changes and regular maintenence,and dont carry super heavy loads,compared to a "farm truck" that might get overloaded,beaten and neglected more..
 
I'm seriously thinking about selling the green Ford and looking for the K20 I'm thinking about.

A 73-80 K20, preferably 4 speed, definitely in a high trim level, the Blazer being a radio-delete custom deluxe kind of wore me out on the whole plain Jane thing. Then putting a tall deck 366 or 427 in it. Basically a Hoss-mobile, but with gearing that lets me do 70 without being at 4 grand.

As tempting/awesome it would be to built a 572 from a 427, I don't really think I'd do much to it, toss it in, be done.

I say this, but I still am very open to the idea of building a 355 or 383 Small block, with my goal still being mucho torque.
 
I consider the 366 a boat anchor, its a big heavy huge engine on the outside that's tiny on the inside and you can't bore it or stroke it big enough to make up the difference, I would rather have a small black than a 366 big block

The 427 tall deck is a lot better, but still limited. I have made a 496 out of a 427 for a friend, but you can't stroke it much above 4.25" because the oil gallies in the old 427s tall decks were very close and when you go to clear the rods you could strike oil, and this is not good oil to strike! The benefit is you can add a lot longer rod, but this is not really that important overall and can be discussed for hours with no side overtaking the other. You can't bore them out to 4.5" either, so no 572 will be made from a tall deck 427. If you sonic check it you may be able to bore it .100", but even then the biggest engine you could probably make is a maybe a 505 or something. And it would be heavier than the same engine made out of a short deck block and you would have to buy more expensive parts for the intake and distributor. With the advantages of aftermarket blocks these days the old factory tall decks aren't really used much for performance any more. If you want big displacement and big torque, stroke a 502, you can easily make a 540 or a 555 from a short deck and have gobs of torque and/or hp depending on how you build it. You can also easily build a 489 or 496 from a std 454 block without the special intake and stuff needed for a tall deck, and it will be lighter.

Unless I am rebuilding a stock engine, I seem to use a stroker crank for every engine I build, cost wise it doesn't add much to a complete rebuild (depending on what crank you buy) and it's worth it.

I think it would be nice to build a 6.0 into a 408. Take a stock 6.0 and put a 4.000 stroke crank in it, bore it .030 over, and then buy the CNC LS3 heads for $600 a pop, get a new cam and you are looking at 550 hp easy! I would take that over a 366 or an old small block any time. That 550 hp won't have the same torque as a 496 with 550 hp, but they will both be fun.

Now, if you are building a big block, build a big big block, 489, 496, 502, 540, 555, 572( that one is aftermarket tall deck, the rest are standard deck) something like that is worth it. My next engine build will be either a 540, a 6.0, or a 6.2 LS, any LS I build myself would immedaitely get a 4.00 stroke crank, or 4.125. I have helped friend/family build 6.0s, but they were stock bottom ends.

The stroker crank in my 489 was a Scat for $300. That is not much more than it would cost to have the stock crank ground and polished. Although I did have it balanced. My point is, stroking it doesn't have to cost and arm and a leg if you are making a torque motor. I used a std deck 454 block, but it is a 4 bolt main unit.
 
I don't have much to add here, but listen to Heath.... I've seen his truck run, and it is an animal.


Well I do have more to add. Find the truck that YOU want. There's tons of these trucks out there, I'm sure you could find one locally that would tickle your fancy.
 
After another trip to the junkyard today, and seeing just how many 366's and 427's were there, I asked the head honcho there what he would want for one, and after getting his answer, I think I'm ruling the tall deck big block out.
$400 for a running 366, and $500 for a running 427.

I seem to have a thing for the odd & obscure engines, but I think if I am able to track down this hypothetical truck, It more than likely will have a 350 or 400, and I think I may as well just liven it up some with a decent carb and an HEI dizzy.

Also, another requirement for the hypothetical truck, (Basically y5mgisi's truck)
But it must be a 4 speed, I drove my friend's dad 86 C20 with a 350 and a SM465, and I have decided I must have one in my life.
 
Here its getting tough to find ANY older big block,a 427 tall deck would cost you 700-1000 if you find one in decent running condition...out your way there must be a lot more farm trucks hauling grain,etc,the only ones we see here ,and not often,in boneyards is an old town or state DPW truck or school bus with one in it..

The cheapest way to get a big block here is to scour the cragslist ads for a free or cheap motor home that has sat in the weeds too long,most have very low mileage,but your burdened with the chore of cutting the whole thing up for scrap ,because many places wont take a camper "whole"...

It appears a two way street at swap meets,now those selling old big blocks from the 60's thru the 80's are either asking lots of money because they are becoming scarce--in some cases others are opting to go for the newer fuel injected engines and are selling them for a "reasonable" price...saying they are "old tech" and dont fit many newer vehicles..its rare to find a big block you can drop in and use here for 500 bucks...
 
Oh yeah, at this junkyard that are 11 or 12 C60's and C70's, 6 of them are old grain trucks with 2-barrel small blocks without much rust or wear, they just got old and the farmer must have gotten a new truck. Two of them are tandem axle C70 Dump trucks with airbrakes, both with 427's. There's a couple C60 sprayer's, one with 47 inch flotation tires with a Detroit, the other is on 66 inch terra tires and has a 366, and the others are flatbeds and road tractors or don't have any bed at all, I think the tractor has a 366, a couple of flatbeds with 427's and Detroit's.
There are a couple Brigadier's out there too, both tandem drive grain trucks, one with a 6-71 Detroit, the other with a 3208 CAT.


I should take some pictures out there sometime, they have quite a bit of cool stuff, there is an 85 C30 Reg. Cab dually 6.2 5 speed 10,000 LB GVW Camper Special, a 72 4-door Chevelle Malibu with a 2-barrel big block, a Couple old Jeep J20's, one old M1009 CUCV, and a couple old Dodge CUCV's.
They have a bunch of old cabover's too, two old International 9670's, an old GMC Astro that has had a BMW sitting on top of it for as long as I can remember.
A while ago I posted a picture of an old Tri-drive Pete 359 that had a 8V71 Detroit that had been there for as long as we had been going there, that was being drug up to the crusher, and it must have been in gear because as it be being drug by the loader, it started and pushed the loader into the shredded scrap pile.
 
The Griff said:
I seem to have a thing for the odd & obscure engines, but I think if I am able to track down this hypothetical truck, It more than likely will have a 350 or 400, and I think I may as well just liven it up some with a decent carb and an HEI dizzy.
Click to expand...

And a cam and headers and a RPM intake? And maybe a stroker crank and KB pistons? And maybe some new heads?... :D
 
I am just offering free suggestions, which may not always be the best use of money, but usually involves high smiles/dollar. :thumb:
 
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