Anyone run hydrogen?

[dyeager535]

ok obviously there is some misunderstanding going on here. i'll see if i can slear this up.

electricity, water, stainless steel, potassium hrydroxide or sodium hydroxide and a containment device. no fossil fuels needed

So where does the electricity come from if not ultimately from fossil fuels? (Ignore the energy consumed in the production of the materials necessary to make the system "work" for now)

I believe that is where the misunderstanding is. As has been mentioned multiple times, you MUST use more energy to get the hydrogen, than you get from the hydrogen itself. Think about that...so you need more electrical input to get a lesser amount of hydrogen/power...why wouldn't you just use electricity as the source of power for propulsion? (IE, solar to an electric motor)

As an example, why are hybrids so popular, and hydrogen, electric, etc. not? If the conversion process was efficient, you'd have battery-laden cars using electricity to extract hydrogen from water to power the vehicle right now. And you might, but I guarantee their range is not near a hybrid.

 

[6.2Blazer]

production of hydrogen requirements

electricity, water, stainless steel, potassium hrydroxide or sodium hydroxide and a containment device. no fossil fuels needed

So where does this electricity come from? Unless you have a windmill in your backyard making electricity, and scooping water out of the creek with a bucket, you are using fossil fuels at some point in time.

I like the idea of extracting hydrogen from water and using it as a fuel, but the technology simply is not there yet to make it really feasible in everyday use.

The issue with being able to fill up a car with water and go is that it just takes a LOT of water, and thus the hydrogen extracted from it, to equal the same BTU (energy content) of a 20 gal. tank of gasoline.

The next step is having the water already converted to hydrogen at a fuel station and thus just filling the car with hydrogen to avoid the volume and weight issues of carrying enough water. But now you are talking about completely changing the infrastructure of the United States to support this. Do you know what type of water pumping stations and other electrical requirements would be needed to support large scale hydrogen production?

Hey, don't get me wrong. I would love to see hydrogen technology take off, and some day it might, but right now I'm not sure if this is the answer or not.

Back on the topics of "cars use to get XXX mpg years ago but now they don't". That is because of a combination of things, mainly that manufacturers were required to reduce the emissions levels of vehicles and increase the safety of them by the government, and the public demand was for more powerful vehicles with more "options".

It's like the old saying "cheap, quick, or good....pick any two you want but you can't have all three". It's really hard to make an engine option go from 150 to 300 HP to satisfy the consumer, meet the emissions requirements of the government, and have super-dooper gas mileage. The emissions part is a requirement, so pick either power or gas mileage...and that's just for the engine itself. Now place that in a car that is heavier because of all of the crumple zones, airbags, and electronic controls required for safety, and then add all of the high-zoot stereo, power 28-way adjustable seats, and leg massagers the average customer wants.

 

[Fabrimacator21]

I think they also failed scam 101. 2008? A bit behind. "Proven" technology can be rolled out almost instantly.

If you actually check out the Scorpion, you'll see that it's nothing more than a motor swap into a kit car.

"
Acura dual overhead cam, aluminum/magnesium block, 3.5 liter, V-tech, V-6, Type S Engine
289 Horsepower in stock form, 450 plus with the twin turbo option "

Lose a bunch of weight, and a motor has to work less, and gets better fuel efficiency.

I missed the "expecting to achieve 40+mpg" part.

Yes the car is lighter but it's almost doubled it's hp from stock form... therefore it'll suck ALOT more gas. NO WAY they are gonna gain 13 mpg from weight loss. Any gain from weight loss is gonna be cancelled out by the increase in hp. Sure turboed motors are more effecient but the more power you make, the more fuel you burn.

I do think it's impossible for this to work but just that no one has configured it right yet. You brought up a good point about the fact that you need to retune your motor to run both hho and gas. That requires a very precise calculation of how much hho you are producing and/or burning and remapping fuel curves.

Also, the main setup I have heard people telling me worked (customers, with nothing to gain from lying) was a plate setup. Haven't seen too many instructions or tests with that setup. Theres more then one way to make the stuff... most are bs and won't produce nearly enough hydrogen. The plate setup seems to be the best.

Heres an idea I've thought about for a while....

Hybrids are using brakes to recharge the batteries... why they don't kick the tranny into neutral and flip a switch that would cause some sort of turbine to kick in that would generate electricity which would slow the car down?

Judging from those little wind up flashlights you could get ALOT of power out of it.

 

[lectric80]

They don't truly use the brakes to generate electricity. The way it works is reversing the flow of electricity by turning the electric motor into a generator. There is a 'sweet spot' of sorts that is used in the brake system, when in that spot the motor generates electrical current to recharge the battery pack, beyond that spot the mechanical brakes kick in to slow the vehicle faster.

When the motor generates power it provides a braking force from the drag induced by the motor turning through the electrical fields, just like a generator seeing a large load has to increase RPM's, the generation of power slows the vehicle.

 

[Fabrimacator21]

ahh.... so basically they already are doing it?

 

[lectric80]

Pretty much, just with the elimination of putting it into neutral, since that would unlock the wheels from the motor.