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A modern day K5?

Stomis said:
By no means would I say k5s are more solid than defenders. They're also way smaller. Similar in size to an fj70 tray back.
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That's interesting.. I didn't know that. I would like to hear more bout the Defenders if you have knowledge of them - which models you have driven in and stuff.
 
ZombieBlazer said:
I bet there are guys around who could figure out how to make a rock solid vehicle for far less than that that would be bullet proof and ridiculously durable and smooth driving. This is why we need to pool our brain power and put together all the best elements and figure out how to solve these issues properly IMO.
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No offense, but this message forum has about a 15-year headstart on your idea....

You may have just found this site, but we've been talking about stuff like this forever. :waytogo:

The problem IMHO, is that the vast majority of guys are seduced into taking their builds right past "durable and smooth riding" and into the realm of the mythical "ultimate wheeler".... (whatever THAT means) :haha:

During a build, there are many times when you need to choose to take the truck either more radical (and less practical) or more reliable (and less offroad capable). Most guys here will choose the former category... A simple example is tires. A great "practical" choice would be a 35" radial tire. It provides good ground clearance for offroading and will still drive nice and quiet down the road and will balance properly and not shake you to death..... Problem is, nobody here buys 35" radial tires!! :haha:

I blame the internet... and this dysfunctional group of CK5 members. :D. There are SO many guys here doing builds and doing fun-looking stuff that it's easy to get "upgrade fever"... If 35s would be good, then 37s must be even better.....and 42s are even better than that! The same thing applies for softer leafsprings..... 52s must not be as good as 56s....and 63s must be the best of all?! :dunno:

The problem (if you want to call it that) is that a well-rounded, capable and reliable truck isn't very "sexy" or "radical looking" so most guys don't make that their goal when they start building.

You want an "off the top of my head" build sheet for a comfortable, reliable K5 for less than $30K? Here it is...

'69 - '91 K5 - Get the cleanest and most rust-free one you can find.
LS motor swap - Very common now, inexpensive and practical
Automatic transmission / NP241-type t-case - deep offroad gearing for cheap.
35" - 37" radial tires - Thats the max if you want a true dual-purpose truck
Custom leafsprings - not too long/soft, maybe 350 - 450lb/in rate to get necessary lift and softer ride
Good shocks - high quality shocks (and I don't mean Rancho!) are a must.
14 bolt rear axle with ARB - Selectable lockers give the best street manners
D44 front with selectable locker - You don't need a D60 in this tire size
4.56s or 4.88s - Good ratios for the larger tires without losing all highway capability
Rocksliders - Protect the body
Skidplates - Protect the underbelly
Rollcage - Protect the occupants
High-clearance bumpers - allows for the winch mount if you want one.
Quiet exhaust - don't throw a set of 40-series Flowmasters on a truck that needs to cruise on the highway.
Dynamat - Lots. Kill as much interior noise as possible
Rhinoliner / Line-X - same idea.
A/C - Working air conditioning (and heat) do nothing to improve performance but make driving a lot more pleasant


Those are the basics. Like I said, it's not a "secret formula"...most guys don't gravitate to this type of mild and practical setup.

-G
 
I'd settle for "rust free" and be tempted to leave it mostly stock...:rolleyes:..

I dont think I've ever seen a completely "rust free" K5 or GM pickup...
I didn't go into many showrooms when they were new,I wish I had..just so I'd know what they were supposed to look like!..

Almost every truck I have bought needed floors and cab corners,rockers and door bottoms patched up before they would pass inspection..:(..the few I found that didn't I foolishly left exposed to the salt and weather and didn't spray them with oil soon enough to keep them from rotting..:doah:
 
I think part of making the reliable wheeler is to be honest about how much money you are going to dump into it, then have a plan. For example, I wish I had just dropped a modern motor/trans combo into my K5 from the git-go instead of over the past 15 years hacking at the 305 with Jacobs ****, intakes exhaust, carbs, then putting a 383 that eventually blew, then a 350, then a new carb, etc etc, finally ending up with a one-off TBI setup and still dreaming about port injection or something else. I would have saved money if I had admitted what was coming and just paid up front...

This doesn't apply to my K5, but my 1008 and Scout projects: admit that it's going to be an expensive project and pay up front for a rust free non-butchered starting platform. I don't think it's ever cheaper to start from a butchered rust bucket.

But I digress. Are K5's made to cruise smoothly at 85 mph on 35" tires with a 4" lift? Maybe. Maybe part of what has disenchanted me is my 1965 Scout project where I rebuilt everything to better than new condition only to realize that even if you pulled one from a time capsule it would not be up to snuff to drive with modern drivers on the road today. And even people who can remember new cars with carbs forget that instant starts and driving away with no warm up is a fairly modern thing.

Just blabbing here...
 
ZombieBlazer said:
That's interesting.. I didn't know that. I would like to hear more bout the Defenders if you have knowledge of them - which models you have driven in and stuff.
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Ive never had one personally. A friend of a friend is a big rover guy and I was looking into buying one when I was between rigs. They're really different ends of the spectrum. Ones a full size, wide as all hell, toting everything about american 4wd and the other is a foreign, small, and purpose built to be offroaded. And not just like O it goes offroad good, it was designed for it.
 
Greg72 said:
No offense, but this message forum has about a 15-year headstart on your idea....

You may have just found this site, but we've been talking about stuff like this forever. :waytogo:
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I hear you! I mentioned in the OP that I figured this had been gone over lots before but I went for it anyway. :D

The problem IMHO, is that the vast majority of guys are seduced into taking their builds right past "durable and smooth riding" and into the realm of the mythical "ultimate wheeler".... (whatever THAT means) :haha:
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This was why I was thinking it might be cool to do a few different types of K5s... and then people could modify those basic designs even more if they wanted to.

So like one design for all around use... that is close to stock but refined yet still tough. One designed for safari type excursions, one for rock climbing or something like that...
 
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Stomis said:
Ive never had one personally. A friend of a friend is a big rover guy and I was looking into buying one when I was between rigs. They're really different ends of the spectrum. Ones a full size, wide as all hell, toting everything about american 4wd and the other is a foreign, small, and purpose built to be offroaded. And not just like O it goes offroad good, it was designed for it.
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Thanks man! I wish there were more of them in the US.. they are sweet.
 
diesel4me said:
I'd settle for "rust free" and be tempted to leave it mostly stock...:rolleyes:..

I dont think I've ever seen a completely "rust free" K5 or GM pickup...
I didn't go into many showrooms when they were new,I wish I had..just so I'd know what they were supposed to look like!..

Almost every truck I have bought needed floors and cab corners,rockers and door bottoms patched up before they would pass inspection..:(..the few I found that didn't I foolishly left exposed to the salt and weather and didn't spray them with oil soon enough to keep them from rotting..:doah:
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Mine is from super southern California where it is super dry.. and I haven't examined it real close yet but it is pretty close to rust free... but the paint is crap...

I am considering doing a total frame up restoration as best I can do myself but I haven't figured out how feasible that is. I won't be doing totally stock colors I don't think but it will have a old school looks so maybe we can get our dreams here. I want to see it pristine too! :D
 
^^^While reading this thread, I kept thinking about the "Icon" FJ and how someone could do a K5 version. The first time I saw one a few years ago, I actually did the math and figured that if the $90k Icon could last 30 years (which it should), it would probably be the last vehicle I ever buy - and probably cheaper overall. I figure if I purchase a new truck/SUV every 10 years, the average price for one is about $30k, then you add in tax, license & maintenance (3x over 30 years) and that's where it might make sense to get one....then I woke up from my dream and smelled reality. I can build a K5 for a quarter of that!

But those Icons sure are nice...

Speaking of Defenders (D90), I also started shopping around for one but they are awfully expensive with most models going for over $24k and will have over 100k miles. Parts can be expensive if they're Defender specific but most of the drive train crosses over with the Discovery. The best models to get are the pre-95 ones which are manual. You can only get an automatic with a '97 (no manual I think) and they never imported a '96 model. Never drove one but rode in a D110 (4 door - long wheelbase) diesel in the Philippines and that thing was unstoppable.
 
bubba blazer said:
^^^While reading this thread, I kept thinking about the "Icon" FJ and how someone could do a K5 version. The first time I saw one a few years ago, I actually did the math and figured that if the $90k Icon could last 30 years (which it should), it would probably be the last vehicle I ever buy - and probably cheaper overall. I figure if I purchase a new truck/SUV every 10 years, the average price for one is about $30k, then you add in tax, license & maintenance (3x over 30 years) and that's where it might make sense to get one....then I woke up from my dream and smelled reality. I can build a K5 for a quarter of that!
That is a really interesting way of looking at it! What is the insurance rate on a 100G vehicle though I wonder? And how quickly would it depreciate?

How does that work with a 30G vehicle we build ourselves as well?

But those Icons sure are nice...
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They are... it's unbelievable they actually make them.

Speaking of Defenders (D90), I also started shopping around for one but they are awfully expensive with most models going for over $24k and will have over 100k miles. Parts can be expensive if they're Defender specific but most of the drive train crosses over with the Discovery. The best models to get are the pre-95 ones which are manual. You can only get an automatic with a '97 (no manual I think) and they never imported a '96 model. Never drove one but rode in a D110 (4 door - long wheelbase) diesel in the Philippines and that thing was unstoppable.
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:D Sounds amazing! Great information! One thing I really love about the defender and the old Toyotas is how they have those flat fold down wind shields. Does anyone know if there is a kit vehicle body for the Blazers that has a fold down wind shield?
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ZombieBlazer said:
So much for the modern K5 dream.. look what they want for a modern Toyota Landcruiser... 100 Gs ! :confused:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DaHRHWPZHRs


http://coolmaterial.com/rides/icon-land-cruiser-fj-models/
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$100,000 is a steal...

I spoke to Jonathan Ward (owner of ICON) about doing an early Blazer. He was definitely interested in doing it, but the prices are typically in the $150,000 - $180,000 range.

You will be a lot better off once you realize that paying someone to build YOUR dream car is stupid-expensive. The ICON stuff is beautiful to look at, but is actually pretty "soft-core" in terms of the actual offroad parts that you get for that kind of money.

Stop waiting (forever) for a manufacturer to build what you want....because they never will. Chart your own course ,design what you always dreamed of....then start building it.

-G
 
Hi Greg. That's what I am planning to do as soon as I get the money. I just like to think of this kind of stuff for fun. I like trying to solve different kinds of problems as design challenges.

Right now I am also trying to figure out how to build my own Blazer camper... kind of a cross between the Chalets and this -

http://www.actioncamper.com/camper.php

I have lots of wild ideas though... sometimes it can be tough for me to reign them in. :) It's fun to dream I guess.

Also, one of the reasons I wanted others input is to see if my ideas were in line with others thinking or if I am on my own. If others think the same way, then maybe we could pool our resources and work together or others might be interested in buying things I design as well.
 
Sad fact is that many of us with families and full time jobs have almost no time to build something. I could afford to plunk down $30k for the Wrangler Rubicon, but the CUCV axles for my K5 have been sitting in the garage for months. I'm working on them when I can; the 14bff is painted and the outer ends all rebuilt, but who knows how long until this job is done.

And wives are more understanding about buying something shiny from a dealer than spending many thousands on rusty junk that results in the truck looking no different than it did when you started!
 
Maybe show her what else she could buy with the savings by doing it yourself?

It's too bad we are all spread out over the country. We need the equivalent of Amish barn raisings where we all work together to fix up each others vehicles. When you have to learn to do everything yourself it makes it tough and time consuming - and expensive for tools, too.
 
ZombieBlazer said:
It's too bad we are all spread out over the country. We need the equivalent of Amish barn raisings where we all work together to fix up each others vehicles. When you have to learn to do everything yourself it makes it tough and time consuming - and expensive for tools, too.
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CK5 is Amish....

15 years ago, nobody even knew how to do an 8-lug swap on a D44, let alone a D60 swap. The available knowledge for these trucks was extremely limited, and hard to find. CK5 became an amazing melting pot for ideas, photos and technical discussion. Over the course of a few years the amount of information that an average K5 enthusiast find has grown exponentially. Take a look at "The Driveway" (Build Thread section) if you haven't already....you could spend literally DAYS reading all of the tech there and you'd learn a TON.

Membership has its privileges. You're still new (and not a paid member ,yet) :wink1:, but you'll find over time that this group of guys is more than willing to help each other out on projects, especially when theres an event coming up and a looming deadline. Living in a big city like San Diego, it should be EASY for you to find local CK5 members to hang out with. :waytogo:

-G
 
Great points Greg. I need to change my location.. I just moved to Salem Oregon.. I am still not here mentally though. haha I didn't want to move but didn't have a choice at this time. Hopefully there are lots of Blazer owners around here. You would think there would be because this area is built for Blazers... I saw some great places to go exploring traveling through Oregon. Hopefully I will be able to make some money to start working on my Blazer soon.

Thanks for the thread tip.. this place is a little overwhelming being new. That sounds like a great place to get started. :)
 
Well if I had the money Jonathan Ward of ICON 4x4 when asked when they would do a Blazer said " Been wanting to build a K5. Bring it on!" in other words you have the money we will build it!
 
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