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need serious gudiance here, what to do for new Jimmy, i want a crawler

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with a 400 and the 203 that comes with the 73, i'd have
"First gear: 2.48 x T-case low: 2.01 x Differential: 5.13 = Final Drive: 25.57"
that just sucks, so what i'm thinking is either a doubler which would give me
"Underdrive: 2.01 x First gear: 2.48 x T-case low: 1.96 x Differential: 5.13 x Final Drive: 50.12"
which is just over the 43 that i'm at currently, now the last option is
465-205 which would give me
"First gear: 6.54 x T-case low: 1.96 x Differential: 5.13 = Final Drive: 65.76"
which would be great, but do you think the torque from caddy will be fine with the 50 crawl ratio

so basicaly heres my options right?
25 crawl ratio just via tranny/t-case
50 crawl ratio via doubler
65 ratio with 465-205......

opinions? /forums/images/graemlins/ears.gif

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Brandon,

Double the value for 1st Gear in any automatic transmission. The stall converter gives you "slip" that decouples the engine rpms from the tranny. (at least at RPMs that are below the stall speed, which they will be if you're crawling) Most people will calculate that TH400 ratio as: 2.48 X2 = 4.96

Still not quite as deep as a 465, but not nearly as far away as you've indicated either.... /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
another thing is you were saying about buying a bowtie 700 well get TCI to build you a turbo 350 and they can build it w/ a 2.74 first gear which will increase crawl a little bit, and with that caddy motor I think you can get away with not that much crawl since it puts out so much torque at around idle
 
who ever said that the np205/sm465 was bullet proof does not know about the problem with output shafts. Sm465 to np205 was one of the weakest adaptations out there. Reason being is it is only a 10 spline, thats the reason I have stuck with the weaker t-case (np208), and the 208 has a lower gear ratio anyways. /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif
 
There is also the possiblity to get the 3:1 th-400, which has been going around. Don't even think about sticking with the 700R4, they just don't make good offroad transmissions.
 
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who ever said that the np205/sm465 was bullet proof does not know about the problem with output shafts. Sm465 to np205 was one of the weakest adaptations out there. Reason being is it is only a 10 spline, thats the reason I have stuck with the weaker t-case (np208), and the 208 has a lower gear ratio anyways. /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif

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The 32 spline 465/205 combo eliminates that problem.
 
I haven't had the luck to find one yet, what trucks do the come on so I know what to look for when I go to pick and pull.
 
Why on EARTH would you pull the TBI and gi with a carb?? Like TRUSTY said that is going very backwords. My set up : 350 TBI, 700r4, Klune, Atlass. !4 bolts/60 combo with 5:13's. The 14 bolt is Hella strong, nooooo need spend the dough and swap to the 70. I say if you wanna crale spend the cash on a NEW ATLASS 5:1. Poof you have a kick ass crawl ratio , twin stock super strong set up.
No need to go for the doubler and yada yada, one case, low as hell strong as an ox.
 
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As for engine choice what could be simpler than keeping the stock 350 and the TBI? I don't know why anybody would purposely remove TBI in favor of a carb while building a 'rock crawler'...that's just going backwards.

A 500 caddy for crawling is also a bad plan IMO. Although the back of the crank can be drilled for a pilot (Tim..) and many people have run manuals behind them. It's heavier, and especially behind an automatic could just be way too much motor for the intended purpose. With a manual it might be more wheelable because it's got a little more off idle torque (kinda like a diesel) but I'd want FI regardless and that'll prolly blow the budget.

Rene

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Actually the Big Block Cadillac motor weighs in at only about 40lbs heavier than a SBC, so that aspect is pretty negligable. Using a simple transmission adaptor you can put a Caddy engine in front of any chev trans, but yes for a Standard you need to have the crank drilled for the pilot bearing, and the flywheels are EXPENSIVE @ 380USD.
 
thanks everyone!
as was stated already, the caddy is light, so weight isnt really an issue, and i know carb sucks, but i also know FI was an option for this motor so i plan on adding it some time this year so i wont be wheeling too long with out. so now whats its looking like is a th400, a 205 (because its the strongest right?) and with the low end TQ from the caddy this should make me very happy.
The majority of what i want to do is crawl, BUT i also like pismo beach, trail rides, hill climbs, and other stuff so the motors power to weight ratio seems great for me. If anyone thinks of another combo for auto that would work please let me know.
/forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif
 
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The 14 bolt is Hella strong, nooooo need spend the dough and swap to the 70.

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Strength not being an issue, gearing is. I hate only being able to go down to 5.13 on my 14. PITA /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif
 
All this talk about a caddy engine has gotten me excited! I think I'm going to go find one. Living in Texas means the largest rock here involves a road bed. I spend more time in the mud and trails and no time on rocks. So this engine sounds great. I plan on mounting it to a TH400/208 I think (if this is possible. I saw talk about an adapter?) Also anybody have any idea what it would cost to rebuild that thing and get it turning my tires, I'm just talking ballpark to see if it is doable. Thanks Guys.

Jacob Byrd
 
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The 500 Caddy and the 700 tranny have different bellhousing bolt patterns, how do you get past that? I don't think there is a useable O/D tranny with the right bolt pattern. /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

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Summit Racing sells the adapter plates for about $70 (or look on ebay and you might find them cheaper. Then you have to shim out the torque converter on the flex plate.

As far as the 500 having too much power to crawl, I would think the doubler would fix that problem.
 
I have a rebuilt 2wd TH400 behind a 455 Olds motor that would fit your Caddy. I was looking to get $200 for it.

Of course your Caddy probably came with a TH400 too, and since you were going to have to tear it down to swap output shafts you could have that one rebuilt with the correct shaft cheaper than buying mine, shipping it and then swapping shafts. All you need to do is swap in an output shaft from a chevy 4x4 TH400 for what ever tcase and adapter length you plan to mount behind it (get one for the NP203 if you are using a doubler or one for a NP205 if that is what you will run).
 
And then there are those of us who take a 32 spline output SM465 that came in many Chevys and stick a 32 spline input NP205 behind it. /forums/images/graemlins/hack.gif /forums/images/graemlins/weld.gif

Edit: Opps, I was beat to it

The lowest aftermarket gear set for a TH400 is 2.75:1 and the cheap versions can be had for about $375-$400 from Summit. The good hardened gear sets go up in price to $600 and up.
 
[ QUOTE ]
thanks everyone!
as was stated already, the caddy is light, so weight isnt really an issue, and i know carb sucks, but i also know FI was an option for this motor so i plan on adding it some time this year so i wont be wheeling too long with out. so now whats its looking like is a th400, a 205 (because its the strongest right?) and with the low end TQ from the caddy this should make me very happy.
The majority of what i want to do is crawl, BUT i also like pismo beach, trail rides, hill climbs, and other stuff so the motors power to weight ratio seems great for me. If anyone thinks of another combo for auto that would work please let me know.
/forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif

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Just to play devil's advocate here I'll sum up your plan so far.

You're gonna chuck the TBI for a carb and cut your crawl ratio in half because you want a rock crawler. /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

Is it opposite day and nobody told me?

Rene
 
My 2 cents- Keep the caddy motor, rebuild it(mild) carb it for now untill you can FI it. Get a bellhousing adapter for the 700r4. Have Bowtie Overdrive rebuild your 700r4(they just did mine and it only cost me $500 really strong.) Find a 205 and use your 203 to make a doubler. This is what I would do If you plan on driving on the street or freeway. If it ends being a trail only rig then ditch the 700r4 and go with the 400. Plus you can sell any of the stuff you have that you dont use on this project like the TBI and the driveshafts etc... /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
 
The Atlas is only( /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif) $2600. Have Bowtie do you trans and get the Atlas, and keep you axles. It is light and has a 5.0 to 1 ratio.
 
Branndon, Look at my blazer or my dad's. He has a problem that I dont, his truck has too much power with a built TBI 400/TH350/doubler/ and 5.13's on 40" Iroks. Mine on the other hand has a stock TBI 350/700R4/NP241/4.88's and 36" Iroks and is much easier to control because it doesnt produce a ton of torque and HP off idle like his. Both of our truck work good, and can follow each other if I dont mind taking some body damage. If I were you, throw an atlas in your 89, rebuild the engine, maybe throw in a little bigger cam for some more power on the road wheel the piss out of it. If you want call me and we can talk.
 
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