beags86
Eastbound and Down
So much for a fat block Nova.
CK5
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Building a 500hp 454
- Thread starter mrk5
- Start date
beags86
Eastbound and Down
I hadn't really pushed the idea too far in my mind. Money no object sure, but I'm pretty sure I'll only have room for one fat block in my stable and it's going in the Blazer. To do the Nova right would require a major snowball rolling downhill of changes to accommodate that I really don't have the time or the funds to commit right now or in the near future. It will stay small block as it don't need much to make quicker and I've already got the parts to do most of it.
Damnit the HP bug has got me. I want to get any one of the hot rods I like and build the other vortec 454 for a hot rod toy. But funds say sit down and shut up lol! 
I Really want another El Camino. So I get my hot rod and still have a truck 
. And yes, I am the rare red neck fan of 4x4 Camino’s...IF done right 
I Really want another El Camino. So I get my hot rod and still have a truck . And yes, I am the rare red neck fan of 4x4 Camino’s...IF done right 
At some point that may be useful. I'm just long range planning right now. I had kinda been thinking about starting on this in the coming winter. Right now I still gotta get moved into a new house in less than 2 months.
I don't have any experience with the Mark VI motors, is the aftermarket selection as good for those as it is for a Mark IV? The 1 pc rear main would be a sweet upgrade but not if there's a smaller selection of performance parts or they're more expensive. Something to consider if you shop for a build-able core.
beags86
Eastbound and Down
Yes, I was thinking 1pc rear main is definitely a plus.
From this...
To this...
Choooooo Choooooo Chug Chug Chug Chug...running down the tracks.
To this...
Choooooo Choooooo Chug Chug Chug Chug...running down the tracks.
Scott, I went through all of this myself a few years ago....sure you can build a 600ft lb BBC to tow with, but still only get 5-7 pulling HEAVY loads with it. My 76 CCDRW 454/T400/4.10's got 5.5 pulling 11K on mostly flat terrain. It did it fine, but it costs quickly.
I did a cost analysis on Cummins power vs BBC's and different trans/od/gears etc. Check out my thread if you'd like, it might be a game changer. I was stone cold against a diesel, but a 12valve is easy to work on, super easy to modify, and durable as hell.
https://ck5.com/forums/threads/76-ccdrw-cummins-noises.289528/page-33
I did a cost analysis on Cummins power vs BBC's and different trans/od/gears etc. Check out my thread if you'd like, it might be a game changer. I was stone cold against a diesel, but a 12valve is easy to work on, super easy to modify, and durable as hell.
https://ck5.com/forums/threads/76-ccdrw-cummins-noises.289528/page-33
454s are cheap these days. If you have powerboats around (easy to find in Michigan) then there are usually cheap 454s to be had that already have nice parts in them. See them fairly often complete ready to run with aftermarket fuel injection in the $2000 range. $3500 if they have aftermarket heads and are already full roller.
I'd probably still go L9H, L92, L94, or L86. Can be had for less and easily hit 500hp.
I'd probably still go L9H, L92, L94, or L86. Can be had for less and easily hit 500hp.
Scott, what are you using this for? I thought it was going in your toy? Or are you mostly towing with it?
For a toy a big block is awesome, a 500 hp big block will have 100 lb-ft more torque than a 500 hp small block or LS motor, torque you can feel even at part throttle. It will feel like significantly more than a 500 hp smaller engine, they may be built to the same peak power but they definitely don't have the same power curve. My big block puts a smile on my face every time I drive it. Cruise it around and it feels torquey, tromp the throttle and she sings to ~6K and feels and sounds great. I've built and driven small blocks, LS engines, big blocks, many stroked engines, anything from a mild 350 up to a 1000 hp 632 BBC with nitrous, and I always say a big block has it's own feel to it.
However, if you are going to do mostly towing, a diesel or newer gas DI motor will be more efficient. For example, my friends 2016 Silverado 2500HD Duramax got the same fuel mileage towing a 8,500 lb 28 ft enclosed trailer as my 2016 Sierra 1500 L86 (6.2L DI gas) towing a 10,000 lb 32 ft enclosed trailer(it has the NHT package so rated to tow 11,700). Both trailers had the extra height for offroad vehicles. Total weight was probably similar since the HD truck is heavier than mine, both trucks got 9.5 MPG for fuel mileage towing on 70 MPH freeways. The DI on gas definitely improves efficiency since they have 12:1 compression and the modern engines have more efficient combustion chambers. You won't get that with a big block towing 10k.
But the big block still feels like more fun for a toy to me. Someday I want to build a mild twin turbo 540 for my truck and sell the 489. Whatever you build, it becomes the new normal and you always want more.
I always love to help spec engines when the times comes you are ready...
For a toy a big block is awesome, a 500 hp big block will have 100 lb-ft more torque than a 500 hp small block or LS motor, torque you can feel even at part throttle. It will feel like significantly more than a 500 hp smaller engine, they may be built to the same peak power but they definitely don't have the same power curve. My big block puts a smile on my face every time I drive it. Cruise it around and it feels torquey, tromp the throttle and she sings to ~6K and feels and sounds great. I've built and driven small blocks, LS engines, big blocks, many stroked engines, anything from a mild 350 up to a 1000 hp 632 BBC with nitrous, and I always say a big block has it's own feel to it.
However, if you are going to do mostly towing, a diesel or newer gas DI motor will be more efficient. For example, my friends 2016 Silverado 2500HD Duramax got the same fuel mileage towing a 8,500 lb 28 ft enclosed trailer as my 2016 Sierra 1500 L86 (6.2L DI gas) towing a 10,000 lb 32 ft enclosed trailer(it has the NHT package so rated to tow 11,700). Both trailers had the extra height for offroad vehicles. Total weight was probably similar since the HD truck is heavier than mine, both trucks got 9.5 MPG for fuel mileage towing on 70 MPH freeways. The DI on gas definitely improves efficiency since they have 12:1 compression and the modern engines have more efficient combustion chambers. You won't get that with a big block towing 10k.
But the big block still feels like more fun for a toy to me. Someday I want to build a mild twin turbo 540 for my truck and sell the 489. Whatever you build, it becomes the new normal and you always want more.
I always love to help spec engines when the times comes you are ready...
I got 8.5 mpg's towing in the pic below with my 8.1
But I get at what you're trying to portray here.
This would go in Scott's crew cab which he uses for not only wheeling, but towing too. I don't think he tows crazy heavy with it, I'm pretty sure he tows his hardside up to the mountains with it, so looking at towing mileage I don't think is the main concern, I could be wrong though
Paxton or some other bolt on belt driven supercharger would be my first cheap addition.......
I would say it's probably 60/40 trail driving to towing. Considering I only put about 3,000 miles a year on the truck, it's not a ton of miles doing either one.
As much as we'd like to do more, we probably only get in 3 camping trips a year which involves towing a 4000lbs camper. I figure with the truck, family, gear, and camper, we've got a GVW of nearly 14K. As @Kay86K5 mentioned, camping generally involves driving over mountain passes. The stock 454 does great pulling just the truck up and over the passes, it's really adding the camper and etc that makes it hard. It can do it, it's just slow and pushes the motor to the limits. My thought process is that if it had more power, these pulls wouldn't be so hard on it. Plus we really want to get the AC added so that would be another load on the motor.
The other factor is just the fun of having a "high" HP motor which I've never owned before.
I mentioned earlier in the thread (I think) the biggest thing I dislike about the crew cab is showing up to trail runs with a big 4 door pickup with only me in cab. I sometimes think I would like to get a side by side that I would haul to the trails with my crew cab. That would be for the fun weekend get away stuff, but I would still have the crew cab for doing trails with other CK5ers.
To sum it up, the crew cab is our mountain get away vehicle.
A cummins swap worries me because I have no idea about working on diesel trucks. My buddy is doing a cummins swap in his GMT400 and it's not striking me as a simple swap. He also had to go to some pretty big measures to find a good donor motor. He remarked that people around here want a lot of money for their cummins trucks. I think if I really decided I needed to go diesel, I would look at an early Dmax and do an SAS swap and it would replace the crew cab.
As much as we'd like to do more, we probably only get in 3 camping trips a year which involves towing a 4000lbs camper. I figure with the truck, family, gear, and camper, we've got a GVW of nearly 14K. As @Kay86K5 mentioned, camping generally involves driving over mountain passes. The stock 454 does great pulling just the truck up and over the passes, it's really adding the camper and etc that makes it hard. It can do it, it's just slow and pushes the motor to the limits. My thought process is that if it had more power, these pulls wouldn't be so hard on it. Plus we really want to get the AC added so that would be another load on the motor.
The other factor is just the fun of having a "high" HP motor which I've never owned before.
I mentioned earlier in the thread (I think) the biggest thing I dislike about the crew cab is showing up to trail runs with a big 4 door pickup with only me in cab. I sometimes think I would like to get a side by side that I would haul to the trails with my crew cab. That would be for the fun weekend get away stuff, but I would still have the crew cab for doing trails with other CK5ers.
To sum it up, the crew cab is our mountain get away vehicle.
A cummins swap worries me because I have no idea about working on diesel trucks. My buddy is doing a cummins swap in his GMT400 and it's not striking me as a simple swap. He also had to go to some pretty big measures to find a good donor motor. He remarked that people around here want a lot of money for their cummins trucks. I think if I really decided I needed to go diesel, I would look at an early Dmax and do an SAS swap and it would replace the crew cab.
I haven't seen any of those I felt fall in the cheap category. I was also wondering how it works to do a belt driven supercharger with all the other accessories, especially AC.
I just took the dog for a walk and I was thinking about this. I think if I'm honest with myself, I probably have a $3000 spending limit to hop up a 454.
If it were me, a good set of aluminum heads and a cam that fits your needs, then just make sure your EFI system is setup properly for the motor changes and run it. Sure it may not be the 500hp/600tq that this thread was originally talking about, but would be an improvement over what you already have and would fit the bill.
To be honest with you, after reading this thread over the last few days, I've thought about what I want to do on not only my TBI350 in my blazer, but also the TBI454 in my suburban....decisions, decisions
To be honest with you, after reading this thread over the last few days, I've thought about what I want to do on not only my TBI350 in my blazer, but also the TBI454 in my suburban....decisions, decisions
And if I'm being completely honest, I'm really considering doing a Whipple supercharger on the TBI 454 in my SAS'd suburban, and just running it. it's a bit more money, but slapping on that kind of power increases over a weekend is highly desirable
And I'll probably just do a simple build on my TBI 350 in my blazer with cam/heads
TBI would work with a Whipple?
I started down this road when I was looking at what to do with the TBI350 that was in the crew cab. At first it was just going to be vortec heads and a cam.....
I started down this road when I was looking at what to do with the TBI350 that was in the crew cab. At first it was just going to be vortec heads and a cam.....
