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6.2 wont prime

k20

k20

3/4 ton status
Joined
Sep 9, 2001
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Location
Mineral Springs, NC
Alright, been making steady progress on the cucv, so went to fire it up today. Lets preface this by saying I have removed the mech lift pump, added an electric, moved the fuel tank into the bed (to protect from rocks/etc) and removed the square filter base and added a spin on.

Wired up the electric pump, it runs, filled the spin on filter, and fuel is passing through the filter housing and getting to the IP. Getting 12v to the pink wire on the IP, can hear the solenoid clicking etc. Crack loose the lines and nothing.....nada.....zip......This engine has run so I dont think the IP is dead, but what now? I disconnected the return line at the IP and I get fuel out of the IP that would be being returned to the tank, thinking maybe the return was plugged, but that made no difference. What am I missing? Ive tried taking the lines completely off the injectors, half a turn loose, 2 or 3 turns loose, all of them, some of them. It doesnt make a difference, still nothing out of em.
 
Is the pink wire plugged in? I think you're still going to need to turn the engine over to get fuel to the injectors, even with an electric lift pump. The IP is a rotary pump, so it needs to rotate to send fuel to each injector in turns.

Crack all the lines loose at the injectors ( finger loose is fine) and turn the engine over while someone watches for lines starting to drip. As they drip, tighten them up.

I usually do this with all my GP's removed to alleviate cranking pressure and prevent it from starting with some lines not tight. Once I have 6 or more lines tight I just tighten the remaining one or two up, re-install the GP's and fire it up. I generally smooths out in a few seconds.

Rene
 
Yeh maybe I should remove the GP's. My batts were getting weak (2 new group 31's), but I mean damn, I cranked forever and got nothing. I am starting to get worried that something is wrong in the IP. Like said though, it ran before (and ran pretty good), now, cant even get fuel. Wish there was a way to 'vacuum' fuel through to the injectors.....If I could get atleast one to starting shooting fuel everywhere it would atleast make me feel better about the IP.
 
Could you use a Mightyvac on the return line nipple at the injector pump to suck the air out?..(or maybe a vacuum line hooked to a running gas engine)..I never tried it,but I'd think that might work..

I got my '82 K2500 running when I first bought it by using a fuel can right to the fuel filter inlet ,with an electric pump "pushing" it to the lift pump..I cranked it till the batteries started getting low,tried again afer recharging them,and it almost fired up...I got impatient and waited a half hour and used starting fluid on it without activating the glow plugs--once it fired up once it started on its own fine..I hate using ether ,but sometimes thats all that works ..I couldn't loosen my injector lines,they were too rusted and I knew they would break!..
 
Dont have time to work on it during the week (by the time get home its getting dark) but fridays I get off at noon, so I'll pull the gp's, that should let it spin that much faster and that much easier on the batts. If I cant get it to prime then....I dont know. I did remove the top cover on the IP (like I did before when I replaced the fuel shutoff solenoid), thinking that maybe it has some trash/algae/something in it, but it was just slam full of fuel. Its almost just like it isnt pushing it out. Could I try to remove the lines at the back of the pump (I think I could get to 3 or 4 of em, would that tell me anything?
 
You've checked that you have 12 volts at the pink wire when the key is 'on'?

Rene
 
Yeh, Ive even run a jumper wire to that terminal straight from the batt to make sure Im not losing 12v when I switch to crank position instead of run.
 
can you bypass the fuel solenoid? I can't picture a 6.2 exactly. but can you manually activate the solenoid IE pull it up by hand fully, then wire it full up. just because you have 12v there and it clicks....... doesn't neccissarily mean it's actually doing what its supposed to./

if you have fuel flow to and through the IP, and sufficient crank speed. but zero fuel at the injector lines. and zero smoke at the tailpipe, either the IP is ****ed, or the fuel solenoid isn't working. not much else going on there.


being realistic, its probably not the pump. as you said its ran not that long ago. look long and hard at the solenoid and linkage.
 
Might be worth swapping another IP in, if you have another? I have a few spares here, not sure on your timeframe though.

Rene
 
Yeh dont have another sitting here, Im gonna screw with it tomorrow after work and saturday, if no luck.........CUMMINS TIME.....not really........then I'll be hunting a pump (or giving ya a call) and believe me, I have no timeframe lmao.
 
Alrighty, played with it some this aftn. What I learned.....nothing........Ok ok, heres the deal, pulled off the return line going back to the tank (read that a restriction in the line can make it a pain to bleed. Anyway, while cranking and after I get nothing more than a drip at the return line (dont know if thats worth mentioning). It just sits there making a steady drip at about 1.5second intervals.

Pulled out the glowplugs and cranked and cranked and cranked, and cooled the starter, and cranked and cranked....well....you get the idea. Still no fuel. By this time the batts are getting low, I got the charger on it and I am pissed. Hook my vacuum brake bleeder to cyl #1 injector line (taken loose from the injector).

Have the gf crank the engine over while I hold vacuum on the line, getting nothing, nothing, then all of the sudden I start getting kind of a golden colored fuel coming out of the line and Im like SWEET, well, in my excitedness I dont maintain the vacuum on the line, and when I remove the vacuum line the fuel stream disappears back up the line. So I fill the bleeder up with fuel so that when I do it again it will suck diesel fuel back into the line instead of air. Do it again, and nothing, never get fuel again.....

So basically the afternoon was wasted and I got nowhere. Checked the bleed screw at the fuel filter again, zero air there, pulled the top off the IP again looking at the solenoid, verified that it is functioning properly....anybody got any ideas?
 
Here is a crazy idea. Pop the oil filler tube off and look through the grommet hole. Have someone turn the engine over while you look. You should see three bolts through that hole, each in turn as the engine turns over.

i'm thinking it's not bolted to the timing gear, so it's not rotating, so it's not pumping fuel.

Just re-read that it has run. When? Maybe pull the top cover off the IP and verify that it is rotating when someone hits the key.

Rene
 
it ran.....year and a half, 2 years ago...got a little sidetracked. But anyway, was reading on a ford forum (IIRC it was a 6.9 forum) anyway, that you need a good stream out of the return 'nipple' on the cover. Like said, when Im turning it over, or just have the electric pump running I get nothing or maybe just a little dribble. Im starting to wonder if I have my electric pump mounted too far to the rear OR I am running to large of a fuel filter and that is causing me to have insufficient pressure.....
 
Ok, so I been out there this morning messing with it. The pump is spinning (pulled out the oil filler tube), so thats working for me. I hooked up my vac bleeder to the return nipple on top of the pump. Pulled vacuum and am getting a ton of air & a little fuel out. Then I started getting more fuel (I have the key on & lift pump running) and then it was just straight fuel so I got excited :woot:. Then all of the sudden the fuel ended and now its just straight air.....wtf......pump is still running.
 
alright, well, I pulled the IP off to check the inlet screen (well, I pulled the screen with it on the truck, then other pieces, the blades, and some springs fell out sooooo off it came). Anyway the screen was about 50% plugged with some nasty looking crap. While it was off, I spun the drive gear on it and its making a clicking noise (may be supposed to do that).

Anyway, then I turned it up, and poured some fuel in the inlet, spun it, poured in more, spun it until it wouldnt take anymore. Everytime I would spin it it would suck it down a little and then when I stopped it would rise back flush to the top. Well I did that about a half dozen revolutions and then it started SHOOTING fuel back out the inlet....Im talking like 6" above the inlet. It did that a bit and then sucked more in for a few spins then shot it out......I dont know at this point. I forgot I do have another IP but its on a complete 6.2 that was rebuilt, blah blah blah. Dont want to swap that motor in yet. So Im going to check into some shops in this area, see if they will test mine first, see if its ok, if not then have them rebuild it.

I was talking to my buddy who helped me get it running the first go round and he remembered just before it got too blasted cold to work on it (and then progress halted for a time and it sat) that it got to where it was really hard to start and one running it would idle low and kind of miss......I dont remember it missing, but do remember that it was hard to start, but I figured the lift pump was on its way out, and the fuel lines didnt look the greatest so figured it had an air leak or two.

So anyway, at the conclusion of this long post, the IP is in the garage, and gonna be calling some diesel shops this week.
 
Didnt see the 6.2 IP's listed on their site, what should I be looking at price wise for a good 6.2 IP rebuild? Like if I carried my IP in, am I looking at $300 or $800 or does it depend on what is wrong with mine?

Next question, with what I described, does it sound like mine might have an issue?

Last, is there anything I can or should ask for to increase power on this thing? It aint turbo'd or anything, never will be, but, we all know they are slow and can use all the help they can get.
 
What type of electrical lift pump are you running? GPH? PSI?

When I went electrical with mine, I left the mechanical pump on there as well so the electric would just act as a booster for it.

Anyway, it sounds as if something is plugged in your IP honestly. My first guess, having seen this on the IH 6.9 about 10 years ago, is growth from the diesel. It'll be interesting to hear what it really was though.

As far as power goes, get her some more air from a decent cold air intake setup with a high flow filter, then port match your intake manifold (throw a J code on if you can find one) and then turn up your IP a bit and you should be cooking with a bit more fire.
 
k20 said:
Didnt see the 6.2 IP's listed on their site, what should I be looking at price wise for a good 6.2 IP rebuild? Like if I carried my IP in, am I looking at $300 or $800 or does it depend on what is wrong with mine?

Next question, with what I described, does it sound like mine might have an issue?

Last, is there anything I can or should ask for to increase power on this thing? It aint turbo'd or anything, never will be, but, we all know they are slow and can use all the help they can get.
Click to expand...

With 8 injectors and a rebuilt IP I recall paying about $325...this was 7 years ago. I'd say under $400 for a rebuilt IP is the top of the range, should still be able to find em for the $300 range. You might try phoning Tim at Accurate diesel and see if he still offers 6.2 pump rebuilds. I see they're no longer listed...but that probably just means demand has fallen off a lot in the last few years as less and less of these remain in service.

Agree on the intake port match. Stock casting is not so great really.

Rene
 
I guess to add a bit to my previous post, I really DISLIKE the stock air cleaner setup. Especially the ones that had the "mufflers" to kill the 6.2 diesel chatter. The first thing I did with mine, was take the lid, and drill some holes on it facing forward. It instantly made a difference in both my right foot dyno, and the fact I knew it was working by less black smoke out the back. This though, isn't great in the summer because you suck in the hot air from your engine bay.

There aren't any good "cold air kits" out there from what I've seen, so I found a carb to intake tube adapter on Jegs, plugged the hole in the center, and made the two other ones to tie it down tight, and then used the DIY kits and filter to get some cool air into the engine. Next on the list is a snorkel kit though :)
 
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