6.0 LS engine, who tows with one.

[yellowK20]

I'm in serious thought of swapping out the TBI 350 in my 91 V3500. truck will see fairly heavy towing dutys, just not very often . I don't expect cummins or duramax power and mileage numbers but I don't wanna be sucking wind in the slow lane our hopping gas station to gas station either.


I'm not opposed to supercharging, turbo is out I'm not dealing with all the tube work required to plumb a turbo I'd like to see 450-475 Hp on pump gas and get around 6-8 MPG towing around 14-16 empty

315-70-17's all terrain type tires the rest of it will be mostly stock

 

[yellowK20]

possibly doing the shortbed thing as well. not sure I wanna give up the bed space and smooth ride though

 

[454Sub]

We compared a 6.0 to an 8.1. Towing same trailer 6.0 got 8 vs 8.1s 10. Empty the 8.1 now gets 15 and the 6.0 got 15. But 8.1 had cold air intake and tuner. 6.0 was stock. I wouldn't buy a 6.0, leave it stock and tow with it. The 8.1 just ran all over it and got same or better mileage mileage. The 6.0 has way more aftermarket possibilities nowadays though.

Both trucks had 4.10s and autos. Both extended cab shortbeds. 8.1 had 33x12.5s and 6.0 had whatever came factory on them.

 

[dhcomp]

I'm in serious thought of swapping out the TBI 350 in my 91 V3500. truck will see fairly heavy towing dutys, just not very often . I don't expect cummins or duramax power and mileage numbers but I don't wanna be sucking wind in the slow lane our hopping gas station to gas station either.


I'm not opposed to supercharging, turbo is out I'm not dealing with all the tube work required to plumb a turbo I'd like to see 450-475 Hp on pump gas and get around 6-8 MPG towing around 14-16 empty

315-70-17's all terrain type tires the rest of it will be mostly stock

Don't think you are going to get 14-16 empty with any gas motor.

I got 11-12 in a 99 454 burb.

 

[4xcrazy]

Way back when Shawns (Supersize75) truck was a 2wd, he used it to pull his old trail truck, I believe it was the green one, we stopped side by side at a stoplight on the way to a trail. We both took off, kind of sort of faster than usual, he out ran me with his 6.0 2wd, pulling a trailer and a Blazer on it and I was only in my Burb with a 5.7, I could NOT keep up or catch up. I was amazed at the power that engine had.

 

[miniwally]

Not that you have a comparision but I have pulled a ~5,000# trailer up Vail and Eisienhower tunnel here in Colorado at about 45mph many times with a 6.0. They don't win speed awards, or milage awards but they do get the job done.

They like RPM, have massive aftermarket support and are "cheap" when you realize that you get multiport fuel injection with them.

More power than any TBI 350 ever hoped for and way more reliable. Just remember they like RPM, really start pulling about 3500 and by 4500 they are going good. Factory redline is 5800+ and they will run there for days.

 

[dhcomp]

Were you thinking of running your 4l80e, or swapping a motor/trans combo?

 

[Gorillajeep]

I have a buddy that has a 2500 regular cab 4WD that has the 6.0 stock. He tows all over the place with his rig. I have no clue as to what kind of milage he is getting but he is very happy with it and brags constantly, I know he has well over 100K on the truck. He was the one that got me to thinking the same thing about my Suburban. It doesn't tow much, and I just wanted to update and get a little more reliable. I have a mild BB that does pretty well. so

 

[6.2Blazer]

I have an '03 2500HD (6.0, 4L80E, 4.10, CCSB) with 130k on it that I bought new to tow my 1-ton diesel K5. It's been on the scale and the trailer/K5 combo weights around 8,500 lbs. Never towed through the mountains but have been down in the hills of Kentucky many times. Have always been able to stay within 5 mph of the speed limit (if I ran it harder and downshifted into 2nd it would maintain speed). It will pull in OD with larger 285/75R16 tires up to a mild incline, then will downshift into 3rd. Rarely ever tow except for the off-road rig (i.e. hobby), and lucky to get out once every couple of months so hard to justify spending any more money.

Empty MPG is 13-15 MPG, corrected for the larger tires. With the little stock street tires it averaged 1-2 MPG better. My dad had an '02 2500HD ECSB with 4.10's that he bought new and it got the same mileage.

Towing the above mentioned load I get 8-9 MPG.

Really happy with the truck and never once thought "man, I should have spent another $8k to get the Duramax". There are times when I wish I would have considered an 8.1 truck but from the people I know they did get a few MPG less unloaded.

 

[454Sub]

A supercharged 6.0 would be great. My dad runs a Whipple on his 5.3 with headers, tuner, 3.73s and 33.12.50s and it pulls a trailer like nobodies business. But me personally, "IF" you get better mileage out of a 6.0 vs an 8.1, assuming droven correctly, I would take the 8.1 , it just has muscle for days, and doesnt need RPM to tow. Now if you tossed some money into the 6.0 its going to tear that 8.1 up all day and knock down more mileage doing it. The LS series motors are real deal, my brother skipped a BB and went straight to a 6.0 in his Suburban, and I went the old school way with a roller cam 454 with TBI. His has RPM where mine doesnt, but I can outpull him every single time pulling anything we hook too. Im a fan of the LS, but Im a bigger fan of the BB.

The 8.1 is capable of decent fuel mileage if drove by someone who has some sense, like I said, I have seen 16 to almost 17 in my friends, as his is an 03 with a nice cold air intake, and tuned for premium fuel. Now he cant manage to get 12 on a good day going downhill with a tow truck pulling him . The thing runs great, the Allison is indestructible under "normal" conditions, and with the 4.10s it keeps up with a few slightly built Cummins and likewise Duramaxs all day on our way to Missouri pulling my almost 7000lb Suburban. The diesels do get better fuel mileage, but thats the trade off.

 

[76zimmer]

Gus I ran my 99 6.0 towing to Moab and back with the Maiden...figure a good 10000 towing pounds plus whatever the ext cab 4wd version weighs..I have 3.73's in the 14BSF axle, used the tow/haul mode and never used OD, so 1:1 final drive numbers here, and shift points were close to 4000. The average for the 3600 mi trip was 7.5, a best of 9 on the flats, and about 6 in CO from Rifle up to I-90 which is no easy task. I was down to 20mph at one time when I had to stop and start up a long hill and couldn't get the load moving before I hit it...But it did it, and that was the only time it really struggled, I caught Kert going bout 80 when I was trying to take a nap in the back!

 

[MTChevy]

I like how my. 6.0 tows for a 6.0.... 8mpg through the mountains

 

[Larry]

I wouldn’t even mess with a 6.0L for a tow rig. Not so sure I would mess with a 6.0L, or any LS engine, for that matter for use in any 4x4 project. While 6.0L engines are rock solid durable and make awesome HP they don’t make any torque or HP until you spin the piss out of them. Not sure about you guys, but prefer high torque/low RPM engines.

I bought a 2001 2500HD ECSB 4x4 with an 8.1L and 6 speed manual brand new and still have it (she only has 55K miles). A few years ago I also bought a used plain-Jane WT 2005 2500HD SCLB 4x4 with a 6.0L and 4L80E slush box that was in shambles but I got it for a steal of a deal. I bought it for the purpose of fixing and flipping, which I did and made decent money on it. For the 2 years I had the 6.0L Silvy I was always impressed with how athletic it felt running around town. Both trucks have 4:10 gears. From stoplight to stoplight the 6.0L/Automatic would whipazz on the 8.1L/6 speed but in town fuel economy was no different between the 6.0L vs. the 8.1L. I am of the opinion the 8.1L is slower around town partly due to the horrible shifting ZF S6-650 6 speed manual and the fact he 8.1L is extremely neutered in stock form in the way of torque management and tight emissions calibrations. Much more neutered than a small block.

One you hook up a trailer behind either of these trucks would really separate the straw from the manure. The 8.1L comes alive and doesn’t care what is being pulled behind it while the 6.0L felt extremely labored, slow and even gobbled much more fuel than the 8.1L. Not saying the 8.1L will outperform a Duramax or Cummins in a tow test but for a gas, it is the only gas engine worth owning for towing or large 4x4 rigs. The longest towing job for the 6.0L was towing a ’98 Jeep Grand Cherokee down from Denver on a heavy car trailer. A week later I made the same tow job with the same trailer but pulled a ’01 Dodge ECSB 4x4 with a Cummins (dead lift pump that ate the injection pump). The 8.1L truck had a heavier load to pull and still out pulled the 6.0L and drank less fuel while doing so.

My feeling is the 6.0L is a high RPM HP engine and the 8.1L is a torque engine. The 8.1L is already cranking out over 100 lb. ft. of torque at idle with a stock torque certification of 450 lb ft @ 3200 RPM while the typical 6.0L makes around 350 lb ft of torque at 4400 RPM. That said, the 6.0L has to work its ass off to build any torque. Torque gets the job done, not HP.

All of the above comments were based on a stock 8.1L with stock calibrations. I also have a stock 8.1L with tweaked calibrations in my K10 along with a bump in fuel pressure and it runs entirely different than the 8.1L in the Silverado. The Silverado 8.1L pulls well but the tweaked calibrated 8.1L is an outright animal. It is amazing what a difference a tuned ECM can make in the performance of a stock engine. The K10 even gets pretty good fuel economy for what it is… The last big trip we racked up 1,555 miles over 8 days roaming around Utah and Colorado, highways, dirt roads, desert running, climbing mountains, etc. The truck averaged 11.72 MPG over the 1,555 trip. Not bad for weighing over 8,000 lbs., 35” tires, 4:56 gears and the aerodynamics of a Drive-in Movie Theater screen.

If looking to swap something in, the 8.1L is the one to look for as it is a much easier swap than a 6.0L. The 8.1L is a direct bolt from any old big block or small block. Same mounts and any old BB exhaust manifold or header will bolt right up to an 8.1L whereas a 6.0L people play hell finding manifold/headers that fit old truck correctly. The 8.1L also runs on the easier to tune and procure P59 ECM (0411) whereas the later LS engines are running E38 and E78’s that are more complicated. Then there is the A/C to deal with. The 8.1L has other bracket alternatives from RV’s and commercial trucks in order to move the A/C compressor up high and out of the way so you don’t have to hack up the frame to make room for the compressor. The only advantage I see of a LS engine is the huge array of aftermarket support. Personally, I don’t care about aftermarket support because I like to leave engines (hard parts, not calibrations) in stock form for durability and reliability for the long distance runs I subject this truck too.


Pewter truck is the 8.1L while the white one had the 6.0L

 

[dhcomp]

You are quite the salesman for the 8.1.

If i did no research, you'd have me sold for my burb.

Thanks for the post.

 

[Larry]

You are quite the salesman for the 8.1.

If i did no research, you'd have me sold for my burb.

Thanks for the post.

Hehe, I have lots of experience with 4.8, 6.0 and 8.1L engines as the company I work for (spun off division of GM) has built hundreds of thousands of RV chassis with 8.1L engines as well as tens of thousands of UPS trucks with 4.8 and 6.0L engines along with a few thousand 8.1Ls. Yes, there are big brown trucks rolling around the country with 8.1L's! All are great rock solid reliable engines but the 8.1L always rises to the top when the need arises for diesel-like toque without the BS of owing a diesel. It is a hoss of a gas engine and durable as an anvil. Our average RV chassis once bodied come in around 22 to 26,000 lbs. That is a big coach for an 8.1L to move around and it does it well. Research the RV articles and see how well the 8.1L beats the Ford V10 right into the ground. Problem with a lot of RVer is they don’t understand torque vs HP either and fall for the marketing BS where the V10 has a higher HP rating over the 8.1L. That is true, the V10 does have more HP ONCE YOU SPIN the POS to 6,000 RPM but the 8.1L has more usable HP and more importantly torque.

As we all know, the 8.1L went out of production in 2010. However, there is a company that is working on an agreement with GM to sell the 8.1L to other manufacturers fur use in RV’s, well pumps, industrial generators etc. It is the same exact engine but it has been hogged out to an 8.8L engine now. The company is called Power Solutions. The funny thing is they are a GO Green company. Funny how gas engines are now considered GREEN over diesels.

 

[dhcomp]

Hehe, I have lots of experience with 4.8, 6.0 and 8.1L engines

So when can i fly you out to put an 8.1 in my burb?

 

[black dawg]

Hehe, I have lots of experience with 4.8, 6.0 and 8.1L engines as the company I work for (spun off division of GM) has built hundreds of thousands of RV chassis with 8.1L engines as well as tens of thousands of UPS trucks with 4.8 and 6.0L engines along with a few thousand 8.1Ls. Yes, there are big brown trucks rolling around the country with 8.1L's! All are great rock solid reliable engines but the 8.1L always rises to the top when the need arises for diesel-like toque without the BS of owing a diesel. It is a hoss of a gas engine and durable as an anvil. Our average RV chassis once bodied come in around 22 to 26,000 lbs. That is a big coach for an 8.1L to move around and it does it well. Research the RV articles and see how well the 8.1L beats the Ford V10 right into the ground. Problem with a lot of RVer is they don’t understand torque vs HP either and fall for the marketing BS where the V10 has a higher HP rating over the 8.1L. That is true, the V10 does have more HP ONCE YOU SPIN the POS to 6,000 RPM but the 8.1L has more usable HP and more importantly torque.

As we all know, the 8.1L went out of production in 2010. However, there is a company that is working on an agreement with GM to sell the 8.1L to other manufacturers fur use in RV’s, well pumps, industrial generators etc. It is the same exact engine but it has been hogged out to an 8.8L engine now. The company is called Power Solutions. The funny thing is they are a GO Green company. Funny how gas engines are now considered GREEN over diesels.

It seems funny that they would even compare the v10 to the 8.1, the v10 is a little over 400 inches.

 

[Larry]

So when can i fly you out to put an 8.1 in my burb?

Ah, negative. Be glad to help give guidance from here though. I have been quite used and abused helping internet so called “friends” do 8.1L swaps over the past few years in everything from Corvettes to ugly truggies. Some guys are appreciative and others are flat out users then claim the knowledge came from them. I have figured out some of these guys are users and have stopped supporting them. If any of them are reading this and wonder why the emails and PM’s have stopped… A simple thank you and give credit where due would be appreciated, if that is too much to ask then they can elsewhere to get help. I should write a book and start charging for L18 swap info.

 

[Stomis]

You will be way happier with an 8.1 for a gasser. That being said the biggest downside to the 6.0 is really the 6L80e itself and the horrible shift tune they come with stock, which Im told can be fixed with a programmer.

 

[blazinzuk]

But its not going to be his main tow rig just an occasional tower.

So I think the 6.0 with a tune a good exhaust and and an intake would be just fine.

I towed Horton with a 6.0 once mostly flats and not long enough to get a mileage figure but it felt just fine. Felt more powerful than most stock big blocks.

So for the occasional tower I think he you would be fine with the 6.0