Truck manual to car manual

[Blazer_Boy]

Whats the feasability of doing a swap like this in an '83 C15 Shortbox, note the C, thats 2wd. The spread on the gears in the SM465 is killing me. I've got a reasonably warmed over motor and I'd like to be able to have it show. I'm even considering an auto, but I like shifting and it seems like more work to go to an auto.

 

[HarryH3]

The swap should be fairly easy, thanks to GM and their infamous interchangeability. The problem may be with the shifter. You'll need to look around and see if anyone makes a shifter with a longer handle for the tranny that you want to use, otherwise you'll be reaching down to the floor to shift. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[m j]

well actaully no the bellhousing is completely different so that will bite you in the xxx
the index on the bell is different but I am unsure about the tranny bolt pattern

 

[HarryH3]

So can he just swap to a car bell housing? But it's still the short shifter that would bug me. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[dyeager535]

With the weight of the truck (just like 8.5's not working in trucks very well) a decent car tranny *probably* won't hold up well in a truck application. They did put car trannies in the '81+trucks, appear to be Saginaw 4 speeds, which are POS's anyway, for hard use. You'd probably end up having to go with a pretty stout car manual tranny, and those aren't real cheap.

You are right, the 465 gear spread is not made for racing. Check the NV4500 out. I'm assuming they could be had in 2wd variants, (never looked) and could be had without the super low first. I'm not going to go look the info up, (because I've made my mind up, the expense isn't worth it since I don't need OD) but I thought for sure the non-granny first gear NV4500 had much friendlier gear spacing all around, not the 6:1, 3:1, 2:1, 1:1, .7 something:1, that the "desirable" 4500 had, that the 465 shares, minus the OD.

Obviously that gear spacing is kind of made up, but its close enough to correct, the 465 and 4500 with low 1st have the gear ratios spread too far for "competetive" street use.

 

[tRustyK5]

Look for the Getrag 5 speed found in 88 and newer 1/2 tons. I had one in my 88 short wide low rider (go ahead and laugh...it was a nice truck)

The truck had the 350, 8.5" rear with 3.42's and a gov-lock/forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif. Not a stout combo but it wasn't a 5700 lb 4x4 either. That 5 speed has decent ratios and put up with being speed shifted without complaint.

Upside is the toploader shifter is perfect length for a pick-up application. There is no separate bell to buy either. The bell is part of the tranny housing...plus you get overdrive so running 4.10's with 26" tires ain't no big thing. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif It's also very smooth shifting.

For a 2WD I wouldn't hesitate to use it...unless you had some firebreathing BBC under the hood.

Rene

 

[4x4Freak]

The bolt paterns on the car and truck bellhousings are the same. The center hole sizes are different; the car bellhousing has about a 4" while the truck is 5". We went through this when we swapped the sm420 into my dad's jeep.

 

[m j]

the tranny bolts are the same?
between which trannys?

 

[4x4Freak]

I'm pretty sure they were. It still had the original jeep tranny with an adapter on it with an alluminum Chevy bellhousing. I'm not sure what the AL bellhousing came out of but it might have came out of a 63 Impala with a 3 or 4 speed. We put a SM420 in it and ended up getting a cast iron bellhousing to fit it. If I remember correctly the bolt holes would line up but the center hole was too small. Of course I could be mistaken, but thats what I remember.

 

[m j]

i think the gear spacing is still really ugly in the 4500

 

[Oblin Goblin]

Yeah, the gear spacing in a nv4500 is similar to an SM465, not quite as bad but pretty similar. The main advantage of an nv4500 is that it has overdrive. An nv3500 has more car like gear spacing, though I know nothing about how strong they are or how easy one would be to swap in. You might consider a 6 speed out of a Camero or Firebird too, though that might be kinda expensive.

 

[Blue85]

Small-blocks had the same bolt patterns in cars and trucks, no?

So wouldn't the bellhousings be the same? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[HarryH3]

Either bell housing will bolt to the engine, but what mj is saying is that the rear of the bell housing, where it attaches to the tranny, is different between car apps and truck apps.

 

[Blazer1970]

Even in truck applications, there are different bolt patterns and different size pilot holes in the bell housings. Some stuff may match up, but someone needs to be a little more specific about which trannies they are talking about.

 

[dyeager535]

Yeah, like the 465 having the offset ear on one corner of the 4 bolt pattern to the bellhousing. The blocks are the same (V8 Chev that we would typically deal with) but you'd simply avert any problems by taking the bellhousing with the tranny from the donor vehicle.

Quick search shows NV4500's coming in these two configurations:

Early Late
First Gear 6.34 5.61
Second Gear 3.44 3.04
Third Gear 1.71 1.67
Fourth Gear 1.00 1.00
Fifth Gear 0.73 0.73
Reverse 6.34 5.61

NV3500 3.49. 2.14. 1.38 1.00 0.73

For comparison, a '92 Camaro T5 runs 2.68 1.80 1.31 1.00 .75

Big differences in gear spacing.