ORD Rear Leaf Too Short?

[CrpMag122]

I am getting frustrated with this damn project. I am at the point where I am not even enjoying wrenching on something for the first time in my life. So enough whining, here is the current situation. I am running a 6" lift. Front is all spring from ORD, their springs (Alcan). Rear is a 4" spring and a 2.5" shackle flip, also all ORD stuff. I got the springs in place last week using the 4.5" ORD super shackle. I noticed right off the bat the angle of the shackle looked extremely wrong and was thinking the shackle would try to invert as soon as weight was put on it.



So, I called ORD, told them my concerns. I was told it would be fine and the weight on the spring would push the shackle back. They told me if it was an issue I would have to weld a limiting bar onto the shackle flip but there wouldn't be a problem dropping the weight down onto it. So, against my better judgement I gave it a shot. Guess I was right.





The minute I put the weight of the rear on it there was zero compression of the spring and the shackle inverted to the point where it was pinching up around the spring. Nice, I have a hardtail K5. I know I will need to call ORD again but I am hoping this something that can be quickly fixed and wanted to see if anybody else has had this issue.

I tried flipping the springs around to see if they were in backwards. Couldn't even get the eye bolts in. Measured the leaf springs and found out they are about 53" from eye bolt to eyebolt, measuring along the arch. Measuring across the spring eyebolt to eyebolt they were just about 47". To me this does not seem right. Seems to me with so much arch in the spring they should be longer then an inch above stock. Any input is appreciated.

 

[mechted]

Looks like you need to move the shackle flip brackets forward about 3 or 4 inches. That would allow the shackle angle to be set perfectly. Which means dropping the tank again. That is the labor intensive way to fix it. The money intensive way to fix it is with a different set of springs... Probably 56"s for the same amount of lift would bolt up just fine.

 

[mlaux]

I tried flipping the springs around to see if they were in backwards. Couldn't even get the eye bolts in. Measured the leaf springs and found out they are about 53" from eye bolt to eyebolt, measuring along the arch. Measuring across the spring eyebolt to eyebolt they were just about 47". To me this does not seem right. Seems to me with so much arch in the spring they should be longer then an inch above stock. Any input is appreciated.

Fronts maybe?

 

[6872xtc]

I had a set of springs from anow unknown company that had so much arch, I had to wedge a 2x4 between the end to even get them to bolt up.
I think that you could use a 2x4 on top , then a ratchet strap to the middle of the spring, by the axle, to straighten the spring enough to get the shackle heading the correct direction.
Then see how things sit. Maybe after some break in, all will be good and you can put the stop on the shackles for extra safety.
I know that custom can be a pain to install sometimes. I did a set of Superlift rears for a buddy, no problem to bolt up, no flex, crappy ride, and poor shackle angle.

 

[tRustyK5]

I had to manually flatten out Alcan rears on my old 81 Jimmy during installation. On the ground they had as much arch as 12" superlifts...installed, and with weight on the them they were nearly flat.

 

[CrpMag122]

Looks like you need to move the shackle flip brackets forward about 3 or 4 inches. That would allow the shackle angle to be set perfectly. Which means dropping the tank again. That is the labor intensive way to fix it. The money intensive way to fix it is with a different set of springs... Probably 56"s for the same amount of lift would bolt up just fine.

I think the 56" spring may be the way to go. I will have to call ORD on Monday A and see what they will do. I can't imagine I am the first person to run into this issue. I would expect Alcan to be smart enough to figure out the springs need to be longer with this much arch, maybe it was a mistake.

@mlaux I don't think they are built for the fronts, if they were they mere made for the wrong size bushings. Per ORD the springs for the rear have the correct bushing sizes.

@6872xtc & @tRustyK5 if I get nothing from ORD I will try the ratchet strap and 2x4 trick. Thanks for the help. I wish I had more then a couple hours a week to work on this thing.

 

[rpcraft]

So, I'm looking at this, and in the back of my mind I am thinking the most lift I would want to go is 2 to 4 inches.... What benefit is flipping the spring perch on the rear? Just trying to wrap my head around that vs buying a spring pack for the lift. Is it just a way to get more lift without going supercrazy on spring packs that would be really hard and bouncy?

 

[bp71k5]

Are the flip brackets on the correct sides? I can flip mine around for shorter/longer springs but maybe the second gen stuff is different.

 

[sreidmx]

That is just bound up, take a prybar and flip it past the bound spot.. after that get some limit straps and forget about it. This is why I'm not a fan of shackle flips.

 

[sweetk30]

seem to recall a member hear back in the day with the same problem .

had to block of wood / strap them in place . and once full weight on they were a lot better .

but as you stated call ord and refrence this thread so they can see the pics and get you taken care of .

 

[ChrisPerry]

This might sound stupid, but...... did you bolt the rear axle up or are you just resting the springs on something to put weight on it?
The reason for asking is that the springs will flatten out a bit when bolted to the axle and torqued down. You may torque, let rest a while, torque again, and again, and again.

 

[sweetk30]

This might sound stupid, but...... did you bolt the rear axle up or are you just resting the springs on something to put weight on it?
The reason for asking is that the springs will flatten out a bit when bolted to the axle and torqued down. You may torque, let rest a while, torque again, and again, and again.

good point sir . yes this will draw the springs down and flatten the arch a little bit .

 

[AJs72K5]

seem to recall a member hear back in the day with the same problem .

had to block of wood / strap them in place . and once full weight on they were a lot better .

but as you stated call ord and refrence this thread so they can see the pics and get you taken care of .

I remember this too. Was sometime in the last few years.

 

[CrpMag122]

So, I'm looking at this, and in the back of my mind I am thinking the most lift I would want to go is 2 to 4 inches.... What benefit is flipping the spring perch on the rear? Just trying to wrap my head around that vs buying a spring pack for the lift. Is it just a way to get more lift without going supercrazy on spring packs that would be really hard and bouncy?

ORD does not sell a 6" lift all spring in the Alcan line. That's to prevent this very problem, once the springs get arched so much it causes issues like you see above that I am running into.

 

[CrpMag122]

That is just bound up, take a prybar and flip it past the bound spot.. after that get some limit straps and forget about it. This is why I'm not a fan of shackle flips.

Neither am I honestly, ORD assured me though that the 4" springs with the shackle flip would perform far better then a 6" spring pack from tough country. I would try the prybar trick but I would need a lot more man power to do this, which I don't really have.

@ChrisPerry , the 14 bolt was in place and the spring perch was in position loosely under the springs. If everything was going to work as suggested by ORD I was going to get my pinion angle set up. When I started to put weight on the springs they traveled up with the shackle and bound up against lower part of the shackle, which prevented them from compressing at all. And I mean at all, there was no change in the arch.

 

[CrpMag122]

seem to recall a member hear back in the day with the same problem .

had to block of wood / strap them in place . and once full weight on they were a lot better .

but as you stated call ord and refrence this thread so they can see the pics and get you taken care of .

If I don't get any help from ORD, I will give that a shot. Really hoping to avoid having to run limiting straps.

Sorry in advance for the multiple replies, my ancient iPad is acting up.

 

[Big Ray]

Refer them to this thread so they can see what's going on.

 

[camok5]

Yeah looks like a somewhat simple fix to me, strap around the shackle pulling towards the rear while jacking up the spring or I guess you could also take the pack apart and set it up with just the main leaf which would make it easier to compress into place.

 

[NorCal69]

My front ORD Alcans where like that. I ordered them for a 350, no cage, no winch type of build.

I finally got them to sit at least strait up and down now. All it took was a BB, doubler, full cage, engine cage, winch and full hidden tube bumper and a ton of extra fab crap sitting up front. It's almost like they knew where my build was a heading when I ordered them. lol

 

[ChrisPerry]

@ChrisPerry , the 14 bolt was in place and the spring perch was in position loosely under the springs. If everything was going to work as suggested by ORD I was going to get my pinion angle set up. When I started to put weight on the springs they traveled up with the shackle and bound up against lower part of the shackle, which prevented them from compressing at all. And I mean at all, there was no change in the arch.

Tighten the u-bolts down and see if it flattens the springs. You can loosen them up after the weight is on the springs. It worth a try.