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Battery disconnect 3/0

RootBreaker

RootBreaker

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Ok so I cant seem to find it.. but im looking for a battery disconnect for my batteries in my bed....

size of cable is 3/0
so I need a way to keep my 2 batteries still in parallel but be able to charge them... then connect the batteries up to use the winch...
 
Use a manual(turn style) or electric(Ford sarter relay etc...) in series with the cables before they enter your electrical system. To charge them, in theory, as I am still learning aobut the application of electronics in autombiles, a charge wire with a properly sized and oriented diode should fix it up. Hopefully an expert;cough Ryoken cough; can confirm or dispell my post.
 
yeah im waiting for ryoken to speak up...

anyhow.. i am waiting on my 200a relay isolator to come in.. and put my 140a alt in....

however my problem is this...
this pic is not complete.. but the batteries are already hooked up to an isolator.. that isnt the problem... getting the charge to the bats is good..

my problem is I cut a hole in the bed and ran the wires through... well if one was to get nicked from rocking back and forth.. and it is next to one of my 2 gas tanks... 2600ca + bare metal + frame = KABLEWIE!!!!!!!!!!!

so I would like to disconnect the one wire that runs to the winch but leave the 2 still in parallel to charge...

also still need it to be able to handle the 480a draw that the winch COULD put out so I need it to work with the current 3/0 wire....:crazy:

these batteries are huge... also the 3/0 cable wouldnt fit through the pvc I put in there.... so the cable just runs through a hole in the metal.....

this isnt a new pic.. gotta take a new one but gives you an idea how big the batteries are... the charge wire and ground are hooked up though in this pic......

dualbatts2.jpg


dual-batts.jpg
 
I guess I dont understand. Im talking about adding a disconnect right beside the batteries, before the bed of the truck. By the way, you should really use grommets there. Install disco in red circle. Or, am I not understanding you?

wmdualbatts2.jpg
 
ok, I'm a tad confused as to what you have here, and what you want to end up with.... let me see if I have this straight...

You have the 2 8D's in the bed, in parallel, with a single feed up to the isolator, tied into the single front bat, right?

and your winch feed also coming off that 8D pos post?

first off, there's NO excuse for potenential chafing.. go back and do it right with grommets....

as for seperating or "shutting off" the back bats or winch... theres lots of ways to do this.. you could just run a high amp bat switch on your winch line, or inline up to the isolator, with the dedicated charge with going back to the pos on the 8D...

You could also tie a marine switch into this system.. but I'm still not 100% what your trying to achieve here... well, actually, the easiest thing to do here would be to put a post bat shutdown, something like this,


battery-disconnect-topterm.jpg



then run a dedicated charge wire to the positive post on the OTHER battery of the 2 8 D's in parallel... taking those 2 batteries out of the system, yet charging them... you will be beating up the batteries and shortening there life tho... Ideally, you'd be running a load sensing relay like an ACR or similar system..... a marine switch and ACR are pretty much the simplest, bulletproof system...
 
Ryoken, a question out of ignorance. Why is it going to beat up the batteries? Is an alternator keeping charge on the batts harsher than say hooking up a float charger?
As always, appreciate the knowledge,
Kenny
 
The higher amp output of an alternator will have a tendency to cook the plates, let alone the electrolytes on a battery that isn't seeing a draw... It hurts the cyclelife of the battery and water levels (lead acid) need to be monitored much closer.... I see it in the boats with older chargers all the time... Ideally, batteries perform best with a voltage sensing charging system when not seeing draws...

Thats whats so nice about ACR tech, it only gives the battery what it wants...
 
marine switches are pretty common in the forum.. I've been running em for decades in all my rigs and rods... a 1,2 switch and ACR is the most flexible setup you can run....
 
Kenny78 said:
I guess I dont understand. Im talking about adding a disconnect right beside the batteries, before the bed of the truck. By the way, you should really use grommets there. Install disco in red circle. Or, am I not understanding you?
Click to expand...


ok lets start here...

that was a quick wire up to get the charging working..
the charge wire actually comes out the bottom of the bed and yes protected where it will not get chaffed....


bold to replies here...
ryoken said:
ok, I'm a tad confused as to what you have here, and what you want to end up with....

Im looking to see how to disconnect the rear batteries and still keep them charging


let me see if I have this straight...

You have the 2 8D's in the bed, in parallel, with a single feed up to the isolator, tied into the single front bat, right? 2 front bats in parallel too

and your winch feed also coming off that 8D pos post? yes the 2 bed batteries only feed the winch (currently)

first off, there's NO excuse for potenential chafing.. go back and do it right with grommets.... do they make 3/0 grommets? I was going to use pvc as you see in the pic.. but they are right over the gas tank and couldnt get the wire to bend that way.... so just cut a hole in the bed.

yes I do want to go back and do it right... I dont feel grommets are good enough as these cables are HUGE

as for seperating or "shutting off" the back bats or winch... theres lots of ways to do this.. you could just run a high amp bat switch on your winch line, or inline up to the isolator, with the dedicated charge with going back to the pos on the 8D...

You could also tie a marine switch into this system.. but I'm still not 100% what your trying to achieve here... well, actually, the easiest thing to do here would be to put a post bat shutdown, something like this,


battery-disconnect-topterm.jpg


will that switch handle 500ish amp draw? dont want to use it as in inline fuse... :)

then run a dedicated charge wire to the positive post on the OTHER battery of the 2 8 D's in parallel... taking those 2 batteries out of the system, yet charging them... you will be beating up the batteries and shortening there life tho... Ideally, you'd be running a load sensing relay like an ACR or similar system..... a marine switch and ACR are pretty much the simplest, bulletproof system...
Click to expand...

so marine switch ($120) plus a acr ($??) plus run a second charge wire to the other battery?

my current plans for the bed batteries are to use for the winch.... and maybe move my relays to feed from there for the offroad lights... either way the winch and lights are not used all that much ( if ever)
now I did a mspaint pic as that is all i had handy.... and vista wouldnt allow me to use the T (Text Tool) so I had to freehand the text..... laugh away...


I plan on replacing the 63a alt with a 140a alt. replacing the 90a isolator with a 200a isolator

all in all I want to charge all 4 batteries but have the ability to disconnect power to the rear batteries from the winch in case I need to.....

got it now?

batteries.jpg
 
there is another alternative...

cough cough,,,,ryoken.....

recommend a new wiring scheme...

1. under hood.. 2 batteries connected in parallel with 2gauge wire.
**** is that good enough?

2. battery isolator and alt going to be upgraded (isolator showed up and alt on its way)

3. winch wiring...
**** as per this page 460a max draw http://www.ramsey.com/winches/patriot15000.html
**** I went with 3/0 cable but can replace it all with something smaller if needed. I see on that page they say ==> 6 ft. (1.83 M) 2 gauge battery cables with connectors supplied.... so should I just go with a normal winch disconnect?
I could get 0 gauge wire and 1 of these... but will it hold?
http://www.tonnocover.com/productline/1473/252/1/bull_dog_winch_wiring.html


I also found this pdf wiring.. I know it is not a chebby.. :haha:
http://www.sleeoffroad.com/technical/images/dual_batteries.PDF




I just want to do this right on the wiring and git - r - dun
I dont care if I have to redo it so please dont hesitate to bash my setup and step me in the right direction....
 
As a general rule, adding ANY connector to wiring increases resistance and gives you the chance of corrosion or other connection problem.

This is only really an issue for crazy high-current stuff... but even on the 700-1000 watt power supplies for PC's, the high-end makers are real clear that they don't put quick-discos on the power supply case to the wiring harness, as it's just another failure point. The only plugs they use are the ones they have to, at the end of the harness.

Point being that, unless you expect to frequently remove the winch, hardwire the thing. You'll get a higher-capacity, more reliable connection, and futzing with the winch wiring is the LAST thing you want to deal with when you're stuck.

I forget how long your winch run is (is it in the bed or the back or something?) but I'm running 4AWG to my front one, maybe a four foot run or so, no issue.

Just my .02.

-- A
 
dremu said:
As a general rule, adding ANY connector to wiring increases resistance and gives you the chance of corrosion or other connection problem.

This is only really an issue for crazy high-current stuff... but even on the 700-1000 watt power supplies for PC's, the high-end makers are real clear that they don't put quick-discos on the power supply case to the wiring harness, as it's just another failure point. The only plugs they use are the ones they have to, at the end of the harness.

Point being that, unless you expect to frequently remove the winch, hardwire the thing. You'll get a higher-capacity, more reliable connection, and futzing with the winch wiring is the LAST thing you want to deal with when you're stuck.

I forget how long your winch run is (is it in the bed or the back or something?) but I'm running 4AWG to my front one, maybe a four foot run or so, no issue.

Just my .02.

-- A
Click to expand...


my run is only from back of bed to front of bed... 8' bed... so id say 10' considering under bed and up....

I mainly want the disconnect in case something happened...but if I protect the cable going through the bed then I wouldnt need to worry about it..... but was thinking if I disconnected the winch at the batteries and spooled the cable up, I could have easy access if needed.... I dont plan on using the winch much.. :wink1:


also I think I found an issue.... I bought a 200a relay...but I am finding out that the relay kicks on when the key is on... so if you are stuck in the mud and truck running you will drain all batteries..... also that means they are not isolated at all on charging.... to which I am not sure if different sized batteries are a good idea with a relay then!!!!!!!

maybe I need to get an isolater then???????????
 
RootBreaker said:
my run is only from back of bed to front of bed... 8' bed... so id say 10' considering under bed and up....

I mainly want the disconnect in case something happened...but if I protect the cable going through the bed then I wouldnt need to worry about it..... but was thinking if I disconnected the winch at the batteries and spooled the cable up, I could have easy access if needed.... I dont plan on using the winch much.. :wink1:


also I think I found an issue.... I bought a 200a relay...but I am finding out that the relay kicks on when the key is on... so if you are stuck in the mud and truck running you will drain all batteries..... also that means they are not isolated at all on charging.... to which I am not sure if different sized batteries are a good idea with a relay then!!!!!!!

maybe I need to get an isolater then???????????
Click to expand...


Well, yeah, the relay idea is to disconnect your aux batteries from the primary circuit (i.e. alternator and starting batteries) when the engine is off, i.e. the key is off. If the key is on, we assume this means the engine is running, i.e. the alternator is putting out juice, so you connect all the batteries up and let the alternator charge them.

Those batteries that are less charged, i.e. have a lower voltage drop across them, will absorb more current from the alternator, so they'll work themselves out that way.

The fancier isolators (i.e. solid state) add another level, i.e. that ONLY alternator charge current gets routed to the drained batteries and they can't cross-feed. With the relay, IF THE KEY IS ON, then all batteries are running all loads, so the winch would actually be running off all four, not just the auxiliaries. With a diode-type isolator, the winch only runs off the auxiliaries (and the alternator, if it's running) and cannot drain the main bank.

I don't see an issue with having two kinds of batteries paralleled. On my K5 I have a single starting battery of one type, and two auxiliaries paralleled (they're matching, but different than the starting battery.)

HTH.

-- A
 
dremu said:
. With the relay, IF THE KEY IS ON, then all batteries are running all loads, so the winch would actually be running off all four, not just the auxiliaries. HTH.

-- A
Click to expand...


so then the winch will use the 2 paralleled batteries in the bed and then try and suck juice through the 10 gauge charge wire that goes back to the stinger relay???? that dont sound good!!!!!
 
Want to revisit..

since I am going to rewire my truck.. this nightmare also needs to be redone...


so I know I confused alot of people... but I think I have it narrowed down on what I want..

I currently have

63A alternator to 90A isolator
Isolator A to Front Batteries in parallel
Isolator B to Rear Batteries in Parallel (10g charge wire)
Winch to rear batteries (3/0g wire)

however the concerns I had were a few...
1. if the wires through the bed (not so expertly done by me) were to short.. lets say KABOOM as it is next to the gas tanks.


so I am also upgrading my alternator to 140A pontiac trans sport so this means I need to replace my isolator

I am going to work backwards on this one.. see if you can follow...

winch (3/0) to marine switch for on/off (manual) then to batteries
there is my disconnect I want... plus I will route the cables correctly as they are not now....

140A alt to 200A relay operated by switch for power to relay
1/0g cable from relay post B to rear batteries for charge - that is good
1/0g cable from relay post A to starter solenoid to charge front batteries - good

I was told that if I use a toggle switch of on-off-on I could then take power from under hood or rear batts to start the truck if I needed to self jump the truck... ok I understand that and that is good....

This setup will work great for what i want...

I will post back in a month or 2 when I get it done... :haha:
 
sweetk30 said:
http://www.delcity.net/delcity/servlet/catalog?parentid=791776&page=1

well I am not sure but my winch is rated at 460A draw max... so can a 275A continuous, 455A intermittent switch do???

nice price though

http://www.delcity.net/delcity/servlet/catalog?parentid=789172&page=1
Ahhh Rated at 600A continuous, 1000A intermittent but with a high price... :crazy:


http://www.delcity.net/ for the rest of your needs.
Click to expand...

I was looking at this one....
http://www.gpsandmarineworld.com/st...h-Single-Circuit-ON-OFF-with-AFD-343p1915.htm

can be had for $65 shipped... and 600A continuous
 
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