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Calling out to 6.2 Diesel gurus, need help

I have seen people do this a couple times now. If you just set the cover straight down and bolt it down, it pushes the gov linkage towards full fuel, if not full fuel depending on how the shut off solenoid arm is bent. Cover must be installed forward (front of truck and slid towards back of truck) And pushed back. It is easy to install, as long as you do it this way. Like said, when power is put to the shut off solenoid, it moves out of the way of the gov linkage so the metering valve can rotote to a position that will deliver fuel. When power is taken away the spring in the shut off solenoid pull its lever back, forcing the gov linkage and the metering valve closed
 
Again thanks to all for the schooling on the inner workings on the 6.2 pump. I'm very confident the parts swapping probably didn't go back together correctly and that's why it's running on. Why his rebuilder did not see it just tells me they didn't look under the cover. It's the only reason it's still doing it after they looked at it.

It's time to put an end to the bleeding and step up to by a good pump. If he's swapped the parts twice and done it wrong both times the chances of getting it right on the third try are pretty slim.
 
make him pull it out .

and YOU try installing the cover .

could save him a lot of money and make you a hero !

but what do i know i dont play with 6.2 diesel engines.
 
sweetk30 said:
make him pull it out .

and YOU try installing the cover .

could save him a lot of money and make you a hero !

but what do i know i dont play with 6.2 diesel engines.
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Great idea but outside of what I've gained here, I've only worked on a couple of these things. Never took a pump apart. I think pump rebuild he had done is suspect on the idea that the rebuilder never pulled the cover when he sent it back knowing full well the exact reason it was getting sent back for. Dude took his money twice and left him hanging. I talked to him tonight and he's going Stanadyne this time around. He's going to give it one more shot.
 
sweetk30 said:
make him pull it out .

and YOU try installing the cover .

could save him a lot of money and make you a hero !

but what do i know i dont play with 6.2 diesel engines.
Click to expand...

Opening up the injection pump to mess with the governor is a very, very, very bad idea if someone doesn't know what they are doing. Most governors only have to move about 1/8" to go from idle to max fuel flow, and it's just as easy to cause a true runaway engine where it will spin far above what the governor is set for. Most actual runaways last for less than 1 minute before the connecting rods/other internals decide they need to be outside of the engine block.


This video is on a dyno and you can hear when the runaway started
 
Sounds like you have this pretty much covered. I will just throw out another suggestion for a IP rebuild shop. Badger Diesel. They are located in southern Wisconsin.

Back when I had my M1009 and i was active on the Steel Soldiers message board, a lot of the CUCV guys were recommending this place. They could even send out a rebuilt IP while you shipped them yours, if you were in a rush. Then credit you some $$ once yours arrived at their shop
 
red EOD said:
Opening up the injection pump to mess with the governor is a very, very, very bad idea if someone doesn't know what they are doing. Most governors only have to move about 1/8" to go from idle to max fuel flow, and it's just as easy to cause a true runaway engine where it will spin far above what the governor is set for. Most actual runaways last for less than 1 minute before the connecting rods/other internals decide they need to be outside of the engine block.


This video is on a dyno and you can hear when the runaway started
Click to expand...
I am by far the LAST person you want cracking open an injection pump. No doubt about it.

I've not had the pleasure of seeing a runaway in person, but I did get told a funny story of one from one of my former techs. This guy is old enough to be around back in the days when the Oldsmobile 350 diesel was new. He was pretty fresh at an Olds dealer in the bay area and got the task of working on one of those gems. As he described it to me the engine was running, the speed ramped up and going higher. He shut the key off, no change. He even cut the fuel line and it just kept running. Stuffing rags into the intake to cut off the air sucked them through and spit them out the tailpipe. That's when a old-timer walked over with a 1/2" chunk of plate steel and slapped it on the intake and choked off the air. He got it before it blew up. The discovery was that the 350 had a way to start sucking oil into the intake and would allow it to run with the fuel supply cut off completely. They normally ran until they ran out of oil or spun/seized bearings from the loss of lubrication.
 
ZooMad75 said:
I am by far the LAST person you want cracking open an injection pump. No doubt about it.

I've not had the pleasure of seeing a runaway in person, but I did get told a funny story of one from one of my former techs. This guy is old enough to be around back in the days when the Oldsmobile 350 diesel was new. He was pretty fresh at an Olds dealer in the bay area and got the task of working on one of those gems. As he described it to me the engine was running, the speed ramped up and going higher. He shut the key off, no change. He even cut the fuel line and it just kept running. Stuffing rags into the intake to cut off the air sucked them through and spit them out the tailpipe. That's when a old-timer walked over with a 1/2" chunk of plate steel and slapped it on the intake and choked off the air. He got it before it blew up. The discovery was that the 350 had a way to start sucking oil into the intake and would allow it to run with the fuel supply cut off completely. They normally ran until they ran out of oil or spun/seized bearings from the loss of lubrication.
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That is a true runaway.
Oil is fuel to a diesel.
A gasoline engine would choke where a diesel engine just sees more fuel.. and that throttle is always wide open sucking air on a diesel.

Hey, why not just pull the three screws on the housing and check out the governor?
You can't do any harm at this point.
Here is what it looks like inside.

1541737062699167343021.jpg

1541737152730815557496.jpg
Took photos of my mini 14 which happened to be obscured by my copy of The Diesel Page 6.2 L Diesel Engine Inproving Performance & Economy.
 
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To be honest, besides not knowing enough of what I'm looking at I don't want to be married to it. I like the guy but if I opened it up and it still didn't work right I'd be stuck with it. Two guys that don't know what they are doing don't equal one that does by the way I look at it.
 
ZooMad75 said:
To be honest, besides not knowing enough of what I'm looking at I don't want to be married to it. I like the guy but if I opened it up and it still didn't work right I'd be stuck with it. Two guys that don't know what they are doing don't equal one that does by the way I look at it.
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Almost like working on a someones car.
You fix the brakes, and any unrelated problem is your fault.
I get it.
Well, you did (are doing) your best to help.
Good on you.
 
K5wrench said:
Almost like working on a someones car.
You fix the brakes, and any unrelated problem is your fault.
I get it.
Well, you did (are doing) your best to help.
Good on you.
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Trust me I get enough of that crap at work. Brings in car for a key recall, now the engine runs like crap and it's all our fault. Keep in mind it's a 15 year old POS with every warning light on the dash lit up, but they only want done what's free. I can see them coming from a mile away. It's also why I take pics of the cars on the service drive because I've had people blame us for damage that was already there. So I'm pretty much defensive most of the time due to crap like that.

My personal favorite was the a-hole that came back a year after we replaced his keys under recall (just the keys, no other parts get touched) to bitch me out in front of his 10 year old girl demanding I replace his ignition lock because it wouldn't turn. Again, it was a rolling pile of crap and the recall was to address the keys allowing the lock cylinder to rotate from run to off while driving. Which is the exact opposite of the lock not turning in the first place. When I finally lost my cool over him swearing me out I threw his ass out. He continued to cuss me out and start taking personal shots at me. So he was told to leave (not so politely either) or the cops will be on the way.
 
I've only taken the cover off the injector pump once ,on my '85 Suburban,it refused to start after sitting a few months and I suspected the fuel shutoff solenoid wasn't opening fully..
I was very nervous ,not knowing what I was getting into--but the cover came off ok and I found the "bowl" was rather dirty at the bottom and the fuel smelled stale,so I used carb cleaner to flush it clean,and worked the solenoid and its linkage by hand after that and it did seem to free up and move much easier..

I have an '87 6.2 for parts (busted crank) and I was going to swap the solenoid off that pump onto the one in the Burb,but it was a slightly different design,so I ended up leaving the Burb's pump alone..

When I put the cover back on it I was fearing it would run away when I got it to start,but evidently I did it right--it did race up a few times after it finally fired up,but I think it was just the carb cleaner or excess fuel being burnt off,after a few seconds of terror,it slowed down to a normal idle and seemed to be back to normal again..

I now do not feel very confident knowing a diesel can suddenly decide to run away wide open without much if any warning,if it develops a sudden oil control issue or fuel related issue..

It would be a very scary scenario in city traffic,and probably worse on a highway..and by the time you got out and tried getting the air cleaner off to smother it,you might have a few connecting rods stick in your head when it blows apart..
Another reason to not like a diesel..it might KILL ya!..:eek:
Granted its "rare",but not an impossibility on a high mileage engine.
Be nice if there was some kind of a choke plate on the intake,tha'ts cable operated you could pull closed if it did try to runaway..
 
diesel4me said:
I've only taken the cover off the injector pump once ,on my '85 Suburban,it refused to start after sitting a few months and I suspected the fuel shutoff solenoid wasn't opening fully..
I was very nervous ,not knowing what I was getting into--but the cover came off ok and I found the "bowl" was rather dirty at the bottom and the fuel smelled stale,so I used carb cleaner to flush it clean,and worked the solenoid and its linkage by hand after that and it did seem to free up and move much easier..

I have an '87 6.2 for parts (busted crank) and I was going to swap the solenoid off that pump onto the one in the Burb,but it was a slightly different design,so I ended up leaving the Burb's pump alone..

When I put the cover back on it I was fearing it would run away when I got it to start,but evidently I did it right--it did race up a few times after it finally fired up,but I think it was just the carb cleaner or excess fuel being burnt off,after a few seconds of terror,it slowed down to a normal idle and seemed to be back to normal again..

I now do not feel very confident knowing a diesel can suddenly decide to run away wide open without much if any warning,if it develops a sudden oil control issue or fuel related issue..

It would be a very scary scenario in city traffic,and probably worse on a highway..and by the time you got out and tried getting the air cleaner off to smother it,you might have a few connecting rods stick in your head when it blows apart..
Another reason to not like a diesel..it might KILL ya!..:eek:
Granted its "rare",but not an impossibility on a high mileage engine.
Be nice if there was some kind of a choke plate on the intake,tha'ts cable operated you could pull closed if it did try to runaway..
Click to expand...


Never heard of a diesel having a "sudden" run away in either mobile or stationary equipment while it's been operating. Even with the old 2 strokes which have made for the vast majority of runaways. Usually either a bad repair to the governor (which has been computer controlled for almost 20 years now) or a dumbass going really happy with a starting fluid. The 2 strokes were the most common because of how their fuel control rack is adjusted. Make it too tight and it could get stuck, which is again a bad repair.

There are companies that offer a butterfly shutoff valve on the air intake as an option on the older trucks. Newest one I've seen on a truck was a 1999 Peterbilt. See them on stationary equipment sometimes that are still using the older mechanically injected engines which are expected to sit for years at a time before getting restarted.

Will diesels run on oil? Yep absolutely. Can the oil seal leaking on the turbo cause a runaway? Only if there is no seal there because the old one is completely gone. Not leaking some, seal straight up gone. Usually a turbo will grenade from that long before presenting a possible runaway engine condition.
 
Hopefully not,but I've seen a few VW diesels runaway online after they started consuming the oil in the crankcase due to a failure of piston rings or a piston or whatever reason..
YouTube has dozens of diesel runaway videos,ranging from semi's to UPS trucks,so it isn't impossible for it to happen--just not likely..

The most frightening thing is your pretty much boned as far as stopping the engine in time,if your on a highway or city street..

Imagine sitting at a red light in drive,and your engine decides to floor itself,and you have no means of shutting it off !..:yikes:..
--pulling over,putting it in neutral will likely let it scatter rods,by the time your able to get the hood open and smother it somehow..that's if you hadn't just been T boned by going thru the intersection against the light or stop sign !..
 
Something I didn’t see mentioned was the throttle cable bracket. The HMMWV bracket is a different length than the civilian and CUCV bracket. It is taller which means the throttle will be open a good bit without touching anything. It won’t run away. But it will rev like crazy with no load on it.

If your friend had to turn the throttle shaft any to hook up the cable. Something is wrong. With the cable housing in the bracket. The cable end should just slip on with some slack.

Also, what about the 700R4 TPS cable? Is it pulling on the throttle shaft any?

I have a 6.5 GEP in my 2500 Suburban with the Banks kit. 4L80E though with 35’s and 3.73 gears. Awesome performance compared to my M1009 trucks. I think your friend will like the truck once the small stuff is figured out.
 
diesel4me said:
Hopefully not,but I've seen a few VW diesels runaway online after they started consuming the oil in the crankcase due to a failure of piston rings or a piston or whatever reason..
YouTube has dozens of diesel runaway videos,ranging from semi's to UPS trucks,so it isn't impossible for it to happen--just not likely..

The most frightening thing is your pretty much boned as far as stopping the engine in time,if your on a highway or city street..

Imagine sitting at a red light in drive,and your engine decides to floor itself,and you have no means of shutting it off !..:yikes:..
--pulling over,putting it in neutral will likely let it scatter rods,by the time your able to get the hood open and smother it somehow..that's if you hadn't just been T boned by going thru the intersection against the light or stop sign !..
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So you're saying that your youtube video searching is more experienced than my time working in the diesel industry, plus all the old timers I've worked and networked with in the diesel industry who have never seen or heard of a "sudden" runaway? Experienced a runaway but never a sudden "well drivin down the road and after a few hours the engine just decided to runaway on me."

diesel4me said:
I've seen a few VW diesels runaway online after they started consuming the oil in the crankcase due to a failure of piston rings or a piston or whatever reason..
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Without compression a diesel can't ignite any fuel. That is literally how they run, by compression ignition. Broken rings or a hole in the piston and that cylinder physically can't fire.

I get it you are not familiar with how diesels work but you are making shit up to "justify" it now. This "sudden" runaway possibility would be the first time it has happened since at least the development of the governor for the injection pump by Robert Bosch in the early 1900's.
 
I never stated the videos "prove" anything,I just stated I watched many of them..
I do happen to know how diesels run,though I admit I have not had any real experience with injector pumps or the injectors on the few I have owned..and it certainly is possible for an engine to continue running on the remaining cylinders if a piston got holed,and the compression getting into the crankcase and force blowby past the other pistons..
Does it happen often ?..NO...never said it did..what I did say is it IS "possible" ,and a scary scenario if it ever did happen..

I'm not "making shit up",and I don't know why you had to get so pissy in your reply..
I'm done with this thread--I'm not in a good mood and had better just clam up before I end up getting myself banned..:ignore:
 
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