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56" spring questions

noahrob said:
Hi,

I am pretty sure this is on topic. 1. Why do the shackle flips need to get swapped form side to side for 56" springs? 2. Leper, I don't understand. 4" springs, plus 4" shackle flip equals 5" of lift? Is that becasue of the long shackle?

Basically, I have 6" springs in the front and a 4" shackle flip in the rear. Since I need to get 2" springs in the back, I figured I might as well get some that are longer with longer shackles, but after reading this, I am a little confused as to whether I need rear springs with more arch, like 4" just to get 6" overall.
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1. they dont in fact this is the worse way to do it. i ran 56" springs in the 52" location on the regular side, not switched. i ran 6.5" shackles and the angle was perfect. tons of droop and plenty of compression. look in my sig and follow the link to my gallery you can see pics of my shackle angle.
2. all you need is 2" lift springs. if you go with 2 " springs i go with a shackle more in the 7" range because the spring needs more room to compress and a little less angle.

Btw. 6.5" is the short hole on those lower shackles so they work perfect when used in this application
 
noahrob said:
Hi,

I am pretty sure this is on topic. 1. Why do the shackle flips need to get swapped form side to side for 56" springs? 2. Leper, I don't understand. 4" springs, plus 4" shackle flip equals 5" of lift? Is that becasue of the long shackle?

Basically, I have 6" springs in the front and a 4" shackle flip in the rear. Since I need to get 2" springs in the back, I figured I might as well get some that are longer with longer shackles, but after reading this, I am a little confused as to whether I need rear springs with more arch, like 4" just to get 6" overall.
Click to expand...
I

'm not sure what Leper is saying- I think it was a typo. He is running stock springs with a zero rate and a ord 4" shackle flip last I checked. He definately doesn't have 8" of lift in the back. More like 5. Go ahead and get the longer 56" springs with one of the 4" shackle flip kits- I chose ORD because I love their stuff and have never had a single problem with anything from them. The reason for swapping sides with the hangers is because the mount for the shackle eye is not centered. If you flip the shackle hangers side to side, it effectively moves the mount about 2.5" either way from what i remember when experimenting with mine. Just keep in mind how important shackle length/angle is for proper suspension performance. Here's the basics- the shackle length and angle must be positioned so that as the spring compresses and flattens, the shackle should swing back and be nearly flat. A lot of people hamper their suspensions performance by settling on shackle angle, Killing droop in most scenarios. There was a great article that I read years ago on shackle design and suspension theory- man I wish I could find that and link it! Here's a couple of pics of my truck with a 4" 56 spring and ord's 4"f lip kit. It literally took me months to perfect my suspension setup. At first, when everything was just slapped together with my rancho front springs, I was flexing about a 600 I would guess. The ride was horrible. All the shackle angle and suspension work that I did gave me a blazer that flexes well enough to put up 1300+ on a 20* ramp, rides like a caddy going down the street and works well everywhere!
 
koldsimer said:
I

'm not sure what Leper is saying- I think it was a typo. He is running stock springs with a zero rate and a ord 4" shackle flip last I checked. He definately doesn't have 8" of lift in the back. More like 5. Go ahead and get the longer 56" springs with one of the 4" shackle flip kits- I chose ORD because I love their stuff and have never had a single problem with anything from them. The reason for swapping sides with the hangers is because the mount for the shackle eye is not centered. If you flip the shackle hangers side to side, it effectively moves the mount about 2.5" either way from what i remember when experimenting with mine. Just keep in mind how important shackle length/angle is for proper suspension performance. Here's the basics- the shackle length and angle must be positioned so that as the spring compresses and flattens, the shackle should swing back and be nearly flat. A lot of people hamper their suspensions performance by settling on shackle angle, Killing droop in most scenarios. There was a great article that I read years ago on shackle design and suspension theory- man I wish I could find that and link it! Here's a couple of pics of my truck with a 4" 56 spring and ord's 4"f lip kit. It literally took me months to perfect my suspension setup. At first, when everything was just slapped together with my rancho front springs, I was flexing about a 600 I would guess. The ride was horrible. All the shackle angle and suspension work that I did gave me a blazer that flexes well enough to put up 1300+ on a 20* ramp, rides like a caddy going down the street and works well everywhere!
Click to expand...
you didnt see my post did ya??? i already did all the work...:p: with that setup that i mentioned, springs fully droop (and it has tons of shackle swing which = more droop) and will completly compress. shackle flips offset 1.5" from the stock hole so its either 1.5" forward or 1.5" back, for a total range of 3"
 
79k20350 said:
1. they dont in fact this is the worse way to do it. i ran 56" springs in the 52" location on the regular side, not switched.
Click to expand...

Just keep in mind that all aplications are different.You appear to be running stock 56" 3/4 or 1 ton springs. Because of the lack of arc in the spring at rest, it will extend maybe an inch or two lengthwise during compression. If you are running a lift spring like I am, the spring will flatten a lot more than yours and therefore my shackle needs to be able to extend enough to allow the spring to flex. That being said, your angle looked great with the shackles that had the two mounting positions on the ends. Just about perfect for your setup IMO.
 
79k20350 said:
you didnt see my post did ya??? i already did all the work...:p: with that setup that i mentioned, springs fully droop (and it has tons of shackle swing which = more droop) and will completly compress. shackle flips offset 1.5" from the stock hole so its either 1.5" forward or 1.5" back, for a total range of 3"
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Sorry if you thought that advice was directed at you.... like I said, your angle looks great. You definately did your homework. Did you pull your spring clamps in the back?
 
koldsimer said:
Just keep in mind that all aplications are different.You appear to be running stock 56" 3/4 or 1 ton springs. Because of the lack of arc in the spring at rest, it will extend maybe an inch or two lengthwise during compression. If you are running a lift spring like I am, the spring will flatten a lot more than yours and therefore my shackle needs to be able to extend enough to allow the spring to flex. That being said, your angle looked great with the shackles that had the two mounting positions on the ends. Just about perfect for your setup IMO.
Click to expand...

Thats why i mentioned a longer shackle may be in order if using lift springs. because of the increased amount of uptravel you need either 1.longer shackles which will a. still allow alot of droop even though the angle is not as steep b. make up for the increased amount of uptravel by decreasing angle.
2. move the mount back this will a.give you to get a good angle b. run a shorter shackle 3. will not have as much range of motion as a supension setup with a similar angle and loinger shackle.
 
koldsimer said:
Sorry if you thought that advice was directed at you.... like I said, your angle looks great. You definately did your homework. Did you pull your spring clamps in the back?
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no, didnt think advise was coming towards me, just seems some people say things over and over, i was just messing with ya;) i didnt pull the clamp the springs were shot enough. also i needed more weight in the back to get the springs to flex all the way which i ditn have. not worried about it now that trucks long gone. im doing a 93 extended cab, sas link is in my sig:D
 
as the official starter of this thread, i figured i would let all you know that i decided to go with the DIY4x setup with the 6" shackles. its less work, and i love that fact that he includes brackets that the nuts are welded to. it make the swap easy on a blazer and that damn gas tank in the way.
 
That's the kit that has two mounting positions to change your shackle angle right? Good choice. All of Kerts stuff is sweet.
 
koldsimer said:
That's the kit that has two mounting positions to change your shackle angle right? Good choice. All of Kerts stuff is sweet.
Click to expand...

no, the B52 front spring kit is the one with the two mounting points i believe. i also have that. but the factory holes were symetrical so you can just flip it to the other side and get the mounting points farther back.
 
Hey, koldsmier and 79K20350,

Thank you very much. I have been reading thread after thread, but couldn't understand why the shackle flips had to change sides and how the 56" spring shackle angle worked...I am much more clear now and have a better idea of how to proceed...last question, I promise (not really). With the 56" springs, does it make sense to get a stiffer spring like the superlifts(koldsmier) or something to avoid axle wrap and sag...I'm just thinking that since the springs are longer there is likely to be more flex in every direction? I'm going to get BDS 6" in the front (Deaver wants $750 for a pair of 6" fronts so they're out) but was thinking somethin stiffer for the rear.
 
I went 56 rear from superlift. I pulled the overload spring and I now have what i consider to be an excellent compromise of flex and axlewrap. I still wish that I had a good traction bar a lot of the time though. When I had the overload in, it had much less axlewrap.
 
alcan only charges like 200-250 a spring. im in love with the alcans i have :D
 
Based on several factors, I am going to order my alcans momentarily. 1. BDS's "no fine print" warranty has fine print, and that pisses me off, I hate feeling dupped. 2. Deaver's are very expensive, and to be honest, I would actually pay the fee, but the guy on the phone didn't exactly float my boat. 3. Charles at Alcan was not only super cool, but took the time to talk to me. Also, although the Alcan's ain't cheap, they ain't like the Deaver's. 4. There are 2 guys here that have both said they love their Alcan's and after reading a lot of posts from both of them, they seem to knwo their crap...one of them is 79k20350 and the other is from the murder capital of BC.

I'll update after I get them just in case anybody cares.
 
Good choice on the Alcans. A great spring from what i've heard. If you don't mind me asking, how much are they gonna run shipped?
 
noahrob said:
Leper, I don't understand. 4" springs, plus 4" shackle flip equals 5" of lift? Is that becasue of the long shackle?
Click to expand...
I run a 4" spring in the front with a zerorate on a D60 about 5" lift.
The rear is level with the front. The 4" spring has the overload removed reducing the spring rate and taking about an inch from it. If the shackle was shorter, the spring might give a little more lift.
I don't understand it myself.
 
You have a 4" shckle flip in the rear as well? I'm sorry to be so dense, but I don't get it...I even drew myself a picture, but here is my math:

4" Shackle Flip + 3" Spring Lift (4" lift - 1" overload) = 7"
 
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