Front Axle Saga... Just go 44 for now?

[elks]

So as many have seen I have been on the hunt for a dana 60. things aer rough and I can't actually find one for under $1200. I take that back I know where one is for $1000 but no info on the history. I already have a 14 bolt ff rear from a van. (I know they are wider) and am looking for a front axle. I am building the project with my high school shop students and funds are just tight for me. We have striped the old rig all the way and are currently doing the frame.

I need to decide on my axles and springs now as we are already to cut off perches etc for the move.

So I have 2 options... buy the 60 front for $1000 it has 4.10 gears as does my 14 bolts rear. Or I can get an 8 lug dana 44 front with same gears in really good shape compelte with warn hubs good rotors and calipers etc. The $600 difference could allow me to low max my transfer case to 4:1...

Then I could work on completing the rest of the rig and save up for a 60...

I just do not know what to do... A $1000 is a bunch of money to dump on an unbuilt axle. By the time I lock it, etc... I am several grand into just the front axle.

My build info: It is based on a 1984 CJ7 with an AMC 360 mild built runnning a TF 727 and dana 300... I am going spring over and rear stretch, and looking at running atleast 38" tires or a max 40"... I know that is a lot of tire, but at teh sametime I tend not to beat my stuff ll that hard. I am running stock jeep axles and 35s and never have had diff issues...

So which way would you go. Dana 60 for a $1000 unbuilt and knowing you wouldn't have the funds to build. Or a 44 8 lug for now and an extra $600 for the build?

 

[76zimmer]

If you can get a 44 ready to run the way you want it for 400 I'd go with it.
Your right about the 60, couple grand is easy to do.

 

[6.2Blazer]

If you stay D44 I sure wouldn't spend $400 on it, especially when you want a D60. Keep looking for a D60 and you will find one for a much better price. I spent a year casually looking before finding a complete running K30 for $750. A buddy of mine has bought and sold a bunch of D60's for the intent of making a profit over the years and I don't think ever paid more than $500 for one, and usually sells them for $700-$850.

Get a D44 or 10-bolt for $100 and bolt it in for now. Keep the spring perches in the stock location so when you do get a D60 it will bolt in with a new set of u-bolts.

 

[sweetk30]

i can say this i blew up 2 dana 44 axles with just 36" tires and 4.10 gears.

i went and got a bone stock dana 60 from a drw truck converted to srw hubs and only 3 thing i put on it was reman calipers and new pads. few years later i did a king pin reman kit for about 100 bucks minus new king pins.

that axle has been going strong now for 7-8 years. i play with 38" tires on it. dd use with 35" tires . it also does snow plow duty with a 8ft or 9ft fisher plow (as i have both) on it and those are heavy units.

a stock 60 will run circles around a 44 no problem.

the biggest down fall to a early 60 was 77-80ish had neck down inner axles . thay were weak. but just swap to newer 80-up non neck down and good to go.

if me wait for the 60 and be happy you did . as you get bigger brakes / wheel bearings / axles / gears.

 

[79rustyk10]

This is with a jeep too though, wouldnt a 44 hold up better under a rig so much lighter than a FS chevy pickup?

 

[jms]

Maybe it would be good to teach your students not just how to build a truck, but also about the economic realities of building a truck - and demonstrate to them that insisting on top hardware may preclude you/them from ever going out on a trail ride.
That's of course presuming that going out on the trail - as opposed to building a truck for the mere sake of building it - was the objective in the first place.
Maybe a 44 and 35/36" tires are the way to go, given the budgetary constraints.
You want to teach them how to be badass cool and too broke to afford gas, or teach them something that just may be useful for real life?

 

[76zimmer]

This is with a jeep too though, wouldnt a 44 hold up better under a rig so much lighter than a FS chevy pickup?

Thats what I based my comments on....a complete 44 w/ the right gears and locker, good brakes, ready to run...yeah I'd pay 400...heck an open 44 for free, to get it that shape would run 400 anyway.

 

[Bowtie85]

Cant see why a 44 wont hold up under a jeep.

Ive seen quite a few S10 bodied rigs with ten bolts and such runnin 35-8's and they seem to hold up. Weight plays a big part I think as well.

 

[elks]

Maybe it would be good to teach your students not just how to build a truck, but also about the economic realities of building a truck - and demonstrate to them that insisting on top hardware may preclude you/them from ever going out on a trail ride.
That's of course presuming that going out on the trail - as opposed to building a truck for the mere sake of building it - was the objective in the first place.
Maybe a 44 and 35/36" tires are the way to go, given the budgetary constraints.
You want to teach them how to be badass cool and too broke to afford gas, or teach them something that just may be useful for real life?

Really thanks for telling me how to do my job which I have been at for over 10 years. They have an understanding of budget restraints and they understand the situation. I have 2 decent rigs already. Both of which they have seen looked at and talked about the investment. This rig is supposed to go to the next level. As far as being a badass and broke it has nothing to do with it. I have bought the rig we are using for $800. We have sold parts off of it for over $600... We still have almost $500 in parts left to sell... So far I have secured a 14 bolt FF from a van for free. We traded some labor (hepled and older guy move). We helped one kids great uncle move on a Saturday. After that he sold us an AMC 360 and 727 tranny for $100. We are doing things on a tight budget not to have the biggest and baddest around. At any rate they are learning going through the whole ordeal with me. I talk with them daily on researching, finding parts, etc.

At any rate all my teaching aspects aside, I am still stuck trying to decide how to preceed. I wish my tax return stuff would hurry and show up. That will make a difference. Beyond the front axle all we really need that will cost us a chunk of change are the drive lines. I have almost everything else figured out. I have some 36" tires for now. Some factory steel rims for now, etc... Also realize that on the side everyday we have some up keep to do. Oil changes, tire rotations, battery swaps, head light replacements, valve cover gaskets, etc. So progress is slow.

 

[big dan]

I dont think the poster intended to take a shot at your teaching ability.

I took it as, if you dont have the budget to include the parts you want/need then build a rig that fits your budget.

If you are really wanting to take it to the next level and use 38-40" tires you really need a dana 60. Not saying that a dana 44 wont work, it just wont work very well.

Im running a dana 44 front with 37s, Im easy on the gas and with a stock 305 I break stock axles regularly. Im also not in a jeep but Ill bet Im not far off weight wise.

 

[paratrooper307]

The main thing is being honest about your intentions for the truck and working with the reality of what you can find. Everybody wants a D60, but its high cost, heavy weight, and reduced ground clearance really aren't necessary for most people unless you're planning on big tires, a heavyweight rig, or some serious off-roading.

$400 for a prepped D44 isn't a bad deal, and a set of chromoly shafts and some stout u-joints can address some of the strength issues if you want to upgrade. Of course at that point, you're at the cost of a D60. Decisions, decisions.

 

[76zimmer]

I know a couple guys that run Jeeps with 44 fronts and rears with 38's and a V-8 and don't really have a problem with them....of course its mostly sand stuff, but some mud, trails, not really rock climbing with them though.

 

[Dheater]

I wheeled a 1975 Bronco for 8- years with a 44, like others have said in the front end decide what you want your jeep to do. I built the 44, warn cromo shafts, ctm axle u-joints, reid outer knuckles, ARB, cross over steering with heims. Put 36 &38"" swamper's on it and wheeled some 6+ rated trials in Colorado and it was a daily driver.
Now on the flip side,
I replaced ball joints every other year along with the wheel bearings. When it was said and done, I should have went with a 60 in the front, with all the money I tossed at the 44, I would not have been that far off from a semi to built 60.

 

[Brady]

I ran a D44 up front for yrs.Only thing I really ever broke was a axle joint.That was when it was in a 73 bazer on 36's.Put that same axle and tires in a CJ-7 and never broke anything.You can ask Cody I am not easy on my crawlers.
I know where to get a complete running 84 3/4ton pick up for cheap.It runs but smokes.350/4-speed.Not sure on t-case.Should be 8 lug 10bolt front and Sf 14 bolt rear.Cody was wanting the 4speed out of it.

 

[jms]

Really thanks for telling me how to do my job....

You're welcome, but you understand that from now on I'll have to charge you for advice.

 

[72blazerguy]

So I have 2 options... buy the 60 front for $1000 it has 4.10 gears as does my 14 bolts rear.

Or I can get an 8 lug dana 44 front with same gears in really good shape compelte with warn hubs good rotors and calipers etc.

The $600 difference could allow me to low max my transfer case to 4:1...

Then I could work on completing the rest of the rig and save up for a 60...

I just do not know what to do... A $1000 is a bunch of money to dump on an unbuilt axle. By the time I lock it, etc... I am several grand into just the front axle.

Why don't you inspect the D60, if it's in good condition, run it as is. Then you have the axle and all you have to do is put a locker in later. If you buy the D44, don't you still have to put some type of locker in it?

Can you really LoMax your Tcase for 600?

 

[sweetk30]

also if you want a locker for a dana 60 lots of guys here run the lockright in the stock open diff and some even run 44" tires with no problems. you can get a lockright here the cheepest i have found http://www.alljeep.com/oscommerce/product_info.php?products_id=944

 

[chulisohombre]

the cj7 is a lightweight vehicle,even with the 360 in it.the 44 will last much longer there than under a blazer for sure.a 60 would last longer but if the 44 gets better axle shafts it will last as well.i wheeled mine on 35s for years with only 1 axle ujoint busted.if you are nice on it they will last.if it is kept open it will last longer as well.once a locker is put in a 44 the shafts and ring and pinion get boind up much wortse and dont take the abuse with big tires.if you can look ovet the 60 and everything looks tight,you can run it as is as be 100 percent sure you got the stronger axle.just run it and see if it needs anything.at the least anether 100 bucks or so will get the seals redone it would be a great learning experience to pull the axle apart and show the kids whats inside.

 

[Larry]

I’ve been running a D44 in the front of my '78 K10 for 17 years. About 7 years ago I added a TruTrac with 4:56 gears. The only problem I had was a broken axle shaft u-joint due to it running dry before the 4:56 gear and TruTrac install. The truck has a 2002 425 HP 8.1L and weights over 7,500 lbs with the camper on it, runs Q78x16 Super Swampers for local trips and 315/75/16 for all terrains for long distance trips. This truck gets used all over the back country of Colorado, Utah and Arizona. I would love to have a D60 as much as the next guy but I refuse to pay $1200 for a basket case axle that needs regeared ($500), traction devise (~$1000), single wheel adapters ($$$), king pins,…..the li$t goes on and on. Sometimes I think people read too many magazines and forums and come up with the idea everybody needs a D60 because D44's are so "weak". I guess it is all in driving technique and how careless one is with the loud pedal. I’ll keep wheeling my D44 until I really find a compelling reason to move to a D60 that justifies the cost, which I don’t see that happening anytime soon.

 

[tRustyK5]

I’ve been running a D44 in the front of my '78 K10 for 17 years. About 7 years ago I added a TruTrac with 4:56 gears. The only problem I had was a broken axle shaft u-joint due to it running dry before the 4:56 gear and TruTrac install. The truck has a 2002 425 HP 8.1L and weights over 7,500 lbs with the camper on it, runs Q78x16 Super Swampers for local trips and 315/75/16 for all terrains for long distance trips. This truck gets used all over the back country of Colorado, Utah and Arizona. I would love to have a D60 as much as the next guy but I refuse to pay $1200 for a basket case axle that needs regeared ($500), traction devise (~$1000), single wheel adapters ($$$), king pins,…..the li$t goes on and on. Sometimes I think people read too many magazines and forums and come up with the idea everybody needs a D60 because D44's are so "weak". I guess it is all in driving technique and how careless one is with the loud pedal. I’ll keep wheeling my D44 until I really find a compelling reason to move to a D60 that justifies the cost, which I don’t see that happening anytime soon.

It's got more to do with the type of wheeling/tire size/rig weight than anything else. Get your 7500 rig twisted up in the rocks a little, add some throttle and you'll be singing the "all hail the D60" song in short order.

Back country is pretty easy on parts.

I made a D44 last a long time too, on 36's and with some careful driving...that didn't make my D44 any stronger. I just wheeled within it's limits. Stepping up to a D60 allowed me to expand my horizons and worry a little less on the trail.

I bought a matched set D60/C14 with 4.56's. Gearing worked for me so no extra needed to re-gear. The C14 had the Detroit already so all I did was add rear discs. The D60 got new KP bushings/springs, and crossover. It's amazing how far you can get with an open front end and detroit rear and I didn't spend multiple thousands after the initial purchase.