52s vs custom front leaves

[72k5mike]

Just want to get an idea what you guys would go with and why?

I currently have waggy springs in the front with an add-a-leaf, but they arent in the greatest of shapes and 63s in the rear, if that makes a difference. They are the 7 leaf waggy fronts and I have about 4" of lift. I would have custom springs made to close to these packs by alcan.

I am not concerned about fabbing for the 52s, but it would take a considerable amount of more work.

I assume the 52s will flex better, but I am afraid of axle wrap.


Let me know what you guys think

 

[Hogback Fabrication]

Pro's for the 52's: Cheap
Con's for the 52's: Bad approach angle, typically poor axle wrap control, typically don't last long, more prone to folding over the main leaf in reverse

Custom front springs are basically the opposite of all that.

You can max out a 14" travel shock with good stock length front springs, if you need more than that you're doing it wrong

*FWIW I've been running a bunch of different 52's on the front of mine for the last four years or so, college kid budget so I have some experience with them*

 

[miniwally]

Like Chris said there are pro's and cons to each.

IMO going to 52s is an unneeded amount of work. Yes, an OK set of 52s will flex good for a low cost in the springs but you are having to move brackets, maybe? move the steering box etc. Then you end up having something that has poor approach angle, and travels more than standard crossover steering can really keep up with anyway.

Spend the money on a good set of stock replacement springs, I mean custom made for your vehicle not off the shelf Tuff countries. You will end up with enough travel to max out the steering and will have simply talked on the phone, waited a bit and bolted in a set of springs that are ready to use. Yes your wallet will be a bit lighter using this method than the 52" method.

If you can't tell I'm into the least amount of work for the most bang. It's not the cheapest way to go sometimes but all of us are suffering from reduced time to play so why take that time up with working on the play vehicle.

 

[Blue85]

But what about the common (CK5) belief that the front shackle angle is incorrect with stock length springs? If you move the rear bushing mount forward you have already done about half of the work of the 52" swap.

 

[miniwally]

But what about the common (CK5) belief that the front shackle angle is incorrect with stock length springs? If you move the rear bushing mount forward you have already done about half of the work of the 52" swap.

While your having your custom springs built have them made a little longer? Then you don't move the hanger, put a longer shackle on for a bit better travel and I think you would be good. Same basic theory as having them offset the spring pin so you can move the axle forward without using a zero rate.

I don't spend a lot of time looking at anything but race car parts anymore but having been around a few sets of good custom springs you can make them work out.

 

[shady]

I love my stock legnth alcans. they flex well, ride great and were NOT real expensive.

 

[blazinzuk]

I am running 56sinto in front given the choice I would rock custom springs in a second, more axle control, you can place the axle whereever you want, make the shackle angle whatever you want. Like Chris I replace springs about every year on average. Custom springs should last years

 

[Stomis]

While your having your custom springs built have them made a little longer? Then you don't move the hanger, put a longer shackle on for a bit better travel and I think you would be good. Same basic theory as having them offset the spring pin so you can move the axle forward without using a zero rate.

I don't spend a lot of time looking at anything but race car parts anymore but having been around a few sets of good custom springs you can make them work out.

Ive always said this. A 49 or 50in main leaf would make the stock brackets work perfect.


Whats all this jazz about 52s giving you a bad approach angle? This is the first Ive ever really heard complaints about it. I mean the brackets are still under the truck...

 

[Hogback Fabrication]

Whats all this jazz about 52s giving you a bad approach angle? This is the first Ive ever really heard complaints about it. I mean the brackets are still under the truck...

Even with stock length springs the spring eyes are usually the limiting factor for approach angle, going to 52's hurts your approach angle as much as dropping tire size 5"...

 

[Wyomingboy]

I got a set of custom (stock length) springs from ORD, along with their shackles, longer steering arm, and it all bolted up nice, gave me a 3" lift.
Put on their reverse shackle system in rear with 52"s. I have way more articulation and smooth travel than I need. Been happy with it.

 

[big dan]

Whats all this jazz about 52s giving you a bad approach angle? This is the first Ive ever really heard complaints about it. I mean the brackets are still under the truck...

If I had some pictures of what my front spring hangers look like now I would show you what the bad approach angle is.

My spring hangers are usually the first thing to hit an obstacle. On my last trail ride I actually had to ram an obstacle at speed to get my front hangers to ramp over the first rock so the tires could grab. The only way to hit the obstacle was straight on so it was the only way, unless I get out and stack rocks and who wants to do that

My front hangers look like a crazy man went wild with a hammer on them. Im not even sure Ill be able to remove the bolts when I need to.

Custom springs all the way if they are in the budget.

 

[blazinzuk]

If I had some pictures of what my front spring hangers look like now I would show you what the bad approach angle is.

My spring hangers are usually the first thing to hit an obstacle. On my last trail ride I actually had to ram an obstacle at speed to get my front hangers to ramp over the first rock so the tires could grab. The only way to hit the obstacle was straight on so it was the only way, unless I get out and stack rocks and who wants to do that

My front hangers look like a crazy man went wild with a hammer on them. Im not even sure Ill be able to remove the bolts when I need to.

Custom springs all the way if they are in the budget.

Good gosh yes. I hate how far out my spring hangers stick. Hit them all the time. Of course I knew I would and wrapped them with some solid rod to protect the bolts and make them more sturdy. On my blazer that had full custom mounts ( used 60" dodge leafs) I bent them all sorts of crazy, really hard to get the springs out.

That had more lift so not as big a deal.

If its in the budget custom springs are a kind of no brainer thing

 

[Blue85]

Now we're talking. A 50" custom pack with 24/26". I'm going to ask for a quote on something like this. And I agree that the really cheap aspect of the 52" swap dries up if you don't want to move the axle forward or you end up relocating both spring hangers. Then if you change your mind later...

What are people paying for Alcans or Deavers that are in the 4-6" lift range?

 

[72k5mike]

Thanks guys, this is exactly what I was looking for. and i have a first gen, so the springs stock are 44", but I will probably go with a 47" with an offset pin (thats what my waggys are)

Unfortunately, it is just dreaming at this point..... hopefully by summer

 

[big pappa b]

Never heard anything bad about Alcan. If I ever change springs I will be using them

 

[shady]

alcans are around $225 a corner. I paid a little over $900 for a full set of 3" lift ones for my burb

 

[miniwally]

I don't know what kind of actual custom designing Alcan does. I think they know the stock lengths and spring rates and have a spring that they have worked out for that vehicle.

I know Stephen at ORD actually does custom work, i.e. even though a spring that has been done before might be close for your truck he actually designs a spring pack for you to work how you want it to work. Moving center pins, different lengths etc are what he deals with all the time.

 

[shady]

ORD orders through Alcan. that is the custom springs from them. Call them and ask. Alcan takes every weight and dimension you give 'em and builds a set for that vehicle.

 

[miniwally]

ORD orders through Alcan. that is the custom springs from them. Call them and ask. Alcan takes every weight and dimension you give 'em and builds a set for that vehicle.

I'm pretty aware of the fact Alcan builds ORD's springs.

I just don't know if Alcan provides the smae service ORD does? If I understand correctly Alcan does do some "custom" designing hence the weight and length etc. but perhaps not to the extent that ORD does.

 

[Hogback Fabrication]

ORD orders through Alcan. that is the custom springs from them. Call them and ask. Alcan takes every weight and dimension you give 'em and builds a set for that vehicle.

We don't order Alcan springs.

We design EVERY aspect of the springs ourselves based on our work and experience with these trucks (we run them on just about every leaf sprung truck here). Then we send those specs to Alcan and they build OUR springs to OUR specs. They are good at building springs and are right down the road from us, hence why they build them for us.

Our springs are actually quite different from the springs Alcan specs themselves. Of course it depends on weight capacity and lift height but ours are usually ~10 thin leaves which allow lots of vertical travel without killing the spring.