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Shop cost to fill R12 in 1990 Suburban? Or fREEZE 12?

eagle mark

eagle mark

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Got my A/C system leak fixed, vacuumed down and my dam r12 freon tank eas empty? Must have leaked out...

So how much would a shop charge for freon and install?

Or has anyone had luck with freeze 12?
 
I haven't done anything r12 for at least 8 years. Everything gets converted anymore. Heck, I'm not even sure you can buy r12 as a shop.

The R134A has been working good on the conversions, maybe look info the conversion
 
Lot's of shops still have r12. I found 2 midas shops and a few independents within 15 miles with it.
I have an 87 that has air that works good, just not great. I am going to a shop next week to have it sucked down and refilled. I am positive it needs a new dose of oil too. I have no leaks and don't want 134a. Sure, it can be converted, but I still have a fully functional SEALED factory system and R12 is WAY superior as a refrigerant.
 
It was working fine just down a few degrees... so I used my UV glasses and light and found a shrader valve leaking... used my recovery machine. Fixed the schrader valve. Pulled a vacuum for 2 hours. Checked it in an hour and as I expected no loss... went to refill and all my freon in a 50 pound recovery tank was gone? Was about half full... something in the recovery machine or hoses must have sprung a leak. I only use it once or twice a year...

So all I need is a refill. Just found out you even need certification now to buy freeze 12 so I will have to find a shop to refill... wonder how many dollars?
 
134aworks fine, if you get the amount right. Too much, and it won't pick up the heat in the cabin...


On my turd '86 the first thing I did was to fix the a/c, I used 134a. works fine :waytogo:
 
in my area north east i have seen as much as 90-100 per pound for r12.

if i had that i would keep it tho as i think it was the best for keepin cool .
 
R134A works, if the conversion is done right.
But, even if all the oil is changed, hoses, O-rings, its still not going to be satisfactory if the condenser is too small.
It is actually more efficient than 12 at removing heat, but that is where the problems come in.
In big town cars, caddys, limos, you usually don't have a problem. The condensers in them were oversized to begin with.

But, lots of vehicles will need the condenser changed out to one of the parallel flow units.
If you can come up with some R12, its still the best for your system. However, I have had some luck with this outfit.
http://www.es-refrigerants.com/

I bought 30lb equivalent tanks of the R12 and R22 replacement a few years back. Don't know who from.
That link does not have the info the place I got mine from did. But its the same stuff.

I have used some of the 12 in a couple of cars, and some of the 22 in something, I think a motorhome air conditioner, if I remember right.

Had good luck all times.....
 
Some day when my AC takes a catastrofic failure I would do a r134a conversion. But that is a lot of work right now my system only needs r12... it's sealed, oiled and vacuumed.

Just wondering if anyone has an idea of cost to refill? I will call around today and price... I know r12 prices have come way down since it was discontinued and no demand since 1994 when all cars went r134a. But some shops still charge way to high a price for freon...
 
For anybody interested, I just started using this alternative refrigerant in my car: http://www.es-refrigerants.com/products/w/id/173/t/r134a-replacement-refrigerant-with-dye-can/details.asp. I'm not sure about all of the legal grey areas like having unique fittings and equipment, etc. I just used all of my R134 equipment and since I do all of my own A/C work, a shop won't get cross-contamination. It's probably mostly propane, so legally you don't even need recovery equipment for it - just blow it off.

It costs $4.50 a can and 1 can is equivalent to 16 oz of R134, so it's 1/5 to 1/6 the cost.
 
From what I've read there not propane and all including r12 and r1324 mixed with oil are flammable. Freeze 12 or Duracool had a higher flashpoint then r12... so info on that comes from guys selling r12 or guys selling alternatives...

Some AC experts won't say alternatives are bad but they will say it's illegal in some states. Also when using alternative you use less quantity and run lower pressures for same cooling so I see a benefit!!!
 
Been using the freeze 12 in the older trucks. In fact I unconverted my 84 silverado from 134 to freeze 12. Freeze 12 works better in r12 systems. They don not even sell r12 at my local napa.
 
I wonder why no one uses R409a in cars it is a drop in replacement in old refrigerator/freezers that use R-12 and the pressures are very close
 
My understanding is anything with a R is regulated and you can not buy it without a certifacte. With the exception of R134a, for now...

You need to have a certifacate to buy Freeze 12 now as well.

HC 12 and Duracool are still available to public.
 
sweetk30 said:
propane in a/c is not good idea.

if leak in car cabin and you smoke its been proven to explode :weapon9:
Click to expand...

A slow refrigerant leak isn't a big threat. A typical leak is like 1oz per month. Plus, the product smells like pine-sol so you can detect it. A collision can release it all at once, but I'm more worried about 30 gallons of gas on board, some of which is at 60psi. Hydrocarbons as refrigerant is nothing new. It's been used in refrigerators long ago and it's common in cars in Australia. It's more efficient, lower cost and more environmentally friendly.

Why are we always slaves to the Feds and chemical manufacturers with their endless string of chlorofluorocarbons, hydrochlorofluorocarbons, hydrofluorocarbons and fluorocarbons?

To each their own. I still have R-134 in 3 vehicles.
 
I listened to the propane is dangerous in ACs for a long time.
Then I rode in a propane powered taxi cab.
Big propane tank in the back, pressured lines running under the car to a carb in front. And I could smell propane in the car when I got in.........

Propane in the AC does not worry me as much now........
 
sweetk30 said:
propane in a/c is not good idea.

if leak in car cabin and you smoke its been proven to explode :weapon9:
Click to expand...
Everyone's entitled to have their opinion, so let me give you mine. I have used EnviroSafe Industrial 12a (refined propane) as an a/c refrigerant for over 2 years now, and it measures colder than R12 did (at the vent). Also, propane is, and has been, widely (and safely) used in Europe as a refrigerant in tractors, cars, trucks, etc.

A lot of people will say it's dangerous. But it's not, and here's why. All fire requires three things, air (oxygen), fuel, and fire. Two of three are not present in the a/c system. Should you have a leak in a propane charged system (regardless of small or large leak), the propane will simply dilute in the atmosphere and float away. Most a/c leaks are minimal and take weeks or months to take place. That small amount of propane will not burn. By comparison, you should be more concerned about a gasoline leak at the base of your carb or fuel injection dropping fuel onto a hot engine/exhaust manifold. I suggest you read the arguments for propane before assuming it's the devil. -Just my two cents.
 
PWagon said:
Everyone's entitled to have their opinion, so let me give you mine. I have used EnviroSafe Industrial 12a (refined propane) as an a/c refrigerant for over 2 years now, and it measures colder than R12 did (at the vent). Also, propane is, and has been, widely (and safely) used in Europe as a refrigerant in tractors, cars, trucks, etc.

A lot of people will say it's dangerous. But it's not, and here's why. All fire requires three things, air (oxygen), fuel, and fire. Two of three are not present in the a/c system. Should you have a leak in a propane charged system (regardless of small or large leak), the propane will simply dilute in the atmosphere and float away. Most a/c leaks are minimal and take weeks or months to take place. That small amount of propane will not burn. By comparison, you should be more concerned about a gasoline leak at the base of your carb or fuel injection dropping fuel onto a hot engine/exhaust manifold. I suggest you read the arguments for propane before assuming it's the devil. -Just my two cents.
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more! Government = pussification all to often.
 
Well here's my review. It would cost over $200 to $400 to recharge my system with R12.

I found some HC12a for sale locally on Craiglist and the guy called just before I was going to place an order at EnviroSafe.

So I got 15 cans and the attachment for $80 bucks. The attachment is different on so many of these I have looked at I suggest you get what they sell with the freon...

I read the can and it says to charge the low side fitting with can upside down, use less then half of what R12 calls for. It says do not go over 50 PSI on low side when running. I added 3 cans, started engine, A/C on max and fan on high. Revved engine to 1500 RPM and gauge reads 30 on low side. I check center vent and got 38-39 degrees! I added a little more while running, rev engine, check pressure, little at a time and stopped at 38-40 PSI low side. Center vent temps now at 34 degrees!!! Not bad on a 88 degree day... :woot:

I also read on the can of HC12a Ingredients: Liquid Petroleum Gas with oder added. So it's not propane! :whistle:
 
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