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Starting issue that bugs me...

K5_Fla

1/2 ton status
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Jan 17, 2010
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Location
FLORIDA
84 K5 with Edelbrock 1406 carb / 350ci
Start up issue that bugs the hell of me…

Truck can sit for a week – I turn the key and it starts instantly – everything is perfect. Even when the temp is 30 degrees.

Truck is warm –sometimes it starts right up like above, but half the time is has to turn over 3 times with me putting the gas the floor. What gives?

Thought I would add – the Edelbrock does have the electric choke – but I don’t have it hooked up. When I had it hooked up it was doing the same thing and never changed anything… so I just un hooked it. Live in Florida…so we never have a real hard time starting up.
 
Hard to say with no more symptoms than that.
IF it only does it when warm, then, and I know this sounds simplistic, something is changing when it gets hot.

The most obvious is vapor lock. Don't see it much anymore, but its still out there when you are dealing with carbs.

Basically, examine your fuel line. If it goes close to anything hot, or has been rerouted from stock, that might be your problem.

Also a heat soaked starter or solenoid might make it turn slower.
Heat can also affect coils and electronics.

The vapor lock could be in the carb its self. If you are missing a spacer, the bowl might be too close to the hot intake.

But, if you don't see anything like that, about your last resort is to watch your exhaust when you do start.
Black smoke means it was flooded.

Heat buildup in the lines can cause the fuel to expand and force its way past a weak float valve overfilling the carb and maybe forcing raw gas down the intake.

You may have to take notes and see if you can find a situation where it does it regularly. Then you can do tests to see if you can run it down.
 
Right now, I'm in the woods close to Blountstown, about 30 mi W. of Tallahassee.

Got a farm over here.

Next weekend, I will be in the edge of Tate's Hell swamp if I can get the beam antenna and 3 watt amp to work again with my cell card so I can sit in the swamp and still be online.
 
My edelbrock 1406 does the same thing... Fires right up when cold. If its hot, and it sits for a few min, it floods out when trying to start it, and you have to hold it to the floor.

Im pretty sure it's because my aluminum (edelbrock) intake is transferring the heat up to it. I'm sure that's what your problem is as well.

That's one of the main reasons why I'm putting a rebuilt quadrajet on it tomorrow. Other reason is that it won't idle on an incline very well.
 
makes better sense now... I also have the edelbrock aluminum intake
 
HAHahah man oh man I've been hunting this issue myself with my 1406 w electric choke, ZZ4 SBC, GMPP aluminum intake. Here's what I came up with.

Every time I'd start the truck, it'd fire up like clockwork. I can kill it and hit the key and it cranks up again and doesn't miss a stride. Even when the truck is hot, when I come out it'll usually just start off where it left off if I restart it within 10 minutes. After 10 minutes it cranks over an extra time or two, but it always gets going no problemo without any serious flooding symptoms. Summer or winter, I get these patterns.

Now, the one anomaly I seem to have is in the mornings. I sleep at my girlfriend's, drive less than a mile to my house to get ready for work in the morning, get in the truck, hopelessly flooded. This seems to happen nearly every time, and it's infuriating, bc it makes me late to work. The only time my truck is unreliable, that one trip in the morning!

First thing I do is assume it's a fuel pressure problem. I'm using a holley red top fuel pump so I'm assuming the 6-7psi flow rate is a little high for edelbrocks, which like 5-6psi range. So I add a regulator, and dial the pressure down to 4.5psi. Then I rebuild the carb and reset the float levels. The 1406 is still factory calibrated, I have not rejetted.

Even after this work, the problem persisted. So I can now round out a fuel pressure problem.

Then, I was instructed that todays bad gas is heavily oxygenated and supplemented with Ethanol, especially with the winter blends we get here in TX. Because of this, it is common to see the fuel resting in the float bowls to percolate and boil over into the rest of the metering system, and thus into the intake, causing a flooded condition. The solution, per Edelbrock, was to install an Edlebrock 9266 heat insulator gasket.

I added the insulator gasket, and lo and behold, no change.

Finally, I call Edelbrock back and the dudes tell me to lean up the choke a bit. So I lean the choke up, no change.

So I end up coming up to intake manifold swap time, chunking the GMPP intake with the EGR provisions for a Performer RPM. While not as bad, I am still having rich start conditions when driving the motor before operating temp and attempting to restart 10-15 minutes later.

After all of this I go back to the choke to figure out if it's even working. And guess what. It wasn't, the hot wire to the choke isn't pulling anything on my multimeter.

Save yourself a lot of trouble and get the choke working correctly before you throw money at the problem. What's happening is that the engine is warm enough to run on a richer mixture, but the choke is closed all the way, and it's flooding the hell out of the truck when you attempt to start it again.
 
HAHahah man oh man I've been hunting this issue myself with my 1406 w electric choke, ZZ4 SBC, GMPP aluminum intake. Here's what I came up with.

Every time I'd start the truck, it'd fire up like clockwork. I can kill it and hit the key and it cranks up again and doesn't miss a stride. Even when the truck is hot, when I come out it'll usually just start off where it left off if I restart it within 10 minutes. After 10 minutes it cranks over an extra time or two, but it always gets going no problemo without any serious flooding symptoms. Summer or winter, I get these patterns.

Now, the one anomaly I seem to have is in the mornings. I sleep at my girlfriend's, drive less than a mile to my house to get ready for work in the morning, get in the truck, hopelessly flooded. This seems to happen nearly every time, and it's infuriating, bc it makes me late to work. The only time my truck is unreliable, that one trip in the morning!

First thing I do is assume it's a fuel pressure problem. I'm using a holley red top fuel pump so I'm assuming the 6-7psi flow rate is a little high for edelbrocks, which like 5-6psi range. So I add a regulator, and dial the pressure down to 4.5psi. Then I rebuild the carb and reset the float levels. The 1406 is still factory calibrated, I have not rejetted.

Even after this work, the problem persisted. So I can now round out a fuel pressure problem.

Then, I was instructed that todays bad gas is heavily oxygenated and supplemented with Ethanol, especially with the winter blends we get here in TX. Because of this, it is common to see the fuel resting in the float bowls to percolate and boil over into the rest of the metering system, and thus into the intake, causing a flooded condition. The solution, per Edelbrock, was to install an Edlebrock 9266 heat insulator gasket.

I added the insulator gasket, and lo and behold, no change.

Finally, I call Edelbrock back and the dudes tell me to lean up the choke a bit. So I lean the choke up, no change.

So I end up coming up to intake manifold swap time, chunking the GMPP intake with the EGR provisions for a Performer RPM. While not as bad, I am still having rich start conditions when driving the motor before operating temp and attempting to restart 10-15 minutes later.

After all of this I go back to the choke to figure out if it's even working. And guess what. It wasn't, the hot wire to the choke isn't pulling anything on my multimeter.

Save yourself a lot of trouble and get the choke working correctly before you throw money at the problem. What's happening is that the engine is warm enough to run on a richer mixture, but the choke is closed all the way, and it's flooding the hell out of the truck when you attempt to start it again.


Definitely not the same problems I was having with my edelbrock, and it doesnt sound the same as the OP either.

Yours is definitely a choke issue, and my problems only occur when the engine is warm. Fuel boils over and floods it out.
 
The heat insulator gasket didn't make any difference for that problem.
 
A few things…. My 1406 has the electric choke. I un hooked it ….. no change….(butterflys open) still turns over a few times when hot. It’s still unhooked as I’m not sure it was ever really working and I don’t seem to need it. Remember…truck can sit for a week in freezing temps and fire right up with no issues…..and with the choke un hooked. Only starting hot is the issue…

So I’m thinking “heat soak” issue maybe with the ignition coil or module ????? Got new parts that will be installed tomorrow….. we’ll see. I'm also checking the vacume/timing, etc..... all tomorrow. Seems like it's rich....
 
A heat soaked starter will turn slowly, similar to an engine w a lot of initial advance. It's a slow whhhr...whrrrr. I don't think this is your issue, nor do I think it's a coil problem.

Maybe for your scenario the edelbrock 9266 heat gasket will help you; it didn't do anything for my situation, but as others have already stated, my problem happened before the engine was totally warm, so that fix naturally is there for piece of mind I guess.

You can always call the edelbrock tech line, they walked me through my issues. You're running a mechanical fuel pump, correct?
 
I have the same issue with a Holley TBI system that uses an aluminium intake manifold.

I can generally get it started by rapidly pumping the pedal to activate the jets until they've cleared out all the air.
 
Electric fuel pump in the tank - truck was orginally a TBI.

I have the fuel pressure regualtor with the gauge - all is good there.

Starter hits fast and quick in every case - not an issue - new red top battery too.
 
A heat soaked starter will turn slowly, similar to an engine w a lot of initial advance. It's a slow whhhr...whrrrr. I don't think this is your issue, nor do I think it's a coil problem.

Maybe for your scenario the edelbrock 9266 heat gasket will help you; it didn't do anything for my situation, but as others have already stated, my problem happened before the engine was totally warm, so that fix naturally is there for piece of mind I guess.

You can always call the edelbrock tech line, they walked me through my issues. You're running a mechanical fuel pump, correct?

I had that problem you are discribing. It was a bad battery cable that when got hot created too much resistance in the wire to carry enough current to turn the motor over fast enough to start.


But for the edelbrock carb problem. When that happens hold the throttle open wide while cranking to clear the throttle bores. When it fires you may need to feather the throttle some until it smooths out on its own.
 
battery and started are always prefect no matter then I start it. I got the edelbrock heat sheild for the carb... will be trying that tomorrow.
 
I

But for the edelbrock carb problem. When that happens hold the throttle open wide while cranking to clear the throttle bores. When it fires you may need to feather the throttle some until it smooths out on its own.


I have the same carb and same problem and thats all i do for hot starts.
 
looks like the carb heat sheild may of fixed it ... still testing...but definatly seems better
 
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