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shackle flip vs. lift springs

daylton

daylton

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What do you prefer and why?
whats the benefit to doing shackle flip compared to lift springs?
besides being cheaper..
 
a shackle flip allows you to run a stock, or flatter spring, providing more flex over a lift spring.. and usually a better ride..

a lift spring of the same height will tend to tow a heavier load better.. tension vs compression shackle setup...
 
a 52 or 56 swap will net 4" of lift from a stock spring.. but that's a bit more involved than throwing in some stock length springs (47) it has some offroad plus's, and on-road minus's..

for stock 47's, you can change shackle length a little bit up there, but it's generally best to keep that modest (1/2" to an inch, netting you 1/2 that height) or you start to run into caster issues affecting steering, etc. you can also get an inch from adding a zero rate, which also allows moving the axle forward...

obviously a block is a no no up front...


my K5 is set up with 4" lifts, HD ORD shackles, a zero rate and 1" body lift to net about 6"s up front.. some fender cutting and 38's.. Mutt will have 6" springs, HD shackles and 37's, no cutting.. maybe a zero rate down the road to bump the axle forward..
 
okay and moving the axle forward benefits what exactly.. my last K5 I never got into that. im thinking of doing the diy4x shackle flip n kit, and ORD's FUSH kit along with the shackles.. but may do the diy4x front shackles instead of ord not sure yet.
any insight? and do the add a leaf in the front for axle movement forward?
 
moving the axle helps keep bigger meats out of the back fender lip and firewall.. it also helps with approach angle..

not needed for everyone... the 2 versions are ORD's zero rates and DIY4X has the EZ inch.. same thing.. you can keep the axles in the same spot and just gain the 1" of height.. or you can do that and move it forward an inch, or 1.5"


as to shackle flips, I prefer kerts at diy4x.. both his and ORD's are outstanding products, but kerts uses an external shackle as opposed to an internal like the older ORD version... externals tend to be cheaper, more efficient and easier to adjust length imo..

there are a few other manny's making them, sky, homebrew type stuff, etc, but those 2 are the main ones you'll see...
 
Moving the axle forward keeps the tire from hitting the firewall. Makes less cutting because the axles arc with the springs moves forward the firewall as it lifts up into the wheelwell. If you do the zero rate in the front you need to do a one inch in the rear as well or longer shackles to Compensate for the front lift. F you need it depends on what kind of driving you do and how big of tires you are putting on compared to The lift.
 
chulisohombre said:
Moving the axle forward keeps the tire from hitting the firewall. Makes less cutting because the axles arc with the springs moves forward the firewall as it lifts up into the wheelwell. If you do the zero rate in the front you need to do a one inch in the rear as well or longer shackles to Compensate for the front lift. F you need it depends on what kind of driving you do and how big of tires you are putting on compared to The lift.
Click to expand...

im doing the shackle flip in the rear. with the 4.5" shackles
trying to even out the front.. once I do it.
or buy a 4" front set of springs
 
A shackle flip also gives you a different pinion angle than a lift block. Yes, the blocks are typically tapered, but typically set for a standard rear driveshaft. The shackle flip sometimes turns out pretty close for a C/V style rear driveshaft (pinion points higher).
 
For the record, they are talking about moving the front axle forward. I didn't know if that was clear. The tires move to the rear as the springs flex and the front tires are notorious for grabbing the back edge of the front wheel well when the tires are turned and flexed up. The zero rate not only gives you an extra inch of lift in the front but it has a few holes in it so you can index your axle forward a little bit, helpin go alleviate the fender grabbing.

Most mild/ entry level wheelers will go w/ a lift spring in the front (2-4"). The rear will get an appropriate sized block(worse option), lift spring or shackle flip. The lift spring or shackle flip depends on how you're using the truck (just mudding or flexing over rocks, towing), how much lift you need, how much flex you'll need and your mechanical skills.
 
what hombre was saying is often you need to add a zero rate to the back to make things even...

4" springs up front and a zero rate = 5... a shackle flip in the back is 4", a zero rate added to that = 5..


blocks aren't always a horrible option as blue was alluding to... the least desirable, but... a flip can give you a worse angle for a stock driveshaft, sometimes wanting an angled shim..

whereas a block maintains a better angle... a block will also give you a softer ride than a lift spring.. also a bit more stable towing than a shackle flip.. not to mention it's by far the cheapest rear method...

downfalls being you definitely tend to get axlewrap unless you run some sort of antiwrap, ESPECIALLY if you start running some power and/or nasty gears.. and could conceivably spit a block.. but if installed properly that shouldn't happen.. plenty of people get good long service from blocks out back...



I would start simply with a 4" front spring like a tough country EZ or HD depending on whether SB or BB, winch, etc with some ORD HD shackles and maybe a FUSH kit.. out back, a flip and new shackles...

if it needs a bit of adjustment after, you can modify the back with a longer shackle or zero rate... or a zero rate up front..


what size tire are you going to run, and what's the rig's use?
 
true, its going to sadly be a DD but wanting to be a moderate rig for trails, to go hunting/fishing and wherever I may want to wheel if its rocks/mud/trees whatever..
but not a dedicated crawler or anything.
 
So guessing something like I want here then? 3 inch T/C springs in front with zero rates to move axle forward to clear 35's (total of 4 in front of lift) the ORD or DIYX4 shackle flip in rear (4.5 lift for rear) bilstein 5100 shocks. All this for a 87 K5 with front 10 bolt (8 lug conversion) 14 bolt FF rear and H2 Wheels. Still alot to get building up parts slow and trying to gain more knowledge here!
 
daylton said:
true, its going to sadly be a DD but wanting to be a moderate rig for trails, to go hunting/fishing and wherever I may want to wheel if its rocks/mud/trees whatever..
but not a dedicated crawler or anything.
Click to expand...


what size tires?


for that use, I'd definitely do a flip out back..
 
remember bigger lifts are always not better alot of guys here have smaller lifts and big tires!
 
daylton said:
true, its going to sadly be a DD but wanting to be a moderate rig for trails, to go hunting/fishing and wherever I may want to wheel if its rocks/mud/trees whatever..
but not a dedicated crawler or anything.
Click to expand...

For that description, there is really nothing wrong with a lift block.

Martin
 
I have always been against blocks I have seen to many get knocked out for something stupid.. sounds dumb but I am just personally against them..
 
THere's also a lot of people that install blocks and then never again check the u-bolt torque. Properly installed blocks really are never an issue, even the factory uses them on millions of trucks.
 
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