U-joint question

[MTBLAZER89]

I have two sets of shafts for my 10B front. one has used (don't know how old) spicer joints, and one has brand new PDQ (autozone) joints. Which ones do you think are more dependable and which ones should be spares. I bought the cheapos at AZ without thinking about this. Thanks

 

[pauly383]

I would leave what is already installed there and carry the others as spares. How fast they break depends on your driving. FWIW I am still running the shafts that were in it when I bought it and have been out manny times on them in the last 3 years . /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gif

 

[84_Chevy_K10]

Nothing wrong with AZ's joints, they are neapco, but go for non greasables

 

[rjfguitar]

Brian, I would pull the caps off of the spicer joints and take a looksie. If the needle bearings are all there and it isn't dry than I would say they are in good shape. I would almost trust an used spicer joint than a cheapy autozone joint...but who knows...maybe one isn't stronger than the other. /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

 

[az-k5]

I would not trust old joints. Heck for what little $$ they cost get new ones for the spares too. I don't see breaking a 10B shaft (joint or otherwise) as a big problem if you are open in the front. If you are locked get new spicer 760's (heavy duty cold forged life series)

 

[MTBLAZER89]

well I'm not locked but running 37" SSR's and I bought the $7.99 not sure on the warranty I think 1 year. We'll see I guess I would rather run the new ones just because i don't know what kind of shape the spicers are in prolly the 1982 joints that came in the axle /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif and I've already beat them pretty hard a couple times

 

[az-k5]

I ran the AZ brute force joints in my D44 with 37" MTR's for a good year (prior to the D60) I was open and never had a problem. I did a lot of rock crawling also. The most common way to blow a shaft in an open front is neglect (ie not replacing old parts) and/or bouncing under throttle. Avoid both and you will be much happier.

 

[rjfguitar]

[ QUOTE ]
The most common way to blow a shaft in an open front is neglect (ie not replacing old parts) and/or bouncing under throttle. Avoid both and you will be much happier.

[/ QUOTE ]
I can't agree more! Axle hop and tires loosing traction then catching traction violently fast is probably the 2 biggest causes of breakage in my experience.

 

[m j]

you gain [darn] all by eliminating the grease nipple IMO
you definitely get to replace them sooner though

 

[84_Chevy_K10]

[ QUOTE ]
you gain [darn] all by eliminating the grease nipple IMO
you definitely get to replace them sooner though

[/ QUOTE ]

Good thing the manufacturers know better than you in this case, there is no question as to why they use sealed u joints.

The OE's choose them for a reason as well. They're sealed better and stronger.

But yes, you're right, eventually they'll wear faster because the grease will break down and cannot be purged.

 

[m j]

OEM use them to reduce cost
no other reason
99.9% of people do not lube their chassis
for those that own a greasegun and are not afraid to use it greaseable is better
contaminants still get in non greaseable ujoints
the OEM joints on my 60 rusted away
when you can show me a series of ujoints that failed due to greasenipple installation you might have a case
I can show you plenty that died due to lack of lubricant

are you also a fan of disposable sealed unit bearing hubs?
they are another great deal for people that trade in vehicles as soon as warrantee is up, and for the parts industry

for the auto industry lube-able parts make no sense
much like cleaning and regapping sparkplugs the math doesnt make sense
if the end user isnt going to lube the part why pay for grease nipples and lube passages

 

[84_Chevy_K10]

1. Non-greasable u joints cost at least 20% more than greasables so that arguement is nonsense.

2. Those sealed bearing hubs you talk trash about and make fun of seem like a bad idea for the do it yourselfer to repair, but the reality is that a technician can replace them much quicker than replacing wheel bearings and races or even sending the spindle out to have a roller bearing pressed out--so for the majority that pay someone to work on their car they are a win/win situation for everyone.

For someone that gets the labor for free, yes, obviously it sucks to be us as the parts cost quite a bit more.

You're obsessed with the grease nipples and passages, but the reality is that it costs more to permenantly seal a u joint and put synthetic grease in it than it does to just use a weaker greasable joint in the first place.

There is absolutely no question on the strength. You're trading off strength to have that grease fitting there.

 

[Pookster]

10 dollars worth of bearings and races, x2, x 2 hrs of labor= 80 bucks?

75 dollar per side of "sealed bearings" + 1 hr of labor (yeah right, more like 1.5 hrs). 200+.

Even if the labor is 1/2 of what it takes, the parts would have to equal that amount divided by two. So if an hour of labor is 60 bucks (its about 75 here in NY metro area) the bearings would have to be less than 40 dollars each to be cost effective.

last time I head my wheel bearings done for my sedan, it was somewhere in the neighborhood for 100 bucks per wheel. (inner + outer) and a 1.5 hr billable labor.

Besides, you can still grease non greasables, it just takes more work. (disassemble, reach in with a needle, squeeze until full, reassemble, press in). I did it a few times.

Greaseables are inherently weaker, but I dunno about that "costs 20% more". Greasables acutally were like 2 bucks more at autozone. Maybe its just marketing (Greasable means you'll buy less, so they charge you more now).

Anyways, I like greasables- At least I can grease everything up when I do my oil changes, and at least I know its not "lack of grease" making that squeaking noise /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif

 

[84_Chevy_K10]

You're thinking along the lines of what you pay for parts at the counter. If you have never taken your car to a shop to have it repaired, you've never realized how badly they mark the parts up. That, "$10" worth of bearings and races in reality, at their cost, is about $30-40 worth of bearings, races, and new grease seals. You will subsequently pay easily double that for the same set of bearings, and you'll pay for a few hours of shop labor while they disassemble, clean, replace races, repack, and reinstall your wheel bearings/hubs.

For a hub assembly the part will be $75+, and list in the $150 range, but you will pay for that, and for the tech to bolt the new hub assembly on and that's it.

I don't have labor manuals at my disposal, but I would think that you'd end up leaving there with a much lower bill for the replacement of a hub assembly than a set of adjustable wheel bearings. So, for the majority of customers that don't work on their own vehicles, this represents a potential savings. For the techs--it is much easier for them, too.

For those of us that work on our own cars/trucks, they suck, because we have to pay much more for that hub assembly over the counter than the average joe.

However, I believe that the end cost is probably less for your average joe that has car with hub assemblies, takes it to a shop, and goes to the shop where all the customers must grab their ankles before entering, and pays big $$$ for the job.

Now, the bearings that must be pressed from the knuckle, I'd bet they really get an arm and a leg for them. I know we charge $45 to have that service done, and that is after the shop has charged you to disassemble it and reassemble it (they send the whole knuckle in). So, double that $45, and add whatever you think they get for completely removing a knuckle from the vehicle, and that will become an even bigger repair bill than either of the last two examples.

For the DIY guy no question the tapered bearings and seals are much cheaper (and a better setup IMO anyway).

When I worked at Autozone, greasable joints were $7.99 and non greasables $12.99. That's a pretty big jump.