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Four link calculator numbers?
- Thread starter dangerdog
- Start date
Fail. Nothing showing.
Depends on your tire height and desired ride height. Shoot for close to zero or slightly neg for roll steer and anti squat about 80 most people are happy with. Numbers really don't mean anything until you lay it out and measure.
I will look when I get home. My tablet wont open the file.
That's tough depending on what you want to do for steering. Cross over with assist or full hydro?
I'm sure wade or Eric can answer that better than me. Are you 4 linking both front and rear in your build thread you said you are 3 linking the front. If so you need the 3 bar calculator.
IMHO, the whole purpose of designing a multi-link suspension in the first place is to improve the handling of the truck substantially.
The idea of using swaybars to band-aid a roll oversteer issue seems wrong to me..... spend some more time with the calculator and work the numbers until you can get a neutral (or slightly negative) roll axis.
The beauty of the calculator is that you can do this sort of experimentation quickly and easily and try dozens of layouts until you find one that works.
-G
Ok so what are the parameters for all of the other numbers. Yes I might have to make compromises somewhere.
You will DEFINITELY make compromises....
Every suspension design is a compromise, there is no way around it. Usually the limiting factor is where you can place the link mounts. They never seem to fit in the places you want them to for best overall performance.
Post up a screenshot of the calculator once you have numbers you like. That's usually how guys do it.... And it makes it easy for the rest of us to provide quick feedback.
No matter what, you will certainly end up with interferences you didn't expect once you build it and start cycling the suspension. I've spent more than 9 months messing around with the front 3-link on my truck until I finally got everything REALLY dialed-in with no interferences. It takes a LOT of time to get things right....
-G
You will DEFINITELY make compromises....
Every suspension design is a compromise, there is no way around it. Usually the limiting factor is where you can place the link mounts. They never seem to fit in the places you want them to for best overall performance.
Post up a screenshot of the calculator once you have numbers you like. That's usually how guys do it.... And it makes it easy for the rest of us to provide quick feedback.
No matter what, you will certainly end up with interferences you didn't expect once you build it and start cycling the suspension. I've spent more than 9 months messing around with the front 3-link on my truck until I finally got everything REALLY dialed-in with no interferences. It takes a LOT of time to get things right....
-G
What Greg said after all his name is on the credits for the calculator
Yep. All the calcs will need to be based on the frame positions. If I were to do it again, I would give ORD my credit card number. And by their 4 link kit.
wasted wages
1 ton status
OK.... someone fill me in on why all of these calculations have to be done over and over on 3 and 4 link setups ? 
I mean with as many rigs have been linked on this forum,,, isn't there a good set of measurements that "work" for a K5 blazer / truck /suburban
I guess I'm missing something.....seems that with as many trucks that have been converted on CK5... someone would have a good set of numbers for various frame / axle combo's.....
carry on....
I mean with as many rigs have been linked on this forum,,, isn't there a good set of measurements that "work" for a K5 blazer / truck /suburban
I guess I'm missing something.....seems that with as many trucks that have been converted on CK5... someone would have a good set of numbers for various frame / axle combo's.....
carry on....
OK.... someone fill me in on why all of these calculations have to be done over and over on 3 and 4 link setups ?
I mean with as many rigs have been linked on this forum,,, isn't there a good set of measurements that "work" for a K5 blazer / truck /suburban
I guess I'm missing something.....seems that with as many trucks that have been converted on CK5... someone would have a good set of numbers for various frame / axle combo's.....
carry on....
Because of doubler vs atlas vs single case. Big block,small block, Ls etc. Th350, 700, 4l80 etc. Clocked case etc. everyone's setup is different.
A guy going to links is a little off to begin with. Then give them some math to do, and they will sit down and design for hours. Most get confused. Some understand it.
I will level with everyone here. I did not use a calculator program to build my suspension. I built what fit. Used comon sense from what I had seen done before. Set the back up for no axle rotation. Upper link as high as possible. Then bought the biggest shocks available at the time.
I will level with everyone here. I did not use a calculator program to build my suspension. I built what fit. Used comon sense from what I had seen done before. Set the back up for no axle rotation. Upper link as high as possible. Then bought the biggest shocks available at the time.
The masses require numbers. Then and only then shall judgement be passed
OK.... someone fill me in on why all of these calculations have to be done over and over on 3 and 4 link setups ?
I mean with as many rigs have been linked on this forum,,, isn't there a good set of measurements that "work" for a K5 blazer / truck /suburban
I guess I'm missing something.....seems that with as many trucks that have been converted on CK5... someone would have a good set of numbers for various frame / axle combo's.....
carry on....
For every well-designed suspension that I've seen, it seems like there are many more on the internetz with some sort of flawed configuration. Heck, I've even seen some a couple stories on CK5 recently of "pro-built" and high-dollar link setups that we're done poorly and needed to be scrapped and rebuilt.
Ultimately, it's a huge financial step to take.... If you don't study the basics of suspension design, you won't know how to make your compromises to fit your truck and personal preferences. Maybe you get lucky and end up with something good....but the odds are heavily against you. Even if you decide to farm-out the job it never hurts to be well educated, so that you can speak intelligently with the builder about the build and where he plans to make the compromises.
"Engi-nerds" like me like to know how things work in painful amounts of detail.... And that was the motivation to write the calculator in the first place. I can appreciate that some guys hate that crap and would rather just build, test, rebuild, test, rebuild, test, rebuild, test, etc until the design works properly.
-G
For every well-designed suspension that I've seen, it seems like there are many more on the internetz with some sort of flawed configuration. Heck, I've even seen some a couple stories on CK5 recently of "pro-built" and high-dollar link setups that we're done poorly and needed to be scrapped and rebuilt.
Ultimately, it's a huge financial step to take.... If you don't study the basics of suspension design, you won't know how to make your compromises to fit your truck and personal preferences. Maybe you get lucky and end up with something good....but the odds are heavily against you. Even if you decide to farm-out the job it never hurts to be well educated, so that you can speak intelligently with the builder about the build and where he plans to make the compromises.
"Engi-nerds" like me like to know how things work in painful amounts of detail.... And that was the motivation to write the calculator in the first place. I can appreciate that some guys hate that crap and would rather just build, test, rebuild, test, rebuild, test, rebuild, test, etc until the design works properly.
-G
I like numbers
wasted wages
1 ton status
I totally agree, it's a huge financial step,,one of which is one of the reasons why I haven't linked the buggy yet...
The other reason is that I do read up on the info and it gets to the point of insanity with all of the opinions and tech babble, that a common joe gets lost in all of the design parameters. It just seems reasonable to me that as we do hit the nail on the head and come up with a good working design, that it could be measured and the components or measurements could be posted up for others with the info on their drivetrain etc....
At least it would get a guy in the ballpark right ???
I have been driving a linked rig for ten years, and around them for several years before that.
As far as why isn't there a set do this do that for a chevy truck, well there sort of is but's it's proprietary stuff by companies and they sell the product not the directions. Then you get into the one off weird stuff like Greg is doing and you throw the manual out and start over.
I can say this, I drove my buggy with the first link design for about 7 years and thought is was awesome, handled great etc. Then I started driving it faster than 55 on a regular basis (racing) and resisted greatly all the changes that Stephen wanted to make through the last five years. However each of those changes improved handling and made it work better.
In a nut shell: lower links parallel to the ground, upper links pointed slightly down towards the chassis, A bit of triangulation on the lowers if you're doing a three link and a total of 45 degrees of triangulation on the links if a 4 link. Shocks and springs as far outboard as possible, bump stops inline with shocks/springs and you will get close.
Roll understeer is good, over steer is bad.
Swaybars, when done right will aid a suspension not hurt it.
You will never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever design and build a perfect link suspension due to drive train and vehicle constraints.
about the 50th time you cycle the suspension you will just be figuring out what you need to do to cycle it the next 50 times.
When your done and you drive it the first time it's all worth it.
That's what I know about links.
As far as why isn't there a set do this do that for a chevy truck, well there sort of is but's it's proprietary stuff by companies and they sell the product not the directions. Then you get into the one off weird stuff like Greg is doing and you throw the manual out and start over.
I can say this, I drove my buggy with the first link design for about 7 years and thought is was awesome, handled great etc. Then I started driving it faster than 55 on a regular basis (racing) and resisted greatly all the changes that Stephen wanted to make through the last five years. However each of those changes improved handling and made it work better.
In a nut shell: lower links parallel to the ground, upper links pointed slightly down towards the chassis, A bit of triangulation on the lowers if you're doing a three link and a total of 45 degrees of triangulation on the links if a 4 link. Shocks and springs as far outboard as possible, bump stops inline with shocks/springs and you will get close.
Roll understeer is good, over steer is bad.
Swaybars, when done right will aid a suspension not hurt it.
You will never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever design and build a perfect link suspension due to drive train and vehicle constraints.
about the 50th time you cycle the suspension you will just be figuring out what you need to do to cycle it the next 50 times.
When your done and you drive it the first time it's all worth it.
That's what I know about links.
