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1 month to 8.1 swap, then another month to Nv4500 swap
- Thread starter #Burbslut
- Start date
87 V20 Burb- 6.2 Diesel to 8.1-Th400 to Nv4500
I got around a month to complete, then a 800 mile drive. and then a 2300 mile roundtrip
All kinds of pita things today. Got the headers on. Tightening the pass side is quite the process. So was installing the 2 rear pass spark plugs. Hopefully I remember the correct order to do the plugs down the road.
I found that a deep spark plug socket works good for most of the plugs. A short 02, offset wrench helped with the temp sensor. A long 13mm with a flex head will be on order for the rear header bolts.
The passenger side header install involved a lot of cussing and patience. I’m not going to get into the details. It’s on.
I had to trim the ear off the th400 for the dust cover. I didn’t have to trim that much, but once again. It’s on. That lead me to finding out that the cast dust cover doesn’t clear the larger rear main of the 8.1. So the flap disc came out again.
I’m hoping that I can use the three braces for the engine to transmission and bell housing to t-case. We shall see tomorrow. I need to pull the tap for the HVAC, remove the odd size plug next to the filter for the oil pressure sender, install the ac condenser, radiator, coolant and heater hoses, ground cables, standalone wiring, ecu, dbw module, wire in the fuel sender, pump, take the burb to the exhaust shop and have the head pipes modded and 02 bungs welded in.
I’m sure I’ve forgotten a few other things that will bite me in the ass.
Fingers crossed.
I found that a deep spark plug socket works good for most of the plugs. A short 02, offset wrench helped with the temp sensor. A long 13mm with a flex head will be on order for the rear header bolts.
The passenger side header install involved a lot of cussing and patience. I’m not going to get into the details. It’s on.
I had to trim the ear off the th400 for the dust cover. I didn’t have to trim that much, but once again. It’s on. That lead me to finding out that the cast dust cover doesn’t clear the larger rear main of the 8.1. So the flap disc came out again.
I’m hoping that I can use the three braces for the engine to transmission and bell housing to t-case. We shall see tomorrow. I need to pull the tap for the HVAC, remove the odd size plug next to the filter for the oil pressure sender, install the ac condenser, radiator, coolant and heater hoses, ground cables, standalone wiring, ecu, dbw module, wire in the fuel sender, pump, take the burb to the exhaust shop and have the head pipes modded and 02 bungs welded in.
I’m sure I’ve forgotten a few other things that will bite me in the ass.
Fingers crossed.
I found the right square drive for the oil plug next to the filter. I had to get a 3/8” to 1/4” npt bushing for the oil pressure sender. Some thread sealant and done. Took the stock temp sender, more thread sealant, put it in the drivers head. Done...
When it comes to the braces for the engine to transmission dust cover for the th400. The Ord crossmember and mounts don’t have the provisions to attach the braces. I’ll end up going back and maybe drill some holes in the ord plates. The t-case to bell housing brace just needs a new bolt. The engine takes metric hardware, but the stock stud has a 8mm end coming off of it. So it just needs a new bolt for the brace.
I moved onto the wiring. What a pita to route. Tilden does a good job of reworking the stock harness, but the lengths make it difficult to put the wiring in a nice clean organized install. The ecu pretty much has to go on the passenger side fender well(where the coolant tank goes), the relay box doesn’t have enough length to the wires to find a good spot for, same with the dbw module. The grounds are luckily close together so I piggy backed them all together and then added a few extras to the frame, head and back to the battery, firewall and core support.
The rest is all pretty self explanatory. I started with the coolant temp sensor and it was simple from there. All the plugs were the proper length to reach everything. The real pita was the dam crank position sensor. I cussed at that one for nearly 45minutes. The dbw harness I pulled apart and fed it through the tiny hole and reassembled.
The ignition source was easy, I still have the check engine light, tach, water temp and oil pressure sender to wire.
I moved onto putting the ac condenser, radiator, transmission cooler lines. The fan and shroud have to go in at the same time. What a great fit with the diesel radiator and shroud. I had to use a gasser lower radiator hose and the upper was not so slam dunk. The diesel radiator has a huge upper neck on it. I had to trim down some hose I found at the store. I’ll have to find a better solution down the road. The hose end was a tad too big on the t stat end. Double hose clamped that bitch. If I had the 454 radiator, it would be much easier to find a hose.
When it comes to the braces for the engine to transmission dust cover for the th400. The Ord crossmember and mounts don’t have the provisions to attach the braces. I’ll end up going back and maybe drill some holes in the ord plates. The t-case to bell housing brace just needs a new bolt. The engine takes metric hardware, but the stock stud has a 8mm end coming off of it. So it just needs a new bolt for the brace.
I moved onto the wiring. What a pita to route. Tilden does a good job of reworking the stock harness, but the lengths make it difficult to put the wiring in a nice clean organized install. The ecu pretty much has to go on the passenger side fender well(where the coolant tank goes), the relay box doesn’t have enough length to the wires to find a good spot for, same with the dbw module. The grounds are luckily close together so I piggy backed them all together and then added a few extras to the frame, head and back to the battery, firewall and core support.
The rest is all pretty self explanatory. I started with the coolant temp sensor and it was simple from there. All the plugs were the proper length to reach everything. The real pita was the dam crank position sensor. I cussed at that one for nearly 45minutes. The dbw harness I pulled apart and fed it through the tiny hole and reassembled.
The ignition source was easy, I still have the check engine light, tach, water temp and oil pressure sender to wire.
I moved onto putting the ac condenser, radiator, transmission cooler lines. The fan and shroud have to go in at the same time. What a great fit with the diesel radiator and shroud. I had to use a gasser lower radiator hose and the upper was not so slam dunk. The diesel radiator has a huge upper neck on it. I had to trim down some hose I found at the store. I’ll have to find a better solution down the road. The hose end was a tad too big on the t stat end. Double hose clamped that bitch. If I had the 454 radiator, it would be much easier to find a hose.
A few pictures that didn’t load
Wtf? Sorry about the doubles.
But. It runs!
I cycled the key a few times until the fuel pump stopped pumping air, checked the fuel pressure at the rail, and boom! It lit right off.
tomorrow I’ll try and get all the littles done. I’m super stoked. I’ll haul it to the exhaust shop on Tuesday!
But. It runs!
I cycled the key a few times until the fuel pump stopped pumping air, checked the fuel pressure at the rail, and boom! It lit right off.
tomorrow I’ll try and get all the littles done. I’m super stoked. I’ll haul it to the exhaust shop on Tuesday!
Exhaust shop bound tomorrow, actually. Later.
Wow the dbw is super sensitive. I went to move it on the trailer and nearly ran into the garage. I had forgotten that I had deleted the rear load proportion valve and there was no brake fluid in the rear lines. A quick bleed and we are good to go again.
Wow the dbw is super sensitive. I went to move it on the trailer and nearly ran into the garage. I had forgotten that I had deleted the rear load proportion valve and there was no brake fluid in the rear lines. A quick bleed and we are good to go again.
"Wow the dbw is super sensitive."
What year 8.1? Mine is a 2001 which is the most sensitive so I am also worried about this...
What year 8.1? Mine is a 2001 which is the most sensitive so I am also worried about this...
It should be able to be dialed down a little in the tune I think.
Hauled it to the exhaust shop today. Apparently the 6” super ride springs aren’t very tow friendly. The poor 91 was sacked out for sure. I have a certain sweet spot that tows well on my 87 4” lifted burb. I tried to back up the load one the trailer, but then I could tell that there was too much weight in the back of the trailer. So I put it back. Maybe I need to play with drop hitch heights
here is a shot of my 87, with a 84k20 on the back. A few differences are that my 87 has a BBC, heavy winch bumper and winch. I’m sure the dual batteries don’t help either.
here is a shot of my 87, with a 84k20 on the back. A few differences are that my 87 has a BBC, heavy winch bumper and winch. I’m sure the dual batteries don’t help either.
I went to wire in the temp sender and oil pressure sender, not sure what happened. Maybe it’s something in the wiring, I did get a new engine bay harness to fire wall bulkhead, but the oil pressure gauge is pegged all the way.
Thoughts? There is no change key on or off.
Next, the temperature gauge seems to read hotter than normal. I’ll be changing the t stat out just in case and report back.
possible incorrect sender? Air bubbles? Or stuck t stat...
last but not least. I bought 2 cheap Bluetooth, Wireless obd plug readers. I have torque and obd fusion apps, but neither one seems to work.... Any thoughts there?
Please and thank you...
Thoughts? There is no change key on or off.
Next, the temperature gauge seems to read hotter than normal. I’ll be changing the t stat out just in case and report back.
possible incorrect sender? Air bubbles? Or stuck t stat...
last but not least. I bought 2 cheap Bluetooth, Wireless obd plug readers. I have torque and obd fusion apps, but neither one seems to work.... Any thoughts there?
Please and thank you...
I sure love this trailer!
After looking at my old harness, I can see a difference in a few things. I’ll be pulling a few pins out and try relocating them. I’m hoping that the gauge isn’t ruined.
After looking at my old harness, I can see a difference in a few things. My fuel sender and oil pressure sender wires were in the wrong spots. I was able to squeeze the connector blades with some needle nose pliers, pull them out, re-expand the lock tab and put the wires into the proper spots.
Be wary of Jabin Wood. I specifically told him my rig was a diesel, my situation and needed it quick. I even offered to pay a expedite fee. He took 2weeks longer than told, never replied in a timely fashion(usually took days), built it wrong, assumed I needed a underdash harness too, and sent me a bulkhead harness that’s wired for a gasser. Oh, and now that I’m saying this, I’m wondering if it was supposed to be cheaper because he never made me a under dash harness. I won’t even extrapolate on the shipping problem.
All I can say is that I’m glad I kept my old bulkhead harness as a reference. I never found the right schematic for my 87 diesel burb.
I moved the wires and I’m
Be wary of Jabin Wood. I specifically told him my rig was a diesel, my situation and needed it quick. I even offered to pay a expedite fee. He took 2weeks longer than told, never replied in a timely fashion(usually took days), built it wrong, assumed I needed a underdash harness too, and sent me a bulkhead harness that’s wired for a gasser. Oh, and now that I’m saying this, I’m wondering if it was supposed to be cheaper because he never made me a under dash harness. I won’t even extrapolate on the shipping problem.
All I can say is that I’m glad I kept my old bulkhead harness as a reference. I never found the right schematic for my 87 diesel burb.
I moved the wires and I’m
I moved the wires and I’m happy to report that the fuel level and pressure sender gauges are working now. Next is figuring out if my temp gauge is way off, or my motor is overheating. Just at a idle for 5 minutes, it will nearly peg the gauge. I can hold the lower t stat piece in my hand, so I’m not convinced it’s correct. I changed the t-stat and sender. Same results. Just a quick jaunt to the bottom of my road and back also nets the same temps.
I did notice the clutch fan was still spinning for 10-15 seconds after I shut it down. I need to get a laser temp gun and try to figure it out. Maybe my heater core hoses are routed wrong? Any ideas?
And last but not least. I have no engine light. I tried to hook up a small indicator lamp, but I got nothing. I plugged a Bluetooth obd scanner in. Nothing, no communication, no connection. I sent a message to Tilden and my Tuner. I got a few things to check tomorrow.
I did notice the clutch fan was still spinning for 10-15 seconds after I shut it down. I need to get a laser temp gun and try to figure it out. Maybe my heater core hoses are routed wrong? Any ideas?
And last but not least. I have no engine light. I tried to hook up a small indicator lamp, but I got nothing. I plugged a Bluetooth obd scanner in. Nothing, no communication, no connection. I sent a message to Tilden and my Tuner. I got a few things to check tomorrow.
If it’s not one this, it’s another. My th400 slips into second gear.
replair the th400 or rebuild my 4l80. It will cost nearly 3k for the 80 swap, and 1100-1200 for the 40.
dammit
replair the th400 or rebuild my 4l80. It will cost nearly 3k for the 80 swap, and 1100-1200 for the 40.
dammit
It is much faster though
It's difficult to poke the like button on those posts , because there is some bad news with the good!
You have made some great progress and gotten some good results, it just sucks that you have had the other crap happening.
You have made some great progress and gotten some good results, it just sucks that you have had the other crap happening.
Sucks. But that's the one step forward two steps back dance this hobby does to us.
To get it rolling I'd fix the 400. Besides rebuilding the 4L80e you need the harness and your tune changed to run the trans. Which means you need a vss signal and all that stuff.
Not to mention the change in driveshaft lengths with the 4L80e.
Get it running and once it's on the road you can work up the 4L80e.
To get it rolling I'd fix the 400. Besides rebuilding the 4L80e you need the harness and your tune changed to run the trans. Which means you need a vss signal and all that stuff.
Not to mention the change in driveshaft lengths with the 4L80e.
Get it running and once it's on the road you can work up the 4L80e.
That’s what I am thinking of doing. Plus, having a built th400 around is always good.
I have the harness and tune worked out. Tilden Motorsports is close to me and my tuner said he would only need a day to put the info into the ecu.
That would still leave the 4l80 rebuild, shafts and 241 swap. Plus. I really want to have the shorter 1st gear option installed too, but that is as much as a th400 rebuild just for the parts.
Is there a way to upload a video here? My YouTube account got shutdown and locked out. I’d like to share a few vids.
I have been daily driving it for 3 days now. It’s about a 25 mile round trip venture. I’m loving the 8.1. The fuel economy is to be expected. The poor th400 is on its last leg of its life. I got lots of clutch material in the pan. I’ve been in contact with my transmission guy. I’m just going to run it till it don’t run no more. I’ve adjusted the vacuum modulator and the kickdown. It’s as good as it’s going to get.
I’ll eventually get my 4l80 built, but I have a long list of upgrades and it needs a rebuild. The big ticket is the lower first gear option. I’m not in a financial position to do the rebuild, upgrades, driveshafts, tune and wiring so I’ll just have my guy build me a th400 for now.
but until then. I figured that I’d give the 8.1 it’s first tow test.
It is a amazing difference from the 6.2. Pretty much would be floored everywhere when hauling with the old diesel. It was a challenge to keep it at speed. With the 8.1, I have to watch the speeds and keep it down. It hauls quite effortlessly. It was a 85 mile round trip. Nothing exciting to report.
I have been daily driving it for 3 days now. It’s about a 25 mile round trip venture. I’m loving the 8.1. The fuel economy is to be expected. The poor th400 is on its last leg of its life. I got lots of clutch material in the pan. I’ve been in contact with my transmission guy. I’m just going to run it till it don’t run no more. I’ve adjusted the vacuum modulator and the kickdown. It’s as good as it’s going to get.
I’ll eventually get my 4l80 built, but I have a long list of upgrades and it needs a rebuild. The big ticket is the lower first gear option. I’m not in a financial position to do the rebuild, upgrades, driveshafts, tune and wiring so I’ll just have my guy build me a th400 for now.
but until then. I figured that I’d give the 8.1 it’s first tow test.
It is a amazing difference from the 6.2. Pretty much would be floored everywhere when hauling with the old diesel. It was a challenge to keep it at speed. With the 8.1, I have to watch the speeds and keep it down. It hauls quite effortlessly. It was a 85 mile round trip. Nothing exciting to report.
