Vombrown
Mountain Man
While I'm at it, which headers are working in our trucks? I'm seeing block huggers and the corvette headers in most of the stuff I'm reading. Gimme some input here.
CK5
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LS cams and computers
- Thread starter Vombrown
- Start date
TBSS manifolds are a usual choice that fit if you want to go with a stock manifold. I used LQ4 manifolds from a H2, but I don't think there is much difference on the stock truck manifolds. Keeping the LS in the stock SBC location (bellhousing mounting position for reference) will maximize the room for any type. Sliding the engine forward will cause interference since the frame pinches together the more forward you go.
TreeFarm
Internet fabricator.
ORD sells Advanced Adapters motor mounts that keep the engine in the factory place as well. With new body mount bushings the rear of the heads are really close to the firewall but just clear
Maybe what I meant could better be expressed in power/weight ratio.
If the power/weight ratio is low, low end torque matters a lot. If you can't get into the power range, the top end doesn't help. That's amplified by not having enough gears. Sure you can spin the engine fast with good top end power, then shift and it falls on it's face. The transmission gaps are either too big, or the torque produced is too little (either the transmission ratios fault or engine torque curve).
With my K30 in my avatar (12V Cummins), I consider it "underpowered" while towing. Not that I'm not happy with it, I love it, but ~450 diesel HP towing 14K combined isn't a rocket ship. It tows great with a 5 speed (not worth swapping to a 6 speed for my use) but I can fully appreciate why tractor trailers have so many gears. Same story, low power/weight so they make up for it with lots of gears to keep the engine at peak torque. Underpowered sounds weird for a turned up Cummins that I can tow my Blazer/buggy up anything but the I70 passes at 70 mph easily in 5th, but to me it needs the low end torque because 450hp @ 14K is low power/weight and only has 5 forward gears.
My Blazer/buggy is a different story, it's much lighter with a lot more horsepower. With the bigger cam (in a 6.0 w/317 heads), it trades low end torque, but it isn't even close to needing more low end. The power/weight is pretty good on that rig, the low end torque means next to nothing. Sure, the peak torque may have moved up, but as long as you have enough to get going everything else is gravy. I would say the point on that thing, is that as long as you have enough low end to keep that side happy, the higher end horsepower is a huge gain.
A 60's-80's GM 350 had what, 250 ft. lbs. of max torque? A stock 6.0L makes more than 300 ft. lbs. at any RPM that would be used, and more than that off idle, with double the horsepower.
If the power/weight ratio is low, low end torque matters a lot. If you can't get into the power range, the top end doesn't help. That's amplified by not having enough gears. Sure you can spin the engine fast with good top end power, then shift and it falls on it's face. The transmission gaps are either too big, or the torque produced is too little (either the transmission ratios fault or engine torque curve).
With my K30 in my avatar (12V Cummins), I consider it "underpowered" while towing. Not that I'm not happy with it, I love it, but ~450 diesel HP towing 14K combined isn't a rocket ship. It tows great with a 5 speed (not worth swapping to a 6 speed for my use) but I can fully appreciate why tractor trailers have so many gears. Same story, low power/weight so they make up for it with lots of gears to keep the engine at peak torque. Underpowered sounds weird for a turned up Cummins that I can tow my Blazer/buggy up anything but the I70 passes at 70 mph easily in 5th, but to me it needs the low end torque because 450hp @ 14K is low power/weight and only has 5 forward gears.
My Blazer/buggy is a different story, it's much lighter with a lot more horsepower. With the bigger cam (in a 6.0 w/317 heads), it trades low end torque, but it isn't even close to needing more low end. The power/weight is pretty good on that rig, the low end torque means next to nothing. Sure, the peak torque may have moved up, but as long as you have enough to get going everything else is gravy. I would say the point on that thing, is that as long as you have enough low end to keep that side happy, the higher end horsepower is a huge gain.
A 60's-80's GM 350 had what, 250 ft. lbs. of max torque? A stock 6.0L makes more than 300 ft. lbs. at any RPM that would be used, and more than that off idle, with double the horsepower.
I already linked that story in the second or third reply. The comp cams all did much better than any of the factory cams, and the smallest comp cam matched the LM7 for tq at 2500, but out powered it by 32 ft/lbs and 40 hp. The middle cam only lost 10 ft/lbs at 2500 rpm...but gained 80 ft/lbs and 99 hp peak. The largest comp cam tested lost 25 ft/lbs at 2500, but gained 105 ft/lbs and 130 hp. A 5.3 making 442 hp @ 6200 / 412 ft/lbs @ 5000 rpm is pretty impressive!
And if we’re comparing factory GM engines, yes most those older engines are turds, especially the TBI engines which suck ass.
And point on with the roller cams for certain, as well as the power to weight and gearing
A 6,000 pound vehicle in normal driving conditions spends most (90%?) of its time below 3k
Anyone run cam timings advanced and smaller heads on a 6.0L?
~400+ lb/ft from 1500-4500?
Didn't early 6.0L's have smaller heads?
Comp cams has plenty of cams that will simulate the old "RV cam" my old xr259 made great torque off idle.
http://www.compcams.com/Company/CC/cam-specs/Details.aspx?csid=1084&sb=2
http://www.compcams.com/Company/CC/cam-specs/Details.aspx?csid=1084&sb=2
From what I have been told swapping stock cams for another doesn't make a ton of hp or torque difference. If you are looking for numbers $400 or less will give you a lot.
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/hrdp-0909-gm-ls-engine-cam-test/
another LS cam shoot-out using a 6.0
another LS cam shoot-out using a 6.0
I see what you mean. Which explains why mine with 4.10's works the way it does. Still kicking myself for not sticking with the 4.56's that were in my 14b when I got it.
My LQ4 4l60e 4.56 gears and 35's launches pretty good and has had great power to do anything I want. Unfortunately I drive it more on the street then off-road and want more hp. Off-road I have never felt I needed more.
Vombrown
Mountain Man
So I'll throw this out there. I'm not looking to build a high HP truck, I just know I'm not up on the LS parts that are available and some of you guys are. It's starting to sound to me like the bottom end crane cam might be just the ticket. Intake wise, I have no idea. Most of the performance intakes look cool but honestly I don't care for the cost. I'll be sourcing something that was stock on something versus a performance intake I think. This relatively inexpensive engine swap is turning into a good way to loose a few thousand dollars.....and I still need to get a wiring harness and computer. LOL
454Sub
5/8 ton status
The stock LS truck intake outflows almost every other LS intake it just looks awful.
Not to mention swapping the intake with other intakes from GM can place the TB in the belt area.
It's not cost effective to even mess with the intake if your not running boost or a lot of HP.
Not to mention swapping the intake with other intakes from GM can place the TB in the belt area.
It's not cost effective to even mess with the intake if your not running boost or a lot of HP.
The TBSS intake can be found cheap. I got mine with fuel rails, throttle body and injectors for $100 off Facebook. Took about a year of searching though. The NNBS intake is the same thing and I believe you can find them on 2007 and up trucks. A flex fuel vehicle will come with 32lb injectors. You want those. You can also buy just the intake off rockauto for around $200, but then you have to source fuel rails, injectors etc.
Since you don’t have an intake or throttle body at all you’ll need to decide if you want to go DBW or DBC. If you find a TBSS intake most likely it’ll be DBW.
I’m doing pretty much what you are wanting.
LQ4 with the TBSS intake, LS6 springs and a cam.
Intake $100
Springs $70
Cam $389
It’s not as expensive as you think.
Cost of acquisition for the engine, gas pedal, exhaust, fans, hoses, engine .mounts, air intake, pinout and computer work all should be figured. Most guys I've talked to said they added $1000+ in miscellaneous stuff to get it running.
That is true for the whole swap, yes there are additional costs, but just for the engine mods he was asking about the cost isn’t too bad. Guess I assumed he had already decided on the swap.
