sm465 10 spline strong enough?

[5280k5]

I'm trying to figure out if all the talk about the 10 spline output on my 465 is really something to worry about. I just recently broke my adaptor and coupler sleeve to the 205 when I landed the whole truck on my t/case and figure everything is apart now so looking in to doing some upgrades. Anyone here broke or had major issues with the 10 spline setup
I have done a complete overhaul on my tranny so trying to justify taking it all apart again to change out the mainshaft for a 32 spline and having to deal with the longer adaptor and driveshafts, etc
I wouldn't exactly say I have a light right foot so if that makes any difference....

 

[454k30]

You broke the only week link in that system, the coupler. The 10 spline is plenty strong but upgrading to the ORD 32 spline output would allow for future upgrades.

 

[blowedupmotor87]

I talked with ORD about my 465/203/205. The next batch of 32 spline shafts for the short adapter will be out in about two weeks. I am on the waiting list. IMHO, that'd be the way to go, high strength, short length!

 

[dyeager535]

I don't know as it's necessarily a weakness, probably is when putting major power through it, but the BIG problem with them IMO, and why I changed, is that the splines and/or coupler wear quite badly over time, and the amount of drivetrain slop gets absolutely terrible. It wouldn't be as noticeable with an automatic transmission, but even with a smooth idling motor, put it in gear and let the truck move, and *typically* you'll feel the drivetrain load up then unload, causing the truck to jerk.

My dad is running a 10 spline 465/205 combo behind his 454, so I have something to compare directly against the 32 spline setup, and it is a huge difference. I would liken it to the difference in how nice it is to drive a newer "refined" (if wimpier) vehicle. Lots of things can be explained off as quirks of an old design, the 10 spline slop is one of them.

 

[5280k5]

Any thoughts about having the coupler made with more spline material to lessen the "slop" ? I can feel & hear what you guys are talking about for sure.
I'm currently looking at several options: Lomax for the 10 spline setup with a custom hd adaptor with 3" clocking built in or maybe a NWF Blackbox using a short 32 spline output on my tranny or if I happen to win Powerball I'll just throw a 4 spd Atlas in

 

[Bent77]

I haven't found it to be a weakness. I would certainly think of doing the whole upgrade at once if you ste up to an aftermarket case.

As for the "slack", do you have a detroit in the rear? If not, the coupler might be your issue.

 

[Hogback Fabrication]

Any thoughts about having the coupler made with more spline material to lessen the "slop" ? I can feel & hear what you guys are talking about for sure.
I'm currently looking at several options: Lomax for the 10 spline setup with a custom hd adaptor with 3" clocking built in or maybe a NWF Blackbox using a short 32 spline output on my tranny or if I happen to win Powerball I'll just throw a 4 spd Atlas in

If you are thinking about a Lomax with a custom adapter, just set it up so you can use the factory 32 spline 465 output. The Lomax comes with whatever input you want (for no additional charge).

From a size standpoint, the 10 spline input/output is quite a bit smaller than the 32 spline setup. I have heard of several people breaking them, its on my list of things to upgrade.

 

[dyeager535]

Any thoughts about having the coupler made with more spline material to lessen the "slop" ? I can feel & hear what you guys are talking about for sure.

Doesn't matter how much material you put in there, it's the spline count that is the problem. Just like axleshafts, more splines=better. (at least to a point of course)

The 10 spline stuff wears because there is less bearing surface between the ten larger splines than there is 32 smaller ones. Not to mention, 32 spline stuff is probably held to tighter tolerances just based on technology and machinery available at the time of manufacture.

And I should quantify, my coupler and splines were in great shape when I took it apart, other than the fact that the fit just isn't very tight.

 

[5280k5]

I haven't found it to be a weakness. I would certainly think of doing the whole upgrade at once if you ste up to an aftermarket case.

As for the "slack", do you have a detroit in the rear? If not, the coupler might be your issue.

Yes, I have a Detroit in the rear. I'll have to wait till the truck gets put back together to see if the new coupler I got acts the same way.

If you are thinking about a Lomax with a custom adapter, just set it up so you can use the factory 32 spline 465 output. The Lomax comes with whatever input you want (for no additional charge)

What would I find the "short" 32 spline output in? I know I can buy one from ORD apparently but that also adds more $$$ into the equation. I talked to the guy at Jed's Machining about the adaptor make from some serious beef but still not sure about spending the money on that. If I clocked the t/case and built a skidplate shouldn't have to worry about landing on it anymore, right.....

Doesn't matter how much material you put in there, it's the spline count that is the problem. Just like axleshafts, more splines=better. (at least to a point of course)

The 10 spline stuff wears because there is less bearing surface between the ten larger splines than there is 32 smaller ones. Not to mention, 32 spline stuff is probably held to tighter tolerances just based on technology and machinery available at the time of manufacture.

And I should quantify, my coupler and splines were in great shape when I took it apart, other than the fact that the fit just isn't very tight.

I was just thinking maybe if there was a way to cut the splines at a different angle or something along those lines if it would have better surface contact,etc. The redesigned third gear in my sm465 got me thinking about it since they can cut the gear teeth at a different angle and helps prevent the jump out problem by using the angles to hold more tension against the gears teeth. Probably just overthinking something as simple as just changing the shaft out

 

[TruckNutzDude]

I break my adapters all the time, I have yet to break a sleeve or the 10 spline input/output

 

[Hogback Fabrication]

What would I find the "short" 32 spline output in? I know I can buy one from ORD apparently but that also adds more $$$ into the equation. I talked to the guy at Jed's Machining about the adaptor make from some serious beef but still not sure about spending the money on that. If I clocked the t/case and built a skidplate shouldn't have to worry about landing on it anymore, right.....

Why is the "short" output so important?

You can find a factory 32 spline output for the 465 (which is commonly found on 465/208 trucks), make a custom adapter (easier than it sounds) and then clock it however you wanted.

Adding a skid plate will prevent you from ever breaking the t-case adapter ever again. Mine has a second crossmember (which looks almost exactly like the one you already have) and a factory skid plate. I can get some pictures if you are interested in the factory setup.

 

[5280k5]

The short output is important to me b/c I don't want to have to mess with driveshafts. If the short 32 spline output would be about the same as what I have now that would be much easier unless the cost of the output is going to be more than retubing my shafts
This is why I'm researching a bunch before I do anything and thanks to you guys I have more info to help make an educated decision.

TruckNutz, you should look into getting a hd adaptor built and change it for one last time. Yeah, the factory adaptors aren't that expensive or hard to find.....yet. It's just the inconvenience of your t/case falling off the truck when your wheeling that sucks!

 

[Hogback Fabrication]

Yeah, the factory adaptors aren't that expensive or hard to find.....yet. It's just the inconvenience of your t/case falling off the truck when your wheeling that sucks!

Everyone with a 465/205 setup should check the adapter for cracks often. I was lucky to catch mine before it broke in two.

 

[B_to_C]

The short output is important to me b/c I don't want to have to mess with driveshafts. If the short 32 spline output would be about the same as what I have now that would be much easier unless the cost of the output is going to be more than retubing my shafts
This is why I'm researching a bunch before I do anything and thanks to you guys I have more info to help make an educated decision.

TruckNutz, you should look into getting a hd adaptor built and change it for one last time. Yeah, the factory adaptors aren't that expensive or hard to find.....yet. It's just the inconvenience of your t/case falling off the truck when your wheeling that sucks!

Dude you might as well just get the long output 32 spline 465 shaft and buy completely new driveshatfs. I hear your old ones were getting old, and I'm sure you would want to start with fresh new ones. I could personally haul the front one to the scrap yard for ya'