Durability of 6spd mnl behind the dmax?

[rjfguitar]

Dad is looking at an '02 1 ton 4x4 dually CC long bed with the Dmax and 6 spd manual.
I know that the new Dmax's are detuned for the manual only.....is that the same box in an '02? Is this a reliable box that can handle heavy towing? In OD? How about if the dmax has a chip? I am not familiar with the new manuals in the chevs....thanks.

Originally posted in the deisel forum early this monring but need a response sooner, it's pop's question .

 

[zcarczar]

I've seen a few of them floating around at work, but never had one in for service that I know of. So I geuss they seem to hold up fine to stock trucks. Dont know about the modified trucks though.

 

[rjfguitar]

Thank you.

 

[tRustyK5]

I did a little research on the ZF S6 650 that comes behind the D-max and the 8.1 and it sure seems to be a pretty stout tranny. The same tranny is also used in the medium duty trucks if that tells you anything.

Con's are mostly that it is an all aluminum integral bell tranny. That would be a con for my intended purpose, not necessarily a con in any general sense of the word.

Lemme see if I can find some of the links I ran across that have rating numbers.

Edit: found it.

http://www.autoworld.com/news/gmc/zf_s6_650.htm

Rated for a GCW of 26,000 lbs which is 4000 lbs more than what the truck is rated for.

Rene

 

[rjfguitar]

THanks Rene, that link was perfect. I remember you talking about that tranny and thought of you while I was making the thread.

After reading that article I wouldn't be scared of that tranny. Dad is deciding if he wants to trade in his '98 C30 dually for the '02 Dmax dually.....the diesel war will be on if he decides to get it...

 

[tRustyK5]

Yeah, I'd still love to find a ZF for my Jimmy. I am convinced the closer ratios would be a big benefit to my 6.2. The 465 drops it down a little too low rpm wise now and then.

If I ever find one I can afford I'll just skidplate the hell out of it...

Ford has been using the same tranny for a couple years longer than GM now.

Rene

 

[84_Chevy_K10]

You have a Cummins and you're going to let your dad buy a D-max?

 

[ben427]

The problem isnt with the tranny itself, but with the 2 piece flywheel bolted to the duramax. I beleive their on their 4th redesign of the flywheel. I havent had any problems with mine as of yet. But some have had lots of trouble. I would say the truck has most likely been updated at one point in life. most origional ones dont last too long. they have a good ZF 650 forum here.

http://dieselplace.com/forum/index.php?

 

[rjfguitar]

You have a Cummins and you're going to let your dad buy a D-max?

I know I know..... He likes chevy though. He also loves IFS and thinks it is so much better than a strait axle. I'ts ok with me though, I'll get to show him how much better a cummins dodge is if he buys it.... Actually, I would almost prefer him to get the Chevy over a Dodge dually cummins because it will keep the variety around here....I have a Cummins dodge, dad has a Chevy Dmax, and Grandpa has a Ford Powerstroke. Besides, I plan on buying another '01-02 Dodge cummins HO 6 spd dually 4x4 myself for pulling cattle in a year or two.

 

[rjfguitar]

Yeah, I'd still love to find a ZF for my Jimmy. I am convinced the closer ratios would be a big benefit to my 6.2. The 465 drops it down a little too low rpm wise now and then.

If I ever find one I can afford I'll just skidplate the hell out of it...

Ford has been using the same tranny for a couple years longer than GM now.

Rene

Would it fit ok?

 

[rjfguitar]

The problem isnt with the tranny itself, but with the 2 piece flywheel bolted to the duramax. I beleive their on their 4th redesign of the flywheel. I havent had any problems with mine as of yet. But some have had lots of trouble. I would say the truck has most likely been updated at one point in life. most origional ones dont last too long. they have a good ZF 650 forum here.

http://dieselplace.com/forum/index.php?

Wow, thanks for the link, seems there are a lot of problems. Now I am nervous about that truck again...

 

[84_Chevy_K10]

I know I know..... He likes chevy though. He also loves IFS and thinks it is so much better than a strait axle. I'ts ok with me though, I'll get to show him how much better a cummins dodge is if he buys it.... Actually, I would almost prefer him to get the Chevy over a Dodge dually cummins because it will keep the variety around here....I have a Cummins dodge, dad has a Chevy Dmax, and Grandpa has a Ford Powerstroke. Besides, I plan on buying another '01-02 Dodge cummins HO 6 spd dually 4x4 myself for pulling cattle in a year or two.

Hilarious dude, hilarious.

Hope your dad loves his new truck. At least it's a 6 speed.

Amazingly I've never seen a Duramax truck with a 6 speed. I'm sure they're out there but I've never seen one.

 

[tRustyK5]

Will it fit? Pretty sure it'll bolt up, beyond that it's pretty straightforward I'd think. I know the 8.1 is a standard Chevy bell, so it should have the same bell pattern my 6.2 has.

Input should be a standard 1.125" 10 spline, but if it's not I'll have to swap in a 'correct' clutch disc. My only concern is the pilot size...if that is the same then it's gonna work.

I still think the hardest part will be finding one...then finding the money to pay for it. A man can dream though...right?

Rene

 

[84_Chevy_K10]

Dual mass flywheels are troublesome on everything. Unfortunately my new truck has one too.

 

[rjfguitar]

We will see if he gets it or not. For myself, after tonight I am completely sold on the dodge cummins drivetrain. I just got home from trying to get one of my dad's semis to start. It died 2 miles from the mechanic shop and he still had air pressure so I pulled him LOADED to the mechanic shop and actually managed 25 mph. He was 79,100 lbs gross. But, damn it was scary....

 

[Jonny-K5]

I know I know..... He likes chevy though. He also loves IFS and thinks it is so much better than a strait axle. I'ts ok with me though, I'll get to show him how much better a cummins dodge is if he buys it.... Actually, I would almost prefer him to get the Chevy over a Dodge dually cummins because it will keep the variety around here....I have a Cummins dodge, dad has a Chevy Dmax, and Grandpa has a Ford Powerstroke. Besides, I plan on buying another '01-02 Dodge cummins HO 6 spd dually 4x4 myself for pulling cattle in a year or two.

why the '01-02? my dad has a 99' and is a dedicated reader of TDR. he says the 03' is the primo year, since it gets the new upgraded motor, but 04' they threw a bunch of smog stuff on it. he researches dodge/cummins trucks to death. is there any reason to get an 01-02? besides the older bodystyle?

We will see if he gets it or not. For myself, after tonight I am completely sold on the dodge cummins drivetrain. I just got home from trying to get one of my dad's semis to start. It died 2 miles from the mechanic shop and he still had air pressure so I pulled him LOADED to the mechanic shop and actually managed 25 mph. He was 79,100 lbs gross. But, damn it was scary....

whoa thats quite a feat. were u in 2wd? do you have a tranny temp gauge?

 

[rjfguitar]

why the '01-02? my dad has a 99' and is a dedicated reader of TDR. he says the 03' is the primo year, since it gets the new upgraded motor, but 04' they threw a bunch of smog stuff on it. he researches dodge/cummins trucks to death. is there any reason to get an 01-02? besides the older bodystyle?

I see what he is saying about the 2003's. They did have the engine/fuel system upgrade but the power is almost identical to an '02, besides the HO that was only available with the auto or something. If you like the new body style I guess the '03 is fine but I know when I trade in my '01 I will be looking for an '04.5 to '06. The new 600 ft lbs rating sounds pretty good stock. Don't get me started on that "quieter" cummins crap though....

The .01'5 like mine is the best out of all the years IMHO, I learned this BEFORE I bought my truck which is why I bought a late '01. Reasons are....
1) The late 01's had disks, vs. the early 01's that still had drums.
2) the stock power numbers were increased by 20HP and 40 ftlbs in 2001.
3) THE BIG THING! The 2002's had most of the vanity interior parts removed for some reason. Dodge removed the passenger A-pillar handle, overhead trip computer, and went to a single piece axle design. That last bit probably sounds crazy to most but I like the CAD setup, I don't want my front axle always turning.
4) The new dodges are, for the most part, ugly.

I'll take a 2001.5 with disks and all the interior options over any other year, anyday.

whoa thats quite a feat. were u in 2wd? do you have a tranny temp gauge?

I was in 4lo, mainly because I needed the extra traction to pull him back on to the road and out of the dirt. Going down the road was easy, I actually backed off the throttle to keep from exceeding 25mph. Pulling into the mechanics gravel driveway with the 48ft spread axle trailer scrubbing hard was also fun. I was sliding all around in his driveway like the Mercades in "The Lost World" (Jurrassic Park).

No guages yet, my cummins dodge is completely stock besides the billet grille and intenna. I wasn't worried about the tranny, the truck is under warranty and am looking for an excuse to go with the ATS bombed 47RE anyway.

 

[Jonny-K5]

Don't get me started on that "quieter" cummins crap though....

what do you mean? dont you think they are quieter? thats pretty much the only thing my dad doesnt like about his, but he practically lives in it, drives 10-12 hrs a day in it giving bids and running crews. kinda wears on you after awhile. from what i've heard the upgraded fuel system is what does this.

also he said the turbo lag is less noticable with the new fuel system. he really hates that too. . we both dont really care for the new body style, tho its kinda growing on me. the older style is getting a little dated.