odoa3
1/2 ton status
So, trying to figure out if I can build a D44 strong enough to negate the need of putting in a D60. Anyone on here gone this route? Cost wise is this worth it? Will it stand up to the abuse that a D60 would? Any advise?
CK5
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Building a D44- instead of a D60-opinions and experience needed
- Thread starter odoa3
- Start date
BowtieBlazer
Diesel Powered
I've thought about it many of times when its all said and done this "super 44" will be a little stronger than a stock 60 "maybe" think torque transfer, the 60 has a much better mesh (R&P). Axle shafts can be built super strong either way but what good are they without R&P. anyway so "super 44" costs? I bet almost equal or more than a stock 60 at a premium $1200
just how I think about it
just how I think about it
rhuarc31
Registered Member
You sure can make the axles as strong as a 60, The carrier then becomes you're weak point. I'm running a 44 with the moser axles and ctm u-joints and have no problems (after breaking 2 stock axles). This is with 44's, 4.10 gears, and a healthy but not insane 350. Hell some company is doing 35 spline 44's now, but I'm sure that's very pricey.
FRIZZLEFRY
1/2 ton status
I ran a built Dana 44 for a few years.It started out stock and I built it up over time as I could aford it.When I pulled it it had an ARB and Warn shafts.The last straw with it for me was breaking inner and outer Warn shafts,upper and lower ball joints,and the ARB one trip and broke all that same stuff again the next trip out ruining the inner C on the axle (didnt break the ARB though)
Cost wise is it worth it mess with your 44?If you already have it in your truck,yes.Cuz building it as you go lets you wheel while youre saving up,less down time is good.I would have missed out on alot of wheeling if I had waited to save up the $3500+ to get my Dana 60 put together.
You will not get a built 44 to be as strong as a 60.Not in a fullsize truck.But not everyone "needs" a 60 /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
What type of wheeling do you do?Tire size?
Cost wise is it worth it mess with your 44?If you already have it in your truck,yes.Cuz building it as you go lets you wheel while youre saving up,less down time is good.I would have missed out on alot of wheeling if I had waited to save up the $3500+ to get my Dana 60 put together.
You will not get a built 44 to be as strong as a 60.Not in a fullsize truck.But not everyone "needs" a 60 /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
What type of wheeling do you do?Tire size?
FRIZZLEFRY
1/2 ton status
[ QUOTE ]
This is with 44's, 4.10 gears, and a healthy but not insane 350
[/ QUOTE ]
What kind of wheeling do you do?Is your front end open?
I ran rothing but mud for prooly 6 or 7 years with an open diffed 10 dolt and never broke anything.Mud is very forgiving.I didnt start breaking stuff every couple feet til I locked up the front /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif I do pretty much rocks only now and I am easy on the gas.
This is with 44's, 4.10 gears, and a healthy but not insane 350
[/ QUOTE ]
What kind of wheeling do you do?Is your front end open?
I ran rothing but mud for prooly 6 or 7 years with an open diffed 10 dolt and never broke anything.Mud is very forgiving.I didnt start breaking stuff every couple feet til I locked up the front /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif I do pretty much rocks only now and I am easy on the gas.
84_Chevy_K10
Banned
It depends on your intended use and tire size.
Although it's the popular opinion here, a D60 is not for everyone.
Although it's the popular opinion here, a D60 is not for everyone.
I would like to know your....
1. Engine size and HP/TQ
2. Weight of the vehicle
3. Tire size and what tire it is.
Not everyone needs a D60, a stock 10B or D44 can handle a lot of abuse when not in extremely tough conditions. I have never broke anything in my front 3/4 10B with 35x16 boggers and a fairly healthy 406 SBC. I don't do rocks though.
1. Engine size and HP/TQ
2. Weight of the vehicle
3. Tire size and what tire it is.
Not everyone needs a D60, a stock 10B or D44 can handle a lot of abuse when not in extremely tough conditions. I have never broke anything in my front 3/4 10B with 35x16 boggers and a fairly healthy 406 SBC. I don't do rocks though.
four_by_ken
1/2 ton status
Like others are saying... its a person by person thing.
No way I could get by with a 44. But, others easily do.
Like they asked... what tires, vehicle, type og wheeling, engine, etc?
No way I could get by with a 44. But, others easily do.
Like they asked... what tires, vehicle, type og wheeling, engine, etc?
Hossbaby50
3/4 ton status
It is all dependent. Tire size, terrain, motor HP, crawl ratio, driving style, etc.
Alot of AZ guys run D44's an 10 bolt fronts on 35" tires with little problems. It is about a man knowing his trucks limits. TheRobZilla has been running on his D44 front for years now. He has broken things (axleshafts mainly). He finally broke his first ring an pinion and locker last weekend. He had Chromo axles and CTM joints in the frontend and was bound up very hard. He was in reverse in 4:1 low in the Doubler and was not able to spin any tires even with a healthy TPI 350 motor. He didn't get on it really hard because he knew he was to badly bound up to be able to get out. He did end up putting enough power threw the frontend though that it broke the R&P and locker though. (Yukon gears and Detroit EZ locker, so not the top of the line parts) He ran those non-top of the line parts in the frontend of many years before they finally fatigued enough and gave out. You can look at the main page as Rob is the Blazer of the month and see he is not easy on his stuff. That picture of him with 10 feet of air under the front tires is AFTER he had already broken the frontend R&P and locker.
Harley
Alot of AZ guys run D44's an 10 bolt fronts on 35" tires with little problems. It is about a man knowing his trucks limits. TheRobZilla has been running on his D44 front for years now. He has broken things (axleshafts mainly). He finally broke his first ring an pinion and locker last weekend. He had Chromo axles and CTM joints in the frontend and was bound up very hard. He was in reverse in 4:1 low in the Doubler and was not able to spin any tires even with a healthy TPI 350 motor. He didn't get on it really hard because he knew he was to badly bound up to be able to get out. He did end up putting enough power threw the frontend though that it broke the R&P and locker though. (Yukon gears and Detroit EZ locker, so not the top of the line parts) He ran those non-top of the line parts in the frontend of many years before they finally fatigued enough and gave out. You can look at the main page as Rob is the Blazer of the month and see he is not easy on his stuff. That picture of him with 10 feet of air under the front tires is AFTER he had already broken the frontend R&P and locker.
Harley
84_Chevy_K10
Banned
[ QUOTE ]
chromos and CTMs alone puts you into d60 $
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah but everything is more expensive for a D60, except crossover.
chromos and CTMs alone puts you into d60 $
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah but everything is more expensive for a D60, except crossover.
four_by_ken
1/2 ton status
[ QUOTE ]
Yeah but everything is more expensive for a D60, except crossover.
[/ QUOTE ]
But, you get a lot more for your money.
And when you pay all the money and get a 44 set up to be as strong as a 60... then where do you go? No where. There is nothingn left to do to it.
With a 60... about the same price... you are just beginning. Tons more strength to get from a 60.
Yeah but everything is more expensive for a D60, except crossover.
[/ QUOTE ]
But, you get a lot more for your money.
And when you pay all the money and get a 44 set up to be as strong as a 60... then where do you go? No where. There is nothingn left to do to it.
With a 60... about the same price... you are just beginning. Tons more strength to get from a 60.
I found the 60 to be cheaper then the 44
less maintainance
I was cooking 44 brakes a bit, I have never even worn a set of 60 pads out
for me with low hp I have had zero issues with the 60s
well, excluding death wobble fun, but with the info online it isnt a serious issue now.
the problem I see is where to go when a 60 isnt enough
less maintainance
I was cooking 44 brakes a bit, I have never even worn a set of 60 pads out
for me with low hp I have had zero issues with the 60s
well, excluding death wobble fun, but with the info online it isnt a serious issue now.
the problem I see is where to go when a 60 isnt enough
TrcksR4ME
1/2 ton status
The one thing no one has really mentioned is weight and clearance. If you don't need the strength of a built Dana 60 then why have something that hangs lower and weighs more?
But my opinion is that if you drive hard, that with 37"+ tires you might as well invest in a Dana 60. You can make a Dana 44 survive, but its a matter of "when" not "if" it will fail.
But I have a 44, ran it a few years now without breaking anything at all. I have been pretty hard on it from time to time, but in general don't get to crazy with it.
But my opinion is that if you drive hard, that with 37"+ tires you might as well invest in a Dana 60. You can make a Dana 44 survive, but its a matter of "when" not "if" it will fail.
But I have a 44, ran it a few years now without breaking anything at all. I have been pretty hard on it from time to time, but in general don't get to crazy with it.
four_by_ken
1/2 ton status
[ QUOTE ]
The one thing no one has really mentioned is weight and clearance. If you don't need the strength of a built Dana 60 then why have something that hangs lower and weighs more?
[/ QUOTE ]
I think this is the reason that we were asking what he intentions were with the axle. To see if he needs it and if its worth it.
The one thing no one has really mentioned is weight and clearance. If you don't need the strength of a built Dana 60 then why have something that hangs lower and weighs more?
[/ QUOTE ]
I think this is the reason that we were asking what he intentions were with the axle. To see if he needs it and if its worth it.
Hossbaby50
3/4 ton status
In some cases it can make more sense though. In Rob's case he already had the money invested in lockers and gears in his 1/2 ton stuff. He broke axles in them so he bought Chromo stuff since he already had part of the money invested in the D44. He didn't drop all the money at once.
I agree that if you have stock axles and are going to invest money in Chromo's, lockers, gears, ujoints, etc then just spend the money on the D60.
The Chromo's and CTM's may cost as much as a D60 but most likely the D60 is not going to be ready to run. You will still need locker, crossover, mayber gears, install or said lockers and gears, rims, possibly brakes, bearings, etc.
My buddy Matt (az-k5) bought his D60 with the right gears in it and got it from a running truck but for $1200 is was still not bolt in ready to wheel. He had to invest in the locker, crossover steering, brakes, etc. So $1200 just turned into $2000. That is if you don't get a Detroit that you have to have someone install. Then the price is up to $2400 and you still have 30 spline stubs and hubs. You still have to invest money in spare axles, and if you have a neckdown inner D60 new inners to get rid of the neck down.
To get a D60 set up well is likely going to cost you in the neighborhood of $2500-3000 or more, plus then you have to add in the money the 14bff is going to cost you to get setup too. That could put you back another $750-1000 easy. So your talking about $3000-4000 for 1 tons total when all Rob reinvested in his half ton's is maybe $1500 at the outside including the rear chromoly axles along with the front cfromo's and CTM's. Sure he broke a R&P and locker now but getting 10 years out of a set of Yukon D44 gears and an EZ locker is more then you can really expect. Even with new gears and a new locker you are still way below a D60-14bff install. Plus with those you will have to go to bigger tires to make up for the lost ground clearence. Thats another $1200+ in tires and rims.
For some the D60 just doesn't make sense. Then once all the $$$ stuff is in place you will have to learn to drive your truck all over again because your setup is totally different now.
Harley
I agree that if you have stock axles and are going to invest money in Chromo's, lockers, gears, ujoints, etc then just spend the money on the D60.
The Chromo's and CTM's may cost as much as a D60 but most likely the D60 is not going to be ready to run. You will still need locker, crossover, mayber gears, install or said lockers and gears, rims, possibly brakes, bearings, etc.
My buddy Matt (az-k5) bought his D60 with the right gears in it and got it from a running truck but for $1200 is was still not bolt in ready to wheel. He had to invest in the locker, crossover steering, brakes, etc. So $1200 just turned into $2000. That is if you don't get a Detroit that you have to have someone install. Then the price is up to $2400 and you still have 30 spline stubs and hubs. You still have to invest money in spare axles, and if you have a neckdown inner D60 new inners to get rid of the neck down.
To get a D60 set up well is likely going to cost you in the neighborhood of $2500-3000 or more, plus then you have to add in the money the 14bff is going to cost you to get setup too. That could put you back another $750-1000 easy. So your talking about $3000-4000 for 1 tons total when all Rob reinvested in his half ton's is maybe $1500 at the outside including the rear chromoly axles along with the front cfromo's and CTM's. Sure he broke a R&P and locker now but getting 10 years out of a set of Yukon D44 gears and an EZ locker is more then you can really expect. Even with new gears and a new locker you are still way below a D60-14bff install. Plus with those you will have to go to bigger tires to make up for the lost ground clearence. Thats another $1200+ in tires and rims.
For some the D60 just doesn't make sense. Then once all the $$$ stuff is in place you will have to learn to drive your truck all over again because your setup is totally different now.
Harley
four_by_ken
1/2 ton status
[ QUOTE ]
In some cases it can make more sense though. In Rob's case he already had the money invested in lockers and gears in his 1/2 ton stuff. He broke axles in them so he bought Chromo stuff since he already had part of the money invested in the D44. He didn't drop all the money at once.
I agree that if you have stock axles and are going to invest money in Chromo's, lockers, gears, ujoints, etc then just spend the money on the D60.
The Chromo's and CTM's may cost as much as a D60 but most likely the D60 is not going to be ready to run. You will still need locker, crossover, mayber gears, install or said lockers and gears, rims, possibly brakes, bearings, etc.
My buddy Matt (az-k5) bought his D60 with the right gears in it and got it from a running truck but for $1200 is was still not bolt in ready to wheel. He had to invest in the locker, crossover steering, brakes, etc. So $1200 just turned into $2000. That is if you don't get a Detroit that you have to have someone install. Then the price is up to $2400 and you still have 30 spline stubs and hubs. You still have to invest money in spare axles, and if you have a neckdown inner D60 new inners to get rid of the neck down.
To get a D60 set up well is likely going to cost you in the neighborhood of $2500-3000 or more, plus then you have to add in the money the 14bff is going to cost you to get setup too. That could put you back another $750-1000 easy. So your talking about $3000-4000 for 1 tons total when all Rob reinvested in his half ton's is maybe $1500 at the outside including the rear chromoly axles along with the front cfromo's and CTM's. Sure he broke a R&P and locker now but getting 10 years out of a set of Yukon D44 gears and an EZ locker is more then you can really expect. Even with new gears and a new locker you are still way below a D60-14bff install. Plus with those you will have to go to bigger tires to make up for the lost ground clearence. Thats another $1200+ in tires and rims.
For some the D60 just doesn't make sense. Then once all the $$$ stuff is in place you will have to learn to drive your truck all over again because your setup is totally different now.
Harley
[/ QUOTE ]
I spent no where near that for my 60!
In some cases it can make more sense though. In Rob's case he already had the money invested in lockers and gears in his 1/2 ton stuff. He broke axles in them so he bought Chromo stuff since he already had part of the money invested in the D44. He didn't drop all the money at once.
I agree that if you have stock axles and are going to invest money in Chromo's, lockers, gears, ujoints, etc then just spend the money on the D60.
The Chromo's and CTM's may cost as much as a D60 but most likely the D60 is not going to be ready to run. You will still need locker, crossover, mayber gears, install or said lockers and gears, rims, possibly brakes, bearings, etc.
My buddy Matt (az-k5) bought his D60 with the right gears in it and got it from a running truck but for $1200 is was still not bolt in ready to wheel. He had to invest in the locker, crossover steering, brakes, etc. So $1200 just turned into $2000. That is if you don't get a Detroit that you have to have someone install. Then the price is up to $2400 and you still have 30 spline stubs and hubs. You still have to invest money in spare axles, and if you have a neckdown inner D60 new inners to get rid of the neck down.
To get a D60 set up well is likely going to cost you in the neighborhood of $2500-3000 or more, plus then you have to add in the money the 14bff is going to cost you to get setup too. That could put you back another $750-1000 easy. So your talking about $3000-4000 for 1 tons total when all Rob reinvested in his half ton's is maybe $1500 at the outside including the rear chromoly axles along with the front cfromo's and CTM's. Sure he broke a R&P and locker now but getting 10 years out of a set of Yukon D44 gears and an EZ locker is more then you can really expect. Even with new gears and a new locker you are still way below a D60-14bff install. Plus with those you will have to go to bigger tires to make up for the lost ground clearence. Thats another $1200+ in tires and rims.
For some the D60 just doesn't make sense. Then once all the $$$ stuff is in place you will have to learn to drive your truck all over again because your setup is totally different now.
Harley
[/ QUOTE ]
I spent no where near that for my 60!
Hossbaby50
3/4 ton status
Well then your one of the lucky ones. $1000-1500 is the base price for D60's here in Phoenix.
Harley
Harley
four_by_ken
1/2 ton status
Plus the other stuff you mentioned too.
Just be a litltle on the.... 'thrifty' side and you can save a lot of money and get a 60 for a better price.
Just be a litltle on the.... 'thrifty' side and you can save a lot of money and get a 60 for a better price.
Hossbaby50
3/4 ton status
You can save some money in certain places. But alot of the expense is still right there. You still have to pay for the axle, locker, and crossover. That on the low side here is going to cost you $1750 roughly. This is if you are lucky enough to find a D60 that has good brakes, good bearings, good kingpins, good seals, and good locking hubs. That is a big if. You still need a trail spare axle joint, stub shaft, and locking hub. This is a bear minimum.
This leaves you with stock 30 spline stubs, stock locking hubs, stock possibly neck down inner axles, and a lockright locker. That is not much stronger if any stronger then a D44 with Chromo's. I have seen 38's break D60 30 spline stubs and 37's break D60 axlejoints. So your D60 on the low side has gained you 2-3" of tire that the D60's size itself has taken away in ground clearence. The D60 is going to take a beating longer before it breaks stuff but as long as i keep my 10 bolt maintained it is do everything a D60 would for me.
Harley
This leaves you with stock 30 spline stubs, stock locking hubs, stock possibly neck down inner axles, and a lockright locker. That is not much stronger if any stronger then a D44 with Chromo's. I have seen 38's break D60 30 spline stubs and 37's break D60 axlejoints. So your D60 on the low side has gained you 2-3" of tire that the D60's size itself has taken away in ground clearence. The D60 is going to take a beating longer before it breaks stuff but as long as i keep my 10 bolt maintained it is do everything a D60 would for me.
Harley
