Flick RRMC
Registered Member
Wondering if anyone has done POR-15 on engine,trans,trans case,and axles?
CK5
Register an account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members.
POR-15 questions
- Thread starter Flick RRMC
- Start date
it's snake oil...
???
My new boss swares by it...
Why so bad?
My new boss swares by it...
Why so bad?
it's just an encapsilator...
we where using that schit 25 yr's ago in the marine biz, on V-drives, stringers, etc, etc.. it doesn't stop rust, it just covers it up... slows it down but it will still continue on underneath in varying degrees, and eventually it falls off in sheets... WAY faster if you don't topcoat it...
it's for lazy people that don't want to actually do things right by REMOVING the rust... looking for a miracle juice...
it's amazing what advertising does for ya.. just look at Fram filters..
we where using that schit 25 yr's ago in the marine biz, on V-drives, stringers, etc, etc.. it doesn't stop rust, it just covers it up... slows it down but it will still continue on underneath in varying degrees, and eventually it falls off in sheets... WAY faster if you don't topcoat it...
it's for lazy people that don't want to actually do things right by REMOVING the rust... looking for a miracle juice...
it's amazing what advertising does for ya.. just look at Fram filters..
What about a fresh/preped surface? Not to stop, just to prevent.
that, IMO, is even more silly.. 
I know that will offend quite a few in here..
sandblasting a frame, than slathering POR15 all over it, is a sin IMO..
if you're going thru the trouble/effort/cost to "do it right" by blasting/stripping, put a better coating system on it too...
a catalyzed resin is always superior to a non.. whether a primer, or paint... it's why rusto rattlecan pales in comparison to an Imron, etc...
an epoxy or urethane primer is by far a better solution... more expensive than POR? of course.. but we are talking about doing things right..
I know that will offend quite a few in here.. sandblasting a frame, than slathering POR15 all over it, is a sin IMO..
if you're going thru the trouble/effort/cost to "do it right" by blasting/stripping, put a better coating system on it too...
a catalyzed resin is always superior to a non.. whether a primer, or paint... it's why rusto rattlecan pales in comparison to an Imron, etc...
an epoxy or urethane primer is by far a better solution... more expensive than POR? of course.. but we are talking about doing things right..
Flick RRMC
Registered Member
Well crap....i am doing a complete frame off restoration of a 91 burb i went to Texas to get and am looking for the right way to do it all to last for a long long time....it is the most clean rust free truck i have ever seen up here in Wisconsin and want to keep it that way...so with that said any ideas of whats best i want to know. Prep all the way to final paint. Thanks for the heads up on POR-15 i just have been reading on how good it is but never used it so i am glad someone who has has voiced them opion on it.
look into any auto urethane paint system... either an epoxy primer and catalyzed topcoat, or a urethane/topcoat.. as most in here will tell you I'm a huge fan of zinc chromate as a self-etching primer, with a urethane primer (I run DuPont 2K, very economical), and Dupont Imron over the top of that... but there are other quality paints out there. PPG, Glasurit, etc.
even if you want/need to cheap out a bit somewhere and maybe run a cheaper paint (paint being the most expensive component), I'd still advise an epoxy or uro primer under it.. it will do THE best job of preventing rust down the road..
even if you want/need to cheap out a bit somewhere and maybe run a cheaper paint (paint being the most expensive component), I'd still advise an epoxy or uro primer under it.. it will do THE best job of preventing rust down the road..
^^^^^^
learn it, live it, love it!
I agree with Paul all the way.... I have used both, once the POR gets a compromise in its "shell" the oxygen can get into the rust and escalate it even more quickly, a big issue is because its "encapsulated" you don't necessarily see it happening without peeling it off (although metal will expand when it starts eating away with rust). In a salt environment, its only a matter of time before your fighting it again perhaps with more deterioration than you realize.
learn it, live it, love it!
I agree with Paul all the way.... I have used both, once the POR gets a compromise in its "shell" the oxygen can get into the rust and escalate it even more quickly, a big issue is because its "encapsulated" you don't necessarily see it happening without peeling it off (although metal will expand when it starts eating away with rust). In a salt environment, its only a matter of time before your fighting it again perhaps with more deterioration than you realize.
Flick RRMC
Registered Member
Ok thanks guys ill for sure look into going that way....salt well we here in Wisconsin have a lot of that here but this rig will never see snow or salt as it will never drive in the snow season...if i can figure out how to put pics and all the progress onto this sight some where i will...the job has been started already...body is coming off in the next few days i hope.
"P-O-R" = "paint over rust"...it NEEDS rust to work,it is a type of rust conversion coating,that reacts with rust to form a barrier ,basically it just keeps oxogen from getting at the rust once it has been "converted"..
Put P-O-R on sandblasted or bare steel,and it wont work well,it'll fade quickly and peel off--it is not UV ray resistant either,so anyplace you use it that is exposed to sunlight will fade to flat black and lose its anti-rust performance..
That said,I have used a lot of it in past years on things like floors and undersides,and have no complaints with it--the front floor in my van was coated with it after I did some rust patches 12+ years ago--lift the mats today and you'll see nice shiny black P-O-R,looks like it was done recently..
Other areas under trucks I've used it on did not hold up so well though--the road salts they have experimented with here,ranging from calcium chloride to magnesium based and "environmentally friendly" ones have proved anything BUT friendly to the underside of a vehicle..they look like you put battery acid on the frames and brake lines,etc..
I have not kept up with all the new advances in primers and paints--Ryoken has,and he's the guy to listen too when it comes to choosing what works,lasts,and what doesn't..
I do know things like cement trucks here painted with zinc chromate and topcoated with Imron still look like they were just painted decades later,despite the harsh environment they work in and being steam cleaned often..
Put P-O-R on sandblasted or bare steel,and it wont work well,it'll fade quickly and peel off--it is not UV ray resistant either,so anyplace you use it that is exposed to sunlight will fade to flat black and lose its anti-rust performance..
That said,I have used a lot of it in past years on things like floors and undersides,and have no complaints with it--the front floor in my van was coated with it after I did some rust patches 12+ years ago--lift the mats today and you'll see nice shiny black P-O-R,looks like it was done recently..
Other areas under trucks I've used it on did not hold up so well though--the road salts they have experimented with here,ranging from calcium chloride to magnesium based and "environmentally friendly" ones have proved anything BUT friendly to the underside of a vehicle..they look like you put battery acid on the frames and brake lines,etc..
I have not kept up with all the new advances in primers and paints--Ryoken has,and he's the guy to listen too when it comes to choosing what works,lasts,and what doesn't..
I do know things like cement trucks here painted with zinc chromate and topcoated with Imron still look like they were just painted decades later,despite the harsh environment they work in and being steam cleaned often..
feel free to PM me with any questions you may have if you think I can help
tho POR bonds well with rust, and yup, tries to keep air out.. "conversion" is prolly not a good term to use, it doesn't do anything "to" the rust... ... it is not a rust converter, like Ospho, becoming iron tannite...
oh, and.. yup, that's how I did em back in the day...
amazing that a 30 yr old product like Imron is still relevant today...
63chevyll
1/2 ton status
Im not a fan of POR either.
For economy purpose ive been using rusty metal primer from rustolium. I this that is better than POR
For economy purpose ive been using rusty metal primer from rustolium. I this that is better than POR
Two things I've used that actually work are "Rust Mort" ,a rust converter made by Morton,several other brands with basically the same stuff,phosphoric acid,seem to work as well,like Duro "Extend" and Rustoleum "Rust Reformer"..both turn rust black and kills it quite effectively..
The other stuff I like is "Cold Galvanizing Compound" sold by various brands like C-R-C ..I coated the gas tank on my '81 van with it when I got it in 1990,and its resisted rusting very well,looking at it you'd think I just did it a couple years ago--not 25!..
..but its not good on everything,the zinc is not friendly to topcoats and most paints just peel off it..its great on things that had galvanizing originally like tanks and some body panels..
One warning about Imron,it'll kill your lungs permanently if any gets inhaled --use a GOOD respirator or you'll regret it...many of the body shop owners I used to mix Imron for ,have been dead a long time,due to scoffing at the "must use a respirator" warnings on paint can labels,especially ones that use a hardener like Imron,Centari,etc...
Many also smoked,even while painting a car!..most of them suffered a long time with COPD ,Emphasema and lung cancer before dying too,and a few had developed Parkinson's and Lou Gherig's disease ,Multiple Sclerosis,and one guy I know who used to paint cars on the side in his house's built in garage,had two kids that were born with Down's Syndrome..
The other stuff I like is "Cold Galvanizing Compound" sold by various brands like C-R-C ..I coated the gas tank on my '81 van with it when I got it in 1990,and its resisted rusting very well,looking at it you'd think I just did it a couple years ago--not 25!..
..but its not good on everything,the zinc is not friendly to topcoats and most paints just peel off it..its great on things that had galvanizing originally like tanks and some body panels..One warning about Imron,it'll kill your lungs permanently if any gets inhaled --use a GOOD respirator or you'll regret it...many of the body shop owners I used to mix Imron for ,have been dead a long time,due to scoffing at the "must use a respirator" warnings on paint can labels,especially ones that use a hardener like Imron,Centari,etc...
Many also smoked,even while painting a car!..most of them suffered a long time with COPD ,Emphasema and lung cancer before dying too,and a few had developed Parkinson's and Lou Gherig's disease ,Multiple Sclerosis,and one guy I know who used to paint cars on the side in his house's built in garage,had two kids that were born with Down's Syndrome..
63chevyll
1/2 ton status
Wow. What a shame. The chemicals these guys have been around for years
Imron just kinda started the show when it came to the isocyanates.... ALL the catalyzed autobody paints have been similar in that regard since than... the msds sheets show that...
that's one HUGE advantage to the new water based stuff...
I'm one of the few dinosaurs that still shoots Imron here and there... mainly cuz I still see it on the Hateras boats I shoot.... but I also run it for my satin black frame work on the rigs... and I also use the Imron clear over my chromabase on the K5... I just like the durability of it...
but as Bob pointed out, PLEASE wear proper protection...
Last edited:
POR 15 was invented for the rust belt of the usa. Where guys with rusted out classic cars could slop on the POR15 and pawn off their rusted POS to some unsuspecting and unknowing fool.
Last edited:
Works great to fresh in up rusty springs.
So.....
For my DD, I've got some pretty good surface rust going on underneath. I'm NOT, repeat....NOT..... going to spend the time to strip the entire thing down to bare metal, and coat it with zinc chromate, etc.
The best I can do is spend maybe an hour or two scraping and wire brushing off the loose rust.... blowing out the residual dust, and I will be left with a basically solid undercarriage with residual rust that I simply can't do anything about.
I tried OSPHO about a month ago on a few areas. I painted it over the rust, and over the factory black paint on the framerails (adjacent to the rusty seams, etc) and suspension parts. The initial result looked really good! Everything turned black after about 30 minutes and I figured that the OSHPO did it's job.
Now about a month or two later, those areas look kind of chalky white (where the factory black paint was) and it looks like even the rusty areas are rusty again. Should I have done a thorough water rinse to clear the excess OSHPO off those parts? Should I have topcoated with some kind of rattlecan product (Zinc Chromate?) then with a Chassis Black (Eastwood, etc) to give it more of a "factory appearance"???
I've still got TONS of OSPHO left.... so I can give this another shot, but I want to get a better idea of the complete process I should be using so I don't just waste my time again.
-G
yeah, you need to neutralize it, than rough it up and topcoat it... actually roughing it up, priming and topcoating is even better...
